Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Why Is Boston So Limited On International Flights?  
User currently offlineCopacabana From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2772 times:

All international flights out of Boston go either to Canada or Europe. Not even a Mexico flight? Boston has a big population, but that doesn´t count over non-us flights. BTW, in Europe BOS has flights to LHR, CDG, FRA, MUC, ZRH, MXP, BRU, DUB and AMS. So waht´s the problem with BOS?

19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSeiple From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2748 times:

1.) Little demand.
2.) Easy ability to feed what demand there is for such flights via connections in MIA/DFW/IAH/JFK/EWR.


User currently offlineKLMBlue From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 267 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2750 times:

Don't forget about KEF from Icelandair!! It puzzles me that we don't have more internaitonal flights. we were supposed to get one to NRT. we had one to ICN, but it was cancelled.
-brian


User currently offlineMarkboston From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 74 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2735 times:

Boston also has flights to Jamaica, Bermuda and Costa Rica. It would be nice to have some Asian flights-- perhaps when the economy picks up we'll get a flight to NRT.


User currently offlineReggaebird From Jamaica, joined Nov 1999, 1176 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2730 times:


As recently as 2001, BOS had service to Seoul on Korean Air via JFK. They sent a 747-400 here 5X/week. American also plans to start BOS-NRT (Tokyo) service at some time in the future. VARIG is also interested in starting service to Boston.

It should also be noted that BOS has a large regularly scheduled charter line-up to many places in the Caribbean, Mexico and Central America.


User currently offlineOlympicATH From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2001, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2693 times:

And Olympic Airways stopped its ATH-BOS route last year due to low demand...

User currently offlineUsairways85 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 3372 posts, RR: 7
Reply 6, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2664 times:

man, you should be happy with the international service bos does have. Here at phl all we have is usairways, 2x BA, AF, and LH. Thats it.

User currently offlineSAS23 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 2608 times:

Another major problem is that MASSPORT is restricting new operators due to slot constraints. A good alternative to BOS is PSM - Pease/Portsmouth. I have driven from there to downtown Boston in less time than it takes to get from Logan at rush-hour!  Big grin

User currently offlineRai From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2576 times:

Boston has plenty of international flights, especially to Europe. LH, AZ, BA, VS, AF, UA, and UA all have flights from Boston to various European cities. TP and OA used to fly into BOS. That ain't half bad. There are no direct flights to Asia because Boston doesn't have that big of an Asian population (at least not compared to NYC, LA and SF). The same with flights to Latin America, not many hispanics. Though I was surprised to find out recently that Boston (or NYC, their numbers are pretty close) may have the largest Brazilian population outside Brazil. It numbers somewhere between 150,000-250,000. Varig is looking into a flight between Brazil and Boston.

SAS23: BOS does not have slot restrictions. If there is trouble driving there from downtown, it's because of the "Big Dig". Otherwise, you can take the T.


User currently offlineDellatorre From Brazil, joined May 2000, 1088 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2558 times:

At this time RG it´s not even considering Boston. They are having some problems with competetion domestically and as far as I know no services to Boston are expected for this year or later. RG is concentrating on their current international routes....



User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 6311 posts, RR: 17
Reply 10, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2555 times:

Didn't Northwest have a hub at Boston which included several European flights?


Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 11, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2557 times:

I think that BOS's lack of Latin American flights is simply geography.....located in the NE corner of the US, airlines simply route pax through their hubs; finally, service between BOS and Carib destinations is being developed, maybe a South American service will follow. BN at one time tried to introduce South American service to BOS, on a flight that travelled via JFK or IAD, but that was so long ago, it only operated 3 times per week with a DC8-62 that made many stops enroute.

In general, international service in and out of BOS suffers due to its close location to NYC....being only 200 miles away, some airlines ignore the potential of BOS or simply fly pax down to JFK to connect. Hopefully that will change. Note that BOS's strong European service is due to the interest of the European carriers......US airlines have only a few flights from BOS to Europe. NW, BN and others tried out of BOS.......the most recent attempt was this year by DL with BOS-LGW flights which were cancelled as of 01 June.

Are US carriers too interested in their hubs and neglect other potential routes such as international service out of BOS? Something to think about.


