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Using Reverse Thrust To Back Out Of Gate...  
User currently offlineSEA nw DC10 From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 491 posts, RR: 1
Posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4183 times:

I was at DTW a few days ago on a layover (5 hrs) in the new McNamara terminal....gorgeous terminal by the way...

I noticed that half of the planes, including mine, were backed out of the gate using their reverse thrusters...why is this? It was kinda cool!

SEA nw DC10


31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLH423 From Canada, joined Jul 1999, 6501 posts, RR: 54
Reply 1, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4091 times:

AA often does that here in Boston when they have an MD-80 parked at the end of their pier. I've often wondered this myself. I think it must just be because it lets the plane get out of the gate quicker (by not having to get towed out of the gate, then start its engines).

LH423



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User currently offlineLY744 From Canada, joined Feb 2001, 5536 posts, RR: 10
Reply 2, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4074 times:

What specific a/c did you see do this? I was under the impression that a/c with low-mounted engines (737, A320 etc.) do not usually do that to prevent objects from being ingested by the engine.

LY744.



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User currently offlineTrintocan From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2000, 3240 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4058 times:

LY744, that is true, mostly planes with rear-mounted engines like MD80 and 727 powerback. I have experienced powerbacks on AA and EA and they were always on rear-mounted engine planes.

Trintocan.



Hop to it, fly for life!
User currently offlineJustplanesmart From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 722 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4041 times:

I have also seen only 727 and DC-9 variants (including the MD-80) use powerback. It used to be common at SEA, but new noise regulations introduced in the early 90's put a stop to it. Obviously, it costs more in jet fuel, so there must be savings in other areas to justify its use.


"So many planes; so little time..."
User currently offlineDripstick From Canada, joined Dec 2001, 2364 posts, RR: 21
Reply 5, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 4003 times:

I think the main reason or purpose of powerbacks is lack of pushback tug/tractors at hub airports.

There are so many flights departing their respective gates at peaks periods that there is simply not enough ground support equipment to go around.

I've seen a B727 do it and boy is it loud!



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User currently offlineMirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7444 posts, RR: 62
Reply 6, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day ago) and read 3941 times:
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Sea nw dc10, by any chance, were any of those pushbacks made by NWA at DTW?


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User currently offlineBH346 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3265 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day ago) and read 3931 times:

No, they don't tend to be big operators of rear-mounted engine jets such as the DC-9  Insane
Isn't the McNamara Terminal only for NW, its partners, and British Airways?



Northwest Airlines - Some People Just Know How to Fly
User currently offlineAIR757200 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1579 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day ago) and read 3897 times:

I noticed NW planes (mostly DC-9s) powerback now from the new terminal. I don't think they ever did that at the Davey terminal (to congested?). I've been on a F100 (AA) where we powerbacked from the gate. Pretty cool I say!  Smile

The new terminal houses NW, CO, KL, and soon BA and LH.


User currently offlineSkyway1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 3868 times:

I have seen AA do this with their Fokker 100 flights out of Dayton. I heard they did that because the Worldwide Flight Service employees had problems with the pushback, but that could have been just a rumor.

Chris  Smile


User currently offlineFilejw From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 359 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 3852 times:

NWA powerbacks are to save money ,no mechanic or tug needed.Fuel costs are very small. We did powerback in the old terminal in the mid 80's untill the FAA put a stop to it.JW

User currently offlineIAHERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 677 posts, RR: 7
Reply 11, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 3848 times:

Continental up until the mid-1990's powerbacked on a regular basis. They even powerbacked the 737-100/200's due to the bucket type of thrust reversers. Now that was a noisy experience for passangers sitting behind the wing.


Actually flown: EMB-120 EMB-145 B717 B737 B757 B767
User currently offlineMirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7444 posts, RR: 62
Reply 12, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 3816 times:
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Hmmm, I'm flying NWA soon.

