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Star Alliance Wants All Of T3 At Heathrow  
User currently offlinePlanenutz From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 1282 posts, RR: 10
Posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2366 times:

According the recent issue of Airliners magazine, Star Alliance is negotiating with the British Airports Authority to convert Heathrow's Terminal 3 into an exlcusively Star Alliance terminal once Terminal 5 is built.

BA would move to Terminal 5, and the other carriers at T3 would move to T4. Then T3 would be occupied by Star Alliance.

I know that Miami is going to open a dedicated Star Alliance concourse, as well I believe there is a dedicated Star Alliance check-in area at Frankfurt. Additionally, many Star Alliance carriers do reciprocal handling at various airports (United for Air Canada at many airports in USA, SAS for Varig at LHR, etc.). I'm wondering if this is the wave of the future. No longer will each airline have its own separate facilities, rather they will be shared among alliance partners. It seems like a good way to reduce costs and streamline processes, but at the same time airlines would be losing their identity (in my opinion).


Not all who wander are lost....
31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSingapore_Air From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 13735 posts, RR: 19
Reply 1, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2326 times:

Hmm. Interesting idea. Why not use Terminal 5? It's much nicer.

However, can it handle an A380? If so, I hope Virgin also moves in with Star to Terminal 3/4 even though they aren't part of it.



Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
User currently offlineMilesDependent From Australia, joined Sep 2001, 854 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2304 times:

T5 will be BA's territory. I would therefore assume QF and the other OW carriers will use T5. Nonstar/OW airlines will use T4, and Star will use T3.

I think Star should try and get their hands on T4, and leave T3 to the non-Star/OW airlines.

MD


User currently offlineGKirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24815 posts, RR: 56
Reply 3, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2257 times:

Yup, T5 will be BA and oneWorld territory, better terminals for better alliances  Big grin  Big thumbs up


When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
User currently offlineOH-LZA From Finland, joined Jun 2001, 1000 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2250 times:

Singapore_Air,

Virgin Atlantic already uses T3, saw their planes there when I went to Heathrow a month ago.

Alex



User currently offlineGo Canada! From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 2955 posts, RR: 11
Reply 5, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2239 times:

The Star alliance have commited themselves to a spending programme to update ternminal 3 into their own specialist terminal.

BA is the national carrier and much to some people's disgust get's first pick of where it wants to be located, it was stationed in terminal four so it makes sense to be stationed in terminal five.



It is amazing what can be accomplised when nobody takes the credit
User currently offlineB-HOP From Hong Kong, joined Nov 2000, 603 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2202 times:

than they have to spend a lot then, isn't it, I have seen a massive quene last saturday for check in and the place simply could not cope


Live life to max!!!
User currently offlineJAL From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 5078 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 2173 times:

I agree with GKirk, a superior terminal for a great alliance like OneWorld.


Work Hard But Play Harder
User currently offlineArsenal@LHR From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 7792 posts, RR: 20
Reply 8, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 2140 times:
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This is how it will possibly work out:

T3 - Star Alliance

T4 - Remaining carriers stay there

T2 - European short haul carriers not in an alliance

T1 - El Al/SAA and the current carriers stay there + plus non-alliance airlines

T5 - BA/One World carriers.

Arsenal@LHR



In Arsene we trust!!
User currently offlineSingapore_Air From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 13735 posts, RR: 19
Reply 9, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2113 times:

"T4 - Remaining carriers stay there" - A whole terminal for Air Malta and KLM? hehe

I think Oneworld should move into T5 and leave T4 for the Star Alliance.

Ideally IMO, Star should take Terminal 5.



Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
User currently offline747firstclass From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2106 times:

By the time T5 is up and running, it will be time to build T6.

User currently offlineStretch 8 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 2566 posts, RR: 17
Reply 11, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2094 times:

BTW, where actually is the new T5 to be located? On the same side of the field as T4?


Maggs swings, it's a drive deep to left! The Tigers are going to the World Series!!!
User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8868 posts, RR: 12
Reply 12, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2037 times:

Many things will have changed by the time T5 has opened. For example, we will finally see Delta, Continental, Northwest, and any other airline flying to London all flying into Heathrow. Where will they all go?

Honestly, I can see the following scenario playing out:

Delta, Air France, Alitalia, CSA, and Korean Air all move into Terminal 4, as they would need 8 gates at the most concurrently. KLM stays in T4, and Northwest and Continental come in. This would be another 6 gates or so. The rest of the gates go to the Air Malta (1), Kenya Airlines (1, and they are partners with NW/KL, so it makes sense to stay there) and Sri Lankan. The airlines in Terminal 3 would most likely be placed into Terminal 4 (selected long hauls), as well as Terminal 1 (since BA and BMI will have packed shop for T5 and T3 respectively).

As for the reason Star picking T3 over T4, I can think of two reasons. The first reason is gates, as there are 43 parking positions at T3, and only 29 at T4. Secondly, T4 is mostly intercontinental flights, while Star's operation at LHR is a lot of 737/A320 family (LH, BMI, Austrian). This could help account for it.

Jeff


User currently offlineHeinz From Germany, joined Feb 2000, 256 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2012 times:

How many gates will T5 have ?

User currently offlineContact Air From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 1154 posts, RR: 14
Reply 14, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 2007 times:

If Star Alliance moves completely into T 3 - does that also include BMI ? At the moment, BMI uses T 1 for its short-haul and inner-European flights together with BA's short-haul flights. As far as I know, T 3 is mainly used for intercontinental flights today (except SAS, for example). Will that change ?

