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A.Net Users: No Better Than The Press  
User currently offlineMatt D From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 9502 posts, RR: 47
Posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 2079 times:

I have a question for all of you.

How many of you have Airliners.Net cued up on your computer and CNN (or whatever news you watch) on at the same time?

Do you just wait and salivate to be the first one to "break" a story that's airline related whenever it happens?

I've seen a lot of posts that usually have a caption of FLASH! PLANE CRASHES IN OHIO, or something to that extent.

Then the text of the message will usually read something like " just heard about a crash on channel 7. No details available.....

Then there is a great deal of guesswork and speculation as the story unfolds. As an example, when 9/11 happened, there were reports of everything from a Cessna 172 to a 777. USAirways....AirTran....AirCal were named as the parties involved. No one seemed to know the facts. Yet that didn't stop all of you from speculating and throwing in your two cents. You all are just as bad as the reporters that flock to the scene of a crash and do all of that "live remote" second guessing in an effort to announce why the plane crashed no later than 11PM.

Yet you are the same people that hand CNN's ass to them on a silver platter when they show a DC-10 and claim it was an Airbus or something like that. You all laugh and ridicule them for "not getting their facts straight" or "not knowing what they are reporting".

And at the same time, way too many of you do the EXACT SAME THING.


So in the future, you think maybe we can wait until the facts are known? This is not a journalism class with an ongoing race to see who can break the news first-with factual truth being second priority.


Or else keep your mouth shut (or more specifically, your fingers off the keyboard) the next time FOX News shows a file clip of a "United MD-80".

Thank you for your time.





35 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineGo Canada! From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 2955 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 2028 times:

every member always thinks their right...they will always post regarding major news stories whether they know the facts or not.


It is amazing what can be accomplised when nobody takes the credit
User currently offlineMatt D From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 9502 posts, RR: 47
Reply 2, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 2016 times:

geez.....five minutes and a one star rating...


Did I strike a raw nerve and hit a little too close to home for some of you?  Big grin


User currently offlineArsenal@LHR From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 7792 posts, RR: 20
Reply 3, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 2012 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I get my news from the BBC, not CNN.



In Arsene we trust!!
User currently offlineBrons2 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3007 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 2008 times:

What is so wrong with trying to start a discussion based on current events? If I had not seen anything on a.net about the German crash, even though details were sketchy, I might not have known about it for another 24-36 hours.


Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
User currently offlineGo Canada! From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 2955 posts, RR: 11
Reply 5, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 2005 times:

any minute you will get someone saying "if you dont like airliners why dont you leave?"


It is amazing what can be accomplised when nobody takes the credit
User currently offlineDoug_Or From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3401 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 1983 times:

I think you hit a raw nerve... with a sledge hammer. I just love it when the kids make fun of someone for not knowing something.... and end up being wrong. Its one thing for a newperson who knows nothing about aviation to get something he/she should have researched wrong, its entirely diffrent for a self proclaimed aviation expert (who unlike the reporter has no obligation to say anytihng), to go out of their wat to lambast aomeone for incorrect informaiton, then be wrong themselves. It used used to crack me up. now its just annoying.


When in doubt, one B pump off
User currently offlineBrons2 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3007 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 1976 times:

If you don't like Airliners, why don't you leave  Big grin Big grin


Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
User currently offlineFrequentFlyKid From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1206 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 1966 times:

Matt D, I agree with the premise of what you said 100%. However, I will say this: the user's of Airliners.net and CNN (BCC, FOX, ABC, NBC, whoever and so on) are two different types of people (for lack of a better word). Airliners.net user's have no obligation to be accurate and "report" things only when they have all the facts. The news media, however, does, in my opinion, have that obligation. An obligation to make sure what they are reporting (to millions of people worldwide) is, to the best of their knowledge, truthful and not just speculation.

User currently offlineMatt D From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 9502 posts, RR: 47
Reply 9, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 1950 times:

I have absolutely no problem with anyone trying to start a topic based on current events. Hell I've done that many times myself.

The questions I have are as follows:

1. Do some of you make a conscientious effort to be the "first" to break a story?

2. Why do so many of you try and second guess or speculate on something when the facts are not yet known?

3. Why do you criticize the press for doing the same thing?

I really want to focus on questions 1 and 3. The first is fairly obvious. But the unspoken question of number three is that what makes all of you so qualified to report "news" that you really don't know anything about? Does your ability to discern a 717 from an MD-87 or the ability to name 500 airport codes somehow make YOU-more often than not-high school teenagers- more qualified than the multi billion dollar news agencies (BBC, CNBC....Whatever!) and the journalists in their 30's and 40's who have the news reporting experience and the journalism degrees, even though you are both in the same boat of confusion?


