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U's Changes Spread...UA & AA Now  
User currently offlineOuboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4600 posts, RR: 22
Posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3137 times:

From WSJ:

NEW YORK -- AMR Corp.'s American Airlines changed rules overnight on nonrefundable tickets to eliminate the one-year grace period on missed flights after Oct. 1, and to charge a $100 fee beginning next year for standby flight changes.

http://biz.yahoo.com/djus/020830/1156000397_1.html

AA hasn't made a public statement about this yet -- but these were found by pulling up the fare descriptions, as the article states.

Yup -- this industry is about to undertake a huge makeover.  Smile

39 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCMB320 From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 413 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3107 times:

You know, I never thought I would say this, but here goes: GO SOUTHWEST!

User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 2, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3095 times:

Yep, CMB320 - looks like any corporations travel managers who really do try to book the lowest (read non refundable) fare are quickly being limited to Southwest. Because in business, plans change. These dolts at U, UAL and AMR might have just given SWA the tonic it needs to see a profit for the third quarter.

User currently offlineBoiler Special From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 135 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3076 times:

... and then when the traveler misses his Southwest flight he can upgrade to full fare just for the priviledge of being allowed to standby on a later flight. If you're good in finding cheap Southwest fares, in many cases that upgrade will cost more than $100.

For the time being, the one year grace period still exists. But don't expect that to last now...

Don't always expect Southwest to be the most pricing-friendly airline.


User currently offlineMt99 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 6593 posts, RR: 6
Reply 4, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3039 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

A friend bought a ticket yesterday to europe using Expedia's Priceline-like feature and he got an USAirways flight via PIT. with only 1:15min layover both way. He is very concened about the retun part that he would be able to clear customs and still catch the next flight, or else he would be stuck half way. I guess buying withouth knowing which airline you'll be fliying is looking less attractive. Then again that is what the airlines want. Im sure less people will use this feature


Step into my office, baby
User currently offlineLJ From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4430 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3028 times:

Mt99, I don't see the problem. If your friend booked the entire trip as one trip on USAirways, USAirways will probably, if due to any delay your friend misses his flight in PIT, offer a seat on the next available flight(that's at least the policy of all airlines). However if he has two separate tickets you may have a problem.

BTW Don't USAirways have through-checkin for connecting passengers?


User currently offlineLowfareair From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3002 times:

Yet neither of them went as far as US did in terms of the standby or status fares.

User currently offlineSeiple From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2988 times:

Lowfareair,

Perhaps this movement by American Airlines and United Airlines goes to show which of US Airways' new policies are worthwhile. It seems AA/UA aren't putting themselves in a position to further piss off business travelers by eliminating standby or status fares.


User currently offlineLowfareair From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2982 times:

Seiple: My sentiments exactly. If they offer the exact same service as WN for WN-type fares, why wouldn't people take WN for the friendlier employees and more relaxed fees.

User currently offlineSeiple From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2975 times:

Southwest still needs to coexist with the other majors. There is room for both. Most travelers going somewhere like Fayetteville/Bentonville, Arkansas are on business. That market isn't yet developed to the point it could support Southwest (perhaps AirTran, with a subsidy I'm sure they'd get). A company one of my relatives works for requires travel to Jackson, TN often. Can't get there on a low-fare carrier (barely supports a few J-31 a day with AA Connection). While business travelers have the choice of lower fares these days, that battle is being fought in the major cities. Business travelers still require the services of the other major airlines to get them to most of the airports in the country.

It's too bad Southwest doesn't offer a pay club for business travelers. American's business center at Chicago is heavily used (has something like 45 conference rooms). Some people do a day of meetings without ever leaving airports. As this is something that subsidizes itself, perhaps Southwest could develope such a scheme in the future.


User currently offlineUAL-Fan From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 374 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2955 times:

No matter how you look at it you're ahead on Southwest the way I see this. If you miss your flight, are they not saying you just lost the full value of your ticket?

Even if you have to upgrade to a full WN fare you still keep the value of your existing ticket I think.

Am I not interpreting this correctly?


User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 11, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2912 times:

You are correct UAL fan. Boiler - With Southwest's highest one way fare of $299, you are most likely going to still spend less than you would with the $100 penalty plus and difference in the airfare on the others. And of course, if you're in a meeting that runs way late and can't make it to the airport, then you're looking at a full fare on the other guys with zero credit towards the purchase, versus the remaining value of your ticket on SWA going towards the lowest available fare...and as long as you've missed your first flight...there's no standing by - you just get a card like everybody else. Again - if a third quarter profit was questionable for SWA, this move by the others will give them just the boost they need to achieve the profit.