We'll be taking
Flt. 539 LGA-DTW on a DC-9
Flt. 440 DTW-MCO on a 72S
Flt. 441 MCO-DTW on 72S
Flt. 814 DTW-LGA on 757

Assuming that the equipment stays as is, what do you think are the chances of a powered push back on the first 3 legs?



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User currently offlineBlink182 From Azerbaijan, joined Oct 1999, 5482 posts, RR: 15
Reply 13, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3798 times:

I think it is mostly due to lack of pushback tugs at hub airports.
At DFW, I have seen AA MD-80s do it a countless number of times.

blink



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User currently offlineJETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 29
Reply 14, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3789 times:

Some airport policies dont allow power backs, and some airlines strictly prohibit the operation.

On the 727 you need to be carefull on powerbacks. In some rear CG loading situations if you hit the brakes too hard the nose gear will leave the ground.

JET


User currently offlineAlaskaairlines From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2054 posts, RR: 15
Reply 15, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3782 times:

They do that more on aircraft that have the engines sitting up high, like the MD-80 style, the 737's an on have there engines sitting low, so that can suck junk into the engine.

-Dmitry


User currently offlineSixStarAnsett From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3777 times:

You just have to do it with care, so the aircraft doesn't tip, and there has to be a correct balance between the clutch and the gearstick- otherwise have you ever seen a 727-277 do a frogleap?

How do you steer the aircraft while it is in reverse park this way?

SixStarAnsett


User currently offlineVapourTrails From Australia, joined Aug 2001, 1258 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 3762 times:
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See also..

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/tech_ops/read.main/4870/4/


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User currently offlineSwake From Belgium, joined Jan 2001, 231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3712 times:

not always a good idea...
reminder of the Air Florida 90 tragedy
http://www.airdisaster.com/special/special-af90.shtml


User currently offlineBrains From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 259 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3687 times:

BTW, there is a pic on a-net of an AirTran 717 using reverse thrust to back out of its gate at ATL.


Brains
User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29802 posts, RR: 58
Reply 20, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3680 times:

Markair took out a couple of windows one winter on the A concourse at ANC.

Their 737 picked up that much debries and took it out.



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User currently offlineMirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7444 posts, RR: 62
Reply 21, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 3624 times:
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Flt. 539 LGA-DTW on a DC-9
Flt. 440 DTW-MCO on a 72S
Flt. 441 MCO-DTW on 72S

Any idea is a pushback would be done from either LGA,DTW or MCO? THese are all on Northwest.

Thanks.



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User currently offlineSaxman66 From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 518 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 3605 times:

The only engines that have reverse thrust for backing out are low-bypass engines. These are the kind that are long and narrow, and on tail-mounted planes. You also see low-bypass engines on the 737-200. Likewise, the short-fat engines, are called high-bypass.


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User currently offlineDelta777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 658 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 3606 times:

AirTran does that @ CAK. very nice!

D E L T A 7 7 7


User currently offlineCALpilot From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 999 posts, RR: 14
Reply 24, posted (12 years 6 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 3555 times:

Sorry but Eastern did powerbacks with the B757, and Airtran is doing it with the B717, both High By-pass.

It works fine with both, the main factor against is the FOD issue.


25 Adam84 : I have seen AA do this quite a bit in DFW. I have also seen it done by a NW DC-9 in MSP. The one in MSP was not a pretty experience. It was hella loud
26 CaptainAD : i've been on a flight from SRQ to DTW on a NW DC9 and it used reverse thrust to push back from the gate...
27 Continental : I noticed in MSP that the DC-9s use their thrust reversers to back out. Continental
28 ZRH : I think you only can do that on airports where there is enough space because the pilots can't see where they are goeing. Here in Zurich I have never s
29 Mirrodie : Filejw, would you know or hazard a guess about the NW jets and airports I mentioned? Also, whose choice is it to do so? The pilot or otherwise? If it
30 N757tw : I think that ground crews would prefer powerbacks all the time, but the airline doesn't for a couple of reasons: 1.) Fuel, you have to start both engi
31 Thomacf : I noticed that almost all Airtran aircraft do it in Atlanta.
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