User currently offlineFrequentFlyKid From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1206 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (12 years 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 1924 times:

Okay Matt, I agreed with you up until the comment on teenagers. Why do we have to go through this all the time. I don't want to get into this again, but why is there such a bad sentiment towards teenagers here? I don't get it.

User currently offlineIlyushin96M From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 2609 posts, RR: 12
Reply 11, posted (12 years 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1917 times:

I think this is a pretty good topic, actually. I'm sick and tired of people on this site spouting mindless crap with no facts to back up what they say.

Unfortunately, there will always be some moronic yahoo screaming that he/she won't fly certain types of planes because they are either unsafe (again, no facts to back this up) or just because they look funny. It's always been my opinion that stupid people should keep their mouths shut...yet they are always the ones who are first to give their opinions. Wouldn't it be great if there was a karmatic backhand across the face every time that happened?  Big grin That would look pretty funny...imagine the stunned reporters rubbing their smarting faces. LOL!


User currently offlineMatt D From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 9502 posts, RR: 47
Reply 12, posted (12 years 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1912 times:

I don't have any beefs with teenagers per se. As hard as it may be to believe, I was one once too.

But let's face facts here. The overwhelming majority of users here are, in fact, teenagers. And they do what I mentioned. I'm not saying that second guessing is all inclusive to teenagers only. But I certainly do maintain the position that they, collectively, as a group, take far more credit than is deserved. Are there smart teens and dumb adults?

Of course there are.

But I am talking the norms, not the glowing exceptions.


User currently offlineBackfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (12 years 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1903 times:

Matt D

Just a small courtesy point (and I appreciate that you've not quite insulted every journalist who's ever lived) but could you please be a little more careful when referring to the press?

"Journalist" isn't a by-word for "guttersnipe". You appear to be bunching the professional aviation reporters in with the likes of the less-informed members of CNN and BBC (and the A.net users you're condemning).

Most aviation reporters have a healthy respect for the subject, and do their damndest to avoid jumping to conclusions. Journalism is a skilled profession which is often slagged off by naive individuals who think that they know all about it.

Turn your forum title around to read: "The Press - no better than A.net users"

Doesn't sound as comfortable now, does it? Yet it's arguably just as true.

Please can you make sure you don't tar all journalists with the same brush, even if a fair number of them ARE idiots. Many informative discussions on the Internet are made possible through professional news reports and the talented journalists in the world deserve to be commended for their work, not insulted.


User currently offlineFrequentFlyKid From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1206 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (12 years 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1902 times:

Agreed. I just can't until March when I officially am no longer a teenager and automatically move to a new, higher standing here at Airliners.net.  Big grin

User currently offlineArsenal@LHR From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 7792 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (12 years 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1896 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I'll answer your 3 questions:

1. Do some of you make a conscientious effort to be the "first" to break a story?

A plane crash is a big and shocking event, and as we're aviation fans, it makes us want to inform our fellow enthusiasts as quickly as possible. This is why you will see several thread starters on a breaking news, everyone wants to report it because it's big news.

2. Why do so many of you try and second guess or speculate on something when the facts are not yet known?

This is only human nature, when a plane crashes, people will want to speculate the cause, why it happened, how it happened, where it happened etc. Guessing is the norm, everyone does it at some point in various situations. People are curious, they want answers. If a.net users didn't speculate or guess, then what would we discuss?

Why do you criticize the press for doing the same thing?

Because they are highly paid professionals who should get their facts right, most of us on a.net are not professionals, we're amateurs.

Arsenal@LHR



In Arsene we trust!!
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (12 years 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1841 times:

>>>>>>Why do you criticize the press for doing the same thing?

>>>Because they are highly paid professionals who should get their facts right, most of us on a.net are not professionals, we're amateurs.

While this is a reasonable statement, it doesn't take one critical item into consideration.....

Time.

Back in during the summer of 1996, I was driving crosstown one evening, and news hit the radio that TWA 800 had gone down off Long Island. After about :30 seconds, I clicked the radio off. When I got to my destination (in-laws home) about 20 minutes later, everyone was around the teevee watching CNN. I glanced at it on the way in, but didn't pay much attention to it. When my mother-in-law asked me why I wasn't watching, I explained to her the :30 seconds of radio news I'd listen to on the way over. Specifically, I told her that the only absolute things that were known for sure at this point were:

1/ A 747 is down off Long Island
2/ It was TWA 800
3/ Wreckage is burning on the water.

Other than the :30 seconds it took to hear that on the radio on the way over, NOBODY had had any further info, least of all, authoritative info, to offer. That kind of info evolves over several days post-accident. Yet, thousands of folks were glued to the teevee, watching the wreckage burn, and listening to the teevee folks to yak/speculate in order to fill-up all the airtime. Of course, folks take that yak/speculation all that much more seriously, since "they saw it reported on the TV news..." etc.