User currently offlineUA744Flagship From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2859 times:

Boiler Special, hello from a fellow Boilermaker!

Southwest has built up a reputation as being THE Low Fare airline... but in many cases, the majors' restricted non-refundable web fares are cheaper.

Just try pricing itineraries out of IND on any given day, any given routing, any given time frame.


User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 13, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2855 times:

Boiler Special, hello from a fellow Boilermaker!

Southwest has built up a reputation as being THE Low Fare airline... but in many cases, the majors' restricted non-refundable web fares are cheaper.

Just try pricing itineraries out of IND on any given day, any given routing, any given time frame


Then, change your plans.


User currently offlineUA744Flagship From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2838 times:

Huh? I'm not bashing Southwest. Far from it--you can at least depend on Southwest for "reasonable" fares.

But the case remains that much of the time, high-cost carriers' web fares are cheaper, though more restrictive.

In my case, I've priced out my trips back home to CA for Thanksgiving and Winter Break, and in both case AA was the cheapest, with fares below $250, after taxes! That is quite remarkable...

I am thankful I bought before today, because I can standby without penalty on these fares... keep in mind the times weren't the most attractive for these fares I locked in.


User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 15, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2829 times:

My point, UA744 - according to this topic, AA, U, and UAL have adopted a "use it or lose it" policy. Changes before flight time cost you a minimum of a hundred bucks. Changes after flight time don't exist....you lose all your money. On Southwest, you get 100% of any remaining airfare applied towards another flight. Now, people can pay a buck or two less than SWA on advance purchase tickets, but they are giving up all flexibility. Get sick and can't travel when you planned? SWA will credit you the full amount towards another ticket. The others will charge you a hundred bucks. Meeting runs late and you can't phone ahead to change your reservation? Sorry - you lose. You'll have to buy a one way ticket home - with nothing credited towards that ticket. The other airlines would always undercut SWA by a buck or two...but they haven't been able to make any money. Now, they have the same price, but they give you less value. And in todays economy, business and leisure travellers are looking for value.

User currently offlineKKMolokai From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 760 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2752 times:

Hey, you get what you pay for ... If you enjoy the multitude of services, conveniences and network of Southwest, then by all means, its the airline for you! There's a Wal-Mart out there for everyone!

funny thing is, "Use-It or Loose-It" is not a new concept. Car rentals & hotels charge you for "no shows." Concert/theatre/sport tickets are only good for that particular event, etc. This isn't something new.

Priceline, Hotwire tickets/reservations ... These are non-changeable, non-refundable, non-upgradeable, non-standbyable. People purchase these tickets with this in mind, because, as you said ... They are looking for value. So why would the consumer expect any different by purchasing from the airlines directly, with these same fare rules in mind? A thought to ponder ...



We are the people of American Airlines. And we know why you fly.
User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 17, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2750 times:

KKMolokai - aside from an assigned seat, what multitude of services can I expect for a low fare ticket on the Target, Sears, and Neiman Marcus's of airlines? You know, you can take something back to Wal Mart and get your money back, no questions asked and regardless of the price. Same product that you can by at other stores too. Quite a concept...it's called "value for the dollar".

User currently offlineKKMolokai From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 760 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 2679 times:

Goingboeing,

Again, you get what you pay for. Obviously you are a wal-mart shopper, or you wouldn't have to ask that question. By the way, what time does Southwest's flight depart for London? Oh, and I hope you're not on the plump side, Southwest will be the first to sell you two seats! Yeah, now I see the value for the dollar!



We are the people of American Airlines. And we know why you fly.
User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 19, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 2667 times:

KKMolokai - don't have a need to go to London. Sorry. While I am considered "obese" by the CDC (6'4 240 pounds), I have no problem fitting in their seats. But you know something, what kind of "accomodation" are the other airlines going to offer the people of size when they switch from MD80's that are running half full to RJ's and that are operating 99% full flights?? Think they might want a little revenue with those seats? And on AA you can stand by...for a hundred bucks. YOu can change a ticket...for a hundred bucks...you can miss the flight...and give up your total airfare. BUT....and this is important...they fly to London. Thats some value, ain't it?

User currently offlineBobcat From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (12 years 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2622 times:

I have flown a few times on JetBlue's trans-con flights.
(JFK/IAD to LGB) I was expecting the planes to be full
of leisure flyers. Instead, I've seen quite a lot of business people flying on them. A few that I chatted with that JetBlue is the best thing that ever happend to their companies. They mostly fly JFK-LA for business. Long Beach isn't that far off. The fares offered by JetBlue is quite irresistable to them... Unfortunately, JetBlue's route structure is hardly making a dent with the majors...


