747-600X From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 2820 posts, RR: 13 Posted (13 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 1838 times:
I have read several articles now on Orbitz, the on-line multi-airline ticket sales organization, and cannot figure out just what it is that someone thinks they're doing wrong. If a bunch of airlines want to get together and create special fares only available through that Organization, why on Earth can't they? Even if it's bad for the economy, they still have a right to do it don't they? Just what kind of a law is it that says you can't sell things for cheaper than they normally would be through a promotional enterprise, i.e. Orbitz? It's called a "sale" for heaven's sake! So they all decide to have it at once and through the same medium, what better way to save travelers money? I used Orbitz to find tickets to Seattle this August - round trip $198, leaving at 4pm. I then checked low-fare airline Southwest and round trip was $592!!!
DCA-ROCguy From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 4595 posts, RR: 32
Reply 2, posted (13 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1803 times:
It's called collusion. When five of the six Cartel-network airlines, who all have high CASM's, get together to fund a giant web ticket site, that's not about offering consumers cheap fares. It's about offering enough cheap fares in one place to lure people away from lower-CASM, low fare carriers.
Orbitz is an obvious attempt to destroy competition using a market advantage--the extremely deep pockets of the Cartel--to manipulate the market. That just might run afoul of antitrust laws. Congress ought to go over Orbitz with a fine tooth comb. Orbitz' flacks can put out all the crocodile-tears press releases they want.
Yeah, sometimes you'll find a cheaper fare on the Cartel than on Southwest. On some days, WN sells out its cheapest seats before the Cartel decides on Wednesday which seats to dump over the weekend. Big deal. If Southwest didn't exist, airfares in this country would cost billions upon billions more. All those good deals on Orbitz would dry up like rainfall on the DFW prairie.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be working, as the finances of the airlines this year make clear. WN is still flying high, and the high-CASM Cartel is still struggling.
Need a new airline paint scheme? Better call Saul! (Bass that is)
Cloudy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (13 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1799 times:
Trouble with the cartel is, they don't have deep pockets anymore (except for OURS through good ole Uncle Sam).
They have squandered their money on fights with each other, low CASM carriers, and the unions. Most of these fights were for ego-gratification and not for profit.
Many at the cartel carriers believe that no one can earn real profits in the competitive marketplace, in fact they hate the very idea. Most cartel management gained its experience before deregulation. They think you need a monopoly or near-monopoly in order to do well. So they try to drive their competitors out of markets or even run them out of business, even if it costs millions. They structure their competitive routes not to make money, but to support their monopoly routes. To them, market share was more important than the stockholders, the workers, or the customer. This strategy did buy them some time, but now their is no more time and little money to buy any more. In fact, Southwest and even, to some extent, Airtran and Frontier - are more healthy than their cartel competitors. This turn of events is common in deregulated industries- it takes a LONG time for managers of a protected industry to really learn how to compete profitably in the long term.
That being said, I think Orbitz is only partially a "dirty trick". It is mainly an attempt by the cartel to correct the mistake it made by failing to get on the web early and realize its potential the way Southwest has. This is legitimate, but it wont save them as much in cost as Southwest does when people book on WN's own site. Even some cartel carriers are now undermining Orbitz by offering discounts for tickets on purchased on their websites, by channeling excess inventory through third parties like expedia and priceline, and offering special deals that can only be purchased on airline websites.
JmhLUV2fly From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 559 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (13 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1780 times:
Im not trying to put down Orbitz, but several of our AirTran passengers have had problems with Orbitz and the way they make reservations.
Example; one passenger arrived at the counter ready to check in, he had coupons in hand that were issued by Orbitz, he flew to PNS on NW and was returning home on FL, I proceeded to attempt to check him in, his name was not anywhere to be found in our database, I could not check him, it took several hours to get the issue resolved.
A family of five arrive at the ticket counter ready to check in and return home after a couple weeks of fun in sun on the Gulf Coast, they had all five coupons in hand...however there was one problem....they were not manifested for the particulair flight they were checking in for, Orbitz had placed them on the 6:30am flight and didnt tell them, we ultimately put them on the next flight because the one they were checking in for was over sold, but it was a fair inconvenience for the passengers, and an unwelcome way to end a vacation.....all in all, personally, I would seek other ways to make a reservation with an airline....perhaps these were isolated orccurances and Orbits does provide fair service.
JmhLUV2fly From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 559 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (13 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 1708 times:
Well, essentially the passenger in a nutshell gets screwed because they payed the travel agent for a reservation and then the travel agent turns around and doesnt put the reservation in the system, happens quite often, when this does happend, there is little we as AirTran can do, in addition there is cause for legal action in this case because the travel agent didnt complete the contract, you paid him or her to book your travel arrangements, they take your money and said..see ya....your left strandid in an airport....personally, I would call the airline or make resrervations directly, it may cost slightly more, but to me I would rather rest at night knowing my reservations are set.
Thats just the way I would do it anyway...
Drewwright From United States of America, joined May 2001, 621 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (13 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 1698 times:
Orbitz is great for the following reasons,
1. The fares are usually cheaper than most airlines, especially in markets where SW does not serve.
2. You get a booking on a large air carrier with your choice of connections.
3. When booking you can add frequent flyer miles through the major carriers.
4. Orbitz is very careful in making sure you recieve all of the information on your flight, including delays. Orbitz sent me a Email on my phone on a trip through O'hare to tell me of a gate change, it saved me a long walk on a tight connection.
5.You get free gifts from Orbitz, I got a Zagat resort guide free of charge just for booking!
P.S. It is a good Idea regardless of how you buy your ticket, to check with the airline 24 hours before your flight to confirm your reservation
Lowfareair From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (13 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1645 times:
Didn't I hear that Orbitz has lost something in the realm of $125 million so far?
747-600X: Orbitz is being anticompetitive. They offer Orbitz-only fares from their owners, which in my mind is just trying to shut the other travel sites down. It would be the same as having Sony take a 20% stake in Toys R Us and then announcing that PS3 will initially be available for $399 in most stores but $349 at Toys R Us, and all games will be $10 cheaper. Walmart/Target, etc. would have a fit about that, and so would the DOJ.
Doug_Or From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3495 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (13 years 2 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 1633 times:
on te below trips Orbitz always showed a higher price then travelocity-
PDX-SFO (also tried OAk and SJC) (AS was even lower than travelocity)
IND-SFO (also tried OAk and SJC)
the only time I have EVER gotten a lower fare was when looking at prices from PDX-. LON, and while it showed a flight, I was unable to book the return, as the flights it showed were no longer availble a that price.