User currently offlineLeo From China, joined May 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2545 times:

I understood that Boston actually had one unique summer ONLY service of Cabo Verde Airlines to Sal on wet-leased widebodies. That airline can not be seen anywhere in the States.

BOS like Rotterdam has a high concentration of Cabo Verdians in its neighbourhood who fly home for summer.


User currently offlineLeo From China, joined May 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 2537 times:

Just noticed that TACV operates L1011 into JFK this year.

Unlucky BOS !!!!


User currently offlineEnglandair From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2000, 2228 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 2514 times:

I beleive BOS is being concidered as bmi's next destination out of MAN (after they've begun long haul from LHR), but that probably wont be for a couple of years.

 Smile/happy/getting dizzy


User currently offlineLH423 From Canada, joined Jul 1999, 6501 posts, RR: 54
Reply 15, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 2408 times:

BOS currently has as followed:

London:
-BA three times daily
-AA two times daily
-Virgin daily
-United daily

Paris:
-Air France two times daily
-American daily

Amsterdam:
-Northwest daily

Brussels:
-VG Airlines five times a week

Frankfurt:
-Lufthansa two times daily

Munich:
-Lufthansa six times a week

Milan:
-Alitalia daily

Dublin:
-Aer Lingus daily

Shannon:
-Aer Lingus daily

Zurich:
-Swiss daily

Ponta Delgada:
-Sata Air Açores three times a week

That's just Europe. Then there are roughtly about 40+ flights to Canada (YHZ, YQB, YUL, YOW, YYZ, and YVR), a few flights to Bermuda, thrice-weekly flights to San Salvador, American to Santo Domingo, Providenciales, and Port-au-Prince, and a slew of charters to the Caribbean and Azores.

LH423



« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
User currently offlineBy738 From Tonga, joined Sep 2000, 2238 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2352 times:

The Northwest Glasgow-Boston service a few years ago apparantly had good loads but the aircraft were needed elsewhere are redeployed. I think Northwest were also downsizing their operation from Boston. It would be a welcome return from Glasgow however.

User currently offlinePROSA From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5627 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2307 times:

Just noticed that TACV operates L1011 into JFK this year.
Unlucky BOS !!!!


I'm actually surprised that TACV went to JFK rather than BOS. Most of the Cape Verdean population in the United States is in southern New England, in most cases closer to BOS than to JFK (those in my former hometown of Waterbury, CT are among the few exceptions, and even for them BOS isn't all that much farther). I know that many Europeans have discovered Cape Verde as a vacation area, but few if any Americans have, so almost all the traffic to SID probably is from the ethnic market. In addition, of course, TACV has to compete with SAA for SID traffic out of JFK.



"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
User currently offlineLH423 From Canada, joined Jul 1999, 6501 posts, RR: 54
Reply 18, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 2294 times:

1.) Little demand.

Not quite. There is quite a demand, which is why BOS is in the top 10 international airports in the US. Of course, we don't benefit from having Central and South American connections, because of our location north, and the tight scheduling those airlines have, it doesn't permit a BOS tag-on to a JFK or MIA flight. However, from Europe, BOS is still a premier airport, and with Delta's international push just a few years off, this is sure to expand in the future.

Part of the reason is our lack of space. Our international terminal is terribly outdated. Customs is only capable of handling about 1,200 passengers an hour, so quite often during the mid-afternoon arrivals crunch, passengers will often be held on the aircraft until the bottlenecks at Immigration and Customs subsides a bit. Also, for some reason Massport seems to insist on international flights being hooked up to a jetbridge instead of a bus to the terminal, therefore, only allowing a maximum of about 5 widebody arrivals in a 60-80 minute period. There are a total of 8 gates at E. Gate 8A and B are almost exclusively used by Air Canada and Aer Lingus, Gate 7A is almost always occupied by a British Airways plane, and gates 1-3 are Northwests domestic flights, leaving just 4, 5, and 6 to handle the rest. Planes arrive and then must be towed over to remote parking facilities in the North Cargo area. By 16.00 the area is full. Once the first phase of the international terminal is complete, Immigration and Customs will be able to accomodate 2,000 passengers/hour (while that might not seem like a lot, that's the equivalent of two additional, fully-loaded 747-400s an hour). The next phase will create a west wing for Terminal E, creating up to four new gates, which will vastly help to reduce congestion.