User currently offlineKKMolokai From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 760 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (12 years 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2545 times:

Goingboeing,

I think its obvious you haven't a need to travel abroad, thus the reason you're content with Southwest, and thus the reason you're missing the bigger picture. But as I've stated before, there's a Wal-Mart out there for everyone. By the way ... American and American Eagle are two seperate companies. Oh, and remind me please ... what's the value in SWA charging passengers for two seats?



We are the people of American Airlines. And we know why you fly.
User currently offlineRickb From United Kingdom, joined May 2003, 243 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (12 years 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2510 times:

Can someone confirm one thing for me, I have a few flights booked with AA flying to and from LAS via Dallas, if the flight arrives late into Dallas, I am assuming that if I miss the connection, AA will book me onto the next available flight at no extra cost to me (despite the tickets being non refundable) because its their delay that cost me the connection?

Only I had booked flights with a two hour stopover in Dallas a few months ago ($250 each for tickets from NY > LAS > MIA > NY - it sounded too cheap but I wasn't going to complain !!) and I got a call a couple of weeks ago from BA (who I booked the tickets through) that a number of flights had changed and I now only had a 50 minute stopover !!

Dont want to be stuck in Dallas - when the slot machines beckon !!

Anyone know if I have to change terminals at Dallas for flights from NY and flights to Vegas?

Thanks in advance !!

RickB


User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (12 years 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2488 times:

United has NOT adopted the "use it or loose it" as USAirways has. United still allows for standby on an earlier or later flight. Star Gold members can still get their flights changed on the SAME day and get it confirmed... it used to be you could change it in advance and not pay a fee... now the waiver is only valid for same day travel, same day you are changing.

Delta has been charging for standby or confirmed flight-same-day for a while.... so this isn't anything new..

-nate


User currently offlineJessman From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 1506 posts, RR: 7
Reply 24, posted (12 years 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2459 times:

Quoting from internatl delta sources...
"Same day travel standby //outbound or return// any passenger....regardless of fare type... may standby for an earlier or later same day flight at no additional cost. ASC does //not// apply."

There are exceptions for The Delta Shuttle and Delta Express. International flights do not allow for standby. Different day standby is prohibited.

This is the most recent policy dated 21AUG2001.


25 KKMolokai : Rickb, Is your entire trip to/from LAS on AA? Or are you changing from AA to another carrier in DFW? If you're on AA all the way, and there is a delay
26 UALPHLCS : There have been no "use it or lose it" changes to UA's non-refundablr policy. The following changes HAVE been briefed: No more waivers of fees (excess
27 SegmentKing : Ok, I've been corrected by a friend at Deltaflot. Delta only charges if they can confirm you for the flight or if the fare rules specify an earlier fl
28 Rickb : KKmolokai, Thanks for that - all of the flights are on a single ticket with AA so I will be okay. Cheers RickB
29 Lowfareair : UALPHLCS: the price for an AWARD TICKET(aka FF miles) should never increase. There shouldn't be any inflation with FF miles.
30 UALPHLCS : People have so many FF miles they have found a way to pass them along in their wills after they are dead. FF miles are great don't get me wrong but fr
31 Lowfareair : Then make the FF miles eventually expire. Coupons for free food do. That way there aren't trillions of miles in the system. Maybe they expire after 4
32 Twaneedsnohelp : this is ridiculous news for JetBlue. this airline is going to make so much money in the years to come its gonna be unbelievable. aa and ua as they onc
33 UALPHLCS : Miles did expire. up until about 5 years ago. It was a cry fromt eh customers that propted the change. When my father started at UA in 1969 they used
34 Fly_emirates : seems strange what is happening in the us airline industry! i know that me working in an airline that is not an american carrier make me miss some thi
35 SegmentKing : btw, only the cost of upgrades at united went up... try to learn to read it really really helps! -n
36 Lowfareair : SegmentKing: I know that only the cost of upgrades went up. My point is that the mileage award for them shouldn't have, and defintely not 50%. It's ca
37 Post contains images SegmentKing : mileage awards haven't gone up.... just the amount of miles needed for an upgrade on a paid ticket.... hence why i put some people need to learn to re
38 Goingboeing : Oh, and remind me please ... what's the value in SWA charging passengers for two seats? Ask anyone who has had to share half of their seat with a "per
39 KKMolokai : Enjoy your Southwest flight!!
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