User currently offlineN175dz From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2000, 274 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 2000 times:

Side question! - will BA's short haul and domestic ops. also move to T5, when up and running? Or will they stay in T1?

If these ops. were to move to T5 - that would surely cut transfer times right down?

cheers, Phil.


User currently offlineJapanguy From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 81 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1987 times:

A couple things:

1. BA "owns" T4 right now. You can bet that they will have a say about who is going to use it once they leave. It is doubtful that they would let UA and the Star Alliance instantly upgrade their LHR service without major expense. I don't see the Star Alliance moving to T4.

2. T1 is supposed to be (and basically is now) a "domestic" terminal for BA and BMI. That means all short hauls with minimal customs facilities (all EU airports). Possibly a few international carriers, to supplement T2, but I see T1 as an opportunity to expand short haul service for the British carriers.

3. What about the slots? How are CO, DL, and NW going to get the slots for all the new service to NA? Also, how do you convince the British government to allow more NA carriers to access LHR?

4. Living in the IAD area, I would MUCH prefer BA (and T4) to the UA (and gross T3) service. VS is great in the air, but you still hit T3 (and hope you have fastpass to get through customs!).


User currently offlineArsenal@LHR From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 7792 posts, RR: 20
Reply 17, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1972 times:
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T5 is being built to the west of T3, where the sewage works are currently located.




In Arsene we trust!!
User currently offlineTwaneedsnohelp From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 1921 times:

I think the original posters ideas of having affiliated airlines do each others ground handling, etc.. is a terrific idea, I'm surprised it hasn't been put more into use, although I suspect thats because union difficulties.

Ideally, Singapore Airlines shouldn't have any presence in say the UK (where their ground service is so horrid). That should all be serviced by BMI. SQ tickets should be booked by BMI people, BMI and SQ should share terminal space, marketting in newspaper, radio, and tv, etc... and for all the other airlines.

At JFK, the Star carriers are all over.
Terminal 1:
Austrian Airlines
Lufthansa
Singapore Airlines
Terminal 3
ANA
Terminal 4
Varig
Terminal 7
Air Canada
United

For the very least, ANA and Varig should move their few flights a day to T1 where LH or SQ can service them or T7 where UA could do it.

That would be smart.


User currently offlineAio86 From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 928 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 1883 times:

I think that the idea of combining them is great. I know the situation is a little more hectic, however I think it will be to their benefit and to the benefit of the airport if there will be less traffic of passengers between terminals.

When another airline does the ground work for another I think it is nice as long as they are getting something out of it. BMI shouldn't have to be checking everyone on Varig, Singapore, Thai, ANA and Asiana (do they even go to LHR?) If there are some reciprocal benefits then it is a good idea. Ie: United checks in ANA flights in SFO if ANA checks in United flights at KIX. Do you follow what I am saying. I don't think they should practice this just because they can.

In Rio de Janeiro, if I'm not mistaken, Varig, Lufthansa and United all operate out of the same terminal, which they use for both international and domestic flights. They share 3 lounges (2 varig, 1 united). I've never been there but I imagine they work well together.

Also, remember London already has a Star-Alliance ticket agency, they already have a big union in London.

-aio86


User currently offlineTwaneedsnohelp From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 1850 times:

aio86,

yeah of course the airlines would only cooperate if they "get something out of it" but thats why they joined the alliance. So if its not recipercal cooperation in another city then its financial compensation.

tnnh


User currently offlineCyprus-turkish From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 199 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (11 years 10 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 1806 times:

Why can't we see Virgin Atlantic in T5 like BA? Virgin and BMI has as much right over T5 as BA. Plus whoever says BA is the national airline does not know what he is talking about since Ba is a private corporation as any other airline.

Final Note: BA is not a national airline or a flag carrier


User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16228 posts, RR: 57
Reply 22, posted (11 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 1751 times:

Whoever uses whichever terminal is 2ndary to getting T5 built asap.

Apart from T4, LHR is a mess. I recently flew out of T3 and it was possibly the worst terminal I've seen in a long time.




Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (11 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 1737 times:

"LHR is a mess"......you said it......honestly, this country's planning "system" is crazy.

User currently offlineB-HXB From New Zealand, joined Jan 2001, 745 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (11 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1661 times:

Having CX move to T5 would be nice. T3 is possibly one of the worst terminals I've ever been through (except maybe Bangkok, which has 2 terminals in 1 building with no differentiation between terminals!!!)

Perhaps all American-bound flights could depart from one terminal so that any security issues the US government wants addressed could be.


25 Blink182 : Yyz- I couldn't agree more about T3. I was shocked when I exited the jetway and got my first glance at that terminal for the first time. As for T5, I
26 Aussiestu : Aio86 - Asiana OZ operates to LHR T4 at the present time. T5 is definitely going to be for BA. As it is to be built in stages then it will firstly be
27 Arsenal@LHR : Final Note: BA is not a national airline or a flag carrier So who is then? Arsenal@LHR
28 Singapore_Air : Virgin Atlantic Airways!
29 JU101 : Although i see the benefits of moving an entire airline alliance into one terminal, such as at London Heathrow, i do express one concern though. Will
30 Arsenal@LHR : Virgin Atlantic Airways! Nope, a few union jacks here and there doesn't make it the flag carrier. Arsenal@LHR
31 Englandair : Arsenal & Singapore, I aggree that BA isn't the national carrier of the UK- we don't have a single one. As far as I'm concerned we have 3 excellent na
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