Furthermore, Delta airlines has just commenced construction of a 400 M$ reconstruction of Terminal A, which will rebuild the original terminal, plus add an additional concourse. The new Terminal A will be outfitted with Immigration and Customs, further reducing reliance on E, as all SkyTeam flights will go directly to A, instead of E then being towed to C, where Delta currently operates. Additionally, American has plans to triple the area of their section of Terminal B, also creating an area for Immigration, allowing further release of precious area in the IAB.

At this time RG it´s not even considering Boston

Actually, VARIG had announced the start of BOS services in 1998 I believe. They were to begin in October, however shortly after the announcement, the Brazilian economy tanked, the company lost a lot of business overnight, and further expansion was held-off indefinitely. Boston has some 60,000 Brazilians living in the area, and they are generally considered to be the Latin Americans with the most disposible income. A flight to BOS would definitely be welcome by the Brazilian community.

Also, regarding TACV. I recently got hired by British Airways and had to do training at JFK. I did see them up on a sign. I wasn't entirely shocked that they had a JFK service, however the Fall River/New Bedford/eastern Rhode Island area has a very large number of Cape Verdean and Azorean populations. Recently, Providence got it's first non-stop, trans-Atlantic flight, a flight to Ponta Delgada, with (I believe) Air Luxor. However, I recall a few years ago TACV saying they had plans to lease a 767-300 and begin services to Boston, JFK, and Lagos, Nigeria. As far as I know, only the JFK routing has come to fruition. Hopefully, a Boston flight will also be realized in coming years.

To sum up, Boston's current state is a far cry from years past, when, in the days of regulation, BOS was second only to JFK in terms of international traffic from the US, and as we had a large domestic network, at one point was the 6th busiest airport in the country, and 11th in the world. Today we're 31st. That's no real fault of Boston's. We have consistantly had growth, and currently have around 27 million passengers a year. Unfortunately, Boston is an urban airport. Being less than just over 1km from the city centre (5km if travelling by car), BOS is hemmed in by urban growth on three sides, the ocean on another, and the primary harbour entrance on another. There is no room for expansion, and because of our unique winds in the Northeast, a very strange runway layout, making a mid-field terminal next to impossible without further land reclamation, which the neighbouring communities would vociferously oppose. We have to do more with much less. We carry just a few million less a year than Denver or Orlando, yet do it in a space that is just a fraction of their land area. Eventually, will we see a nwe Boston airport. Probably, yes. But not for another 15-20 years or so, by which point Logan is expected to meet final capacity of around 45 million.

LH423



« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
User currently offlineDellatorre From Brazil, joined May 2000, 1088 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 2281 times:

As I said. Boston is not on the priorities for Varig right now. Before Sep 11 they were adding flights to US (remember the ATL-IAD), but today international traffic it´s not as prifitable as it was back those times.
I can assure you not to hope for any RG colors in Logan.......
Maybe in a couple of years........


Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Why Is Lufthansa So Keen On The 146/Avro RJs posted Tue Aug 30 2005 11:13:18 by Vfw614
Why Is The A318 Uneconomical On Short Flights? posted Wed Mar 29 2000 01:39:34 by Boeing 777
Why Is ATH So Expensive? posted Thu Sep 14 2006 19:47:59 by Phoenixflyer
Why Is LHR So Coveted Compared To LGW And STN? posted Fri Jul 21 2006 01:31:40 by Tracks
Why Is 'IFE' So Important To Pax? posted Sat Jul 1 2006 20:49:26 by Jetpixx
Why Is DL Still Hanging On To 732s? posted Tue Jun 20 2006 16:39:50 by Bmacleod
Why Dont TOM Offer IFE On Ski Flights posted Sun Jun 4 2006 12:05:01 by BA787
WN To Code Share On International Flights posted Fri Apr 21 2006 01:58:58 by Wnsocal
Why Is Airtran So Expensive? posted Fri Mar 3 2006 20:11:05 by AirWillie6475
Why Is LHR So Hideous? posted Tue Nov 15 2005 05:25:05 by Byrdluvs747