I'm fully supportive of a free press, and their duty to inform, but sometimes the events that they're covering don't lend themselves to fitting in with the media's timelines and deadlines. Not wanting to listen to the babble, I exercise my right to click the "off" switch.

Just my 2 cents....



User currently offlineXray From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2002, 138 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (12 years 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1819 times:

this would be a dull forum if only cold hard facts were allowed, there's always room for speculation and debate.

User currently offlineArsenal@LHR From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 7792 posts, RR: 20
Reply 18, posted (12 years 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 1793 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Exactly xray, speculation,debate and theory are what makes this site interesting.



In Arsene we trust!!
User currently offlineSingapore_Air From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2000, 13738 posts, RR: 19
Reply 19, posted (12 years 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 1787 times:

Though I respect your opinion MattD, do you view such posts with the intent to learn or to be disgusted?  Laugh out loud


Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
User currently offlineFlyboy36y From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3039 posts, RR: 7
Reply 20, posted (12 years 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1699 times:

THe roblem is this. We get our news from CNN and BBC and as the public we expect them to be reliable. On a.net you have to take everything with a grain of salt. The reason they are worse is that they are the pros.... more should be expected of them.

User currently offlineSk945 From Sweden, joined May 2002, 432 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (12 years 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1676 times:

I guess the easiest way to get around this is just to question everything you either read here at a.net and see on the TV. CNN aint the most reliable source for news. They are so fast that they change the info every minute and here at a.net everyone is free to say what ever they feel like. So, just question everything you here and read.

User currently offlineBritair From United Kingdom, joined Aug 1999, 933 posts, RR: 16
Reply 22, posted (12 years 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1646 times:

I think everyone has a right to his or her opinion.....how are we supposed to learn or interact with each other without discussion. I am all for posting what you want when you want. Just accept the concequences. There is too many angry posts here. Some of the best and longest threads have come from ambiguous statements and breaking news type posts. Who is to say what is right and wrong. I for one enjoy getting different points of view....regardless of the posters age. I wish I was a teenager again!!  Smile You guys are very welcome as far as I can say, besides, what relevance is age if the point you make sparks a great discussion.

Let's not get into censorship. History shows where that leads.

 Smile Happy chatting one and all.





User currently onlineSESGDL From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3466 posts, RR: 10
Reply 23, posted (12 years 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1637 times:

Matt D,

You're sad! What a wasted EXCUSE for a topic, why don't you go get a life and think about stuff that's actually say......IMPORTANT!

Jeremy


User currently offlineBraniff727 From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 686 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (12 years 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 1628 times:

I agree that there are a lot of frivolous posts on here, but as many have pointed out, a crash is a major event.

I would like to point out a specific event that had it not been for A.net, I would not have known about until I left work. 9/11.

I sat here at my desk, and the only way I could get information was from this very forum. Non of the news sites were available.

Had it not been for people posting, I would have had no clue what was going on.

I guess Matt you just have to deal with it. This isn't a newspaper, or a news channel. This is a website for people that really like planes. No one is required to have gone to school and have a degree in Aeronautical engineering to be able to post a question, breaking news or their opinion here. If it was a requirement, this would be an extremely boring site, and I'm sure nearly all of us would have surfed on out a long time ago.



Climbing
25 Dazed767 : I agree with Braniff727 110%, I was at school and had an hour break between classes, I saw what was happening on TV. I couldn't hear because of so man
26 Thumper : Have to agree with you on all the experts! As far as teenagers go most of them are pretty bright,just lack a little experience and then there are thos
27 Hkgspotter1 : Matt, After 9/11 I thought you said you will never use this site again ??
28 BNE : Username: OPNLguy I agree with OPNLguy, I hate all the speculation that goes along with big accidents. I like to hear the news but I hate Current Affa
29 Backfire : Being first is completely irrelevant if you're not accurate. That was demonstrated during the US presidential election when the main networks broke in
30 Post contains images Matt D : If we wait til the facts are known, that could be 5-6 hours later! Good Lord. What does that have to do with anything? If you are tied up in school an
31 Qantas777 : Someone has a weed up their ass.
32 Post contains images Jgore : Hey!!!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!!??!?!?!?! My post was deleted ????!?!?!?!?!?!? What's been up ?? jgore
33 Post contains images Jgore : Sorry, i got confused about nother thread. jgore
34 Post contains images Jgore : Sorry, i got confused about another thread. jgore
35 Post contains images Pe@rson : Would anyone like some fries and a beer?
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