Aa777flyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (14 years 1 month 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 5171 times:
American Airlines is currently only operating 18 of the 30 717's it aquired when AA merged TWA into its fleet on 12/2/01. Now it looks as though AA has chosen to ground all remaining of the 717's by 2/1/02. This will result in the loss of approximately 200 more jobs. The 717 being incompatable with the rest of the AA fleet is the main reason. AA has also already grounded a number of the 757/767 (TWA) fleet as well.
Aa777flyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (14 years 1 month 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 4567 times:
True the 717 is more common with the 300 plus MD80 in fleet. But it is cheaper on a per aircraft basis to maintain a fleet of 75 F100 then just 30 717. This is due to parts inventories, MX costs, crew training costs etc....
CPDC10-30 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 4945 posts, RR: 21
Reply 5, posted (14 years 1 month 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 4543 times:
Are the aircraft leased or purchased? If they're leased it could be a ploy to renegiotiate the contract with more favourable terms to reflect the current market conditions. Otherwise, if the merger with Hawaiian/Aloha goes through I would see them as a client to replace the Aloha 732s and go all-717 on the island hopping fleet.
Vfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 4426 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (14 years 1 month 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 4443 times:
Compatibility / commonality has little to do with the fuselage heritage of the B717, which is probably the biggest "commonality" with AA MD80s. We are talking about the engines, cockpit-layout, cabin interior etc. - and I guess there is no commonality with regards to this at all, making the B717 an orphan in AA's fleet and 30 are just too small a number to keep them.
After mergers / take-overs, airlines have even disposed of aircraft which were exactly the same "type" they already had in their inventory, but had different specifications that made them unsuitable.
Aamd11 From UK - Wales, joined Nov 2001, 1067 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (14 years 1 month 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 4412 times:
True, many airlines including AATWA have disposed of the same aircraft.. AA dispoding of the TWA 757s cos they are PW, not RR like the AA ones...
The 767s are also PW, AA are GE, again more incompatability......
the airframe is basically the same, but businesses like AA dont give a monkeys about the airframe, training costs for future crews... maintainance on another type of engine (the main reason they are to get rid of TWA 75/67s...) and all that....
having that few a/c isnt worth it in such a big ailrline which also has 737-800s which are not too much bigger... they have too many types, and one of them had to go... and it was always to be the 717, instead of removing 200/300+ MD80s, or 100+ 738s or 75 F100s...
AKelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2197 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (14 years 1 month 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 4236 times:
I see from your profile that you work for AA. When is American going to make an annoucement regarding the 717?
It's just I've search all around the internet and have found nothing to substatiate your claim. I was also in St. Louis a couple of weeks ago and saw a number of 717s painted in the AA/TWA livery. Why would they do that if they were thinking of grounding them soon?
It's not that I don't believe you, but some additional proof would be nice!
Aa777flyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (14 years 1 month 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4164 times:
American plans to ground 717s, bump TWA workers, union says
By Cynthia Wilson – St. Louis Post-Dispatch – 1/4/02
American Airlines plans to ground its remaining 18 Boeing 717 jets - a move that would leave another 61 pilots and up to 191 flight attendants at TWA Airlines LLC out of work next month, according to the union representing pilots at TWA. Since the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, which severely depressed the airlines' passenger traffic, 229 pilots and 834 flight attendants at TWA have been furloughed or given notices. The upcoming furloughs, set to take effect Feb. 4, will be the result of fleet changes, said Capt. Glenn Stieneke, a spokesman for the TWA branch of the Air Line Pilots Association. Stieneke said ALPA learned of American's plans to ground the newest airplane type in TWA's fleet Thursday through a daily communications update the Allied Pilots Association, which represents American's pilots, sent to its members. A spokesman for American would say only that the airline is in the "final stages" of reaching a broad fleet plan with Boeing and would make an announcement when a deal is reached. The Boeing 717 is the newest aircraft type in TWA's fleet, having entered service in April 2000. Earlier, American took 12 Boeing 717s out of service.
LV From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 2020 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (14 years 1 month 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 3971 times:
Hum, DL is not Air Tran's worst nightmare, AA is. Grounding the fleet can't be good for airlines already operating the 717, less parts. Of course, if these birds get picked up by Aloha/Hawaiian, Impulse, Air Tran, Midwest Express and others, it might lead to future orders, saving the 717 program and the Long Beach plant.
After all, what were the chances of AA ordering any more 717s to begin with.
717fan From Switzerland, joined Nov 2001, 2017 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (14 years 1 month 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 3831 times:
I don't think that the grounding of AA's 717 fleet has much to do with future of the 717. Boeing is knowing quiet for a long time that AA won't go for the 717...that grounding is logical but sad for me...you'll see, the orders for the 717 will come in, not as much, but they will come...
Flying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4195 posts, RR: 33
Reply 22, posted (14 years 1 month 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 3811 times:
717fan, I think a bit different. The big problem for Boeing is now - assuming that AA will retire all B712 - that 30 really young (you could just say factory-fresh) B717 are on the second-hand market at lower prices than Boeing can demand for a new build. The few b717 operators will first take these aircraft until they will order new ones. 30 B717 equal to a production run of 20 months at a rate of 1.5 frames a month. This means a one- or even a one-a-half-year long thirst period for Boeing. Now the question is: is Boeing willing enough to bear the costs of such a small production rate? That there will be orders is no question - but will the ordered amount be big enough to keep the production?
CcrlR From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 2314 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (14 years 1 month 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 3764 times:
This is the same thing like Reno Air and AirCal. This is why American is like the monster airline. They want to get all the small airlines and later on take their planes out of their fleet. this is the same thing with American with Reno Air and AirCal.
"He was right, it is a screaming metal deathtrap!"-Cosmo (from the Fairly Oddparents)