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Mexicana Upgrades Denver Service (a Few Questions)  
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 58
Posted (12 years 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1471 times:

As originally planned, Mexicana's Mexico City (MEX) - Denver (DEN) service which started in May and currently operates 4x weekly on A319s will be upgarded to daily service starting November 4.

However, Mexicana has also made another small upgrade.

Starting November 16, the Saturday and Monday flights will operate on A320s instead of A319s. Nothing huge, but nonetheless good news, especially since this upgrade is happening before it even becomes daily service.

Mexicana also recently upgraded it's Friday only (Saturday return) Zacatecas (ZCL) flight from an A319 to an A320.

Starting on November 4, Mexicana will operate 8 flights a week to Denver. The highest it has even been in Mexicana's 35 year presence in Denver.

As a result of the new Mexico City (MEX) non-stop service. Denver lost it's 3x weekly Puerto Vallarta (PVR) service and it's 2x weekly Los Cabos (SJD) service. After 9/11, Mexicana also dropped it's 2x weekly Mazatlan (MZT) service.

I guess Mexicana is aiming at the business market from Denver nowadays and not the leisure market like it used to.

Is a Guadalajara (GDL) service possible one day? I'm not an expert when it comes to the Mexico market, but Denver seems to be slightly underserved from Mexico compared to other cities out west such as Las Vegas (LAS) and Phoenix (PHX).

On Friday, Frontier announced Cancun (CUN) service which will be the first scheduled service to Cancun from Denver ever. It will also be Frontier's first international destination.

Frontier is expected to announce Los Cabos (SJD) and Mazatlan (MZT) service soon aswell, both which were previously served by Mexicana. It's unknown exactly how the service will work. At first, I heard Frontier will operate 1 flight to Los Cabos (SJD) and that same flight would continue to Mazatlan (MZT). However I recently heard that they most likely each will be getting there own flight. We'll find out when it's announced.

I hope one day Denver (DEN) will have non-stop service to Hermosillo (HMO), Guadalajara (GDL), and Monterrey (MTY).

Again, I'm no expert when it comes to Mexico. But I did make a personal observation that Denver has much much less Mexico service than other comparable cities in the West. And Mexican ties in Denver are very strong. Denver and the rest of Colorado has a very large Hispanic population and strong Mexican ties when it comes to Industry.

United hasn't been interested in starting any Mexico service from Denver (except the winter seasonal Saturday service to MEX announced recently) which might be the problem aswell.

In Las Vegas (LAS), and Phoenix (PHX), America West serves most of the Mexico service from those cities and America West has a very strong Mexico network.

Perhaps someone could clear this up for me a bit. I also understand that Phoenix's Mexico service will always be stronger than Denver's since Mexican ties in Arizona are much much much stronger than Colorado's. But Las Vegas (LAS) having more Mexico service is a bit surprising considering that Las Vegas' population is less than half of Denver's population..

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Regards


"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
17 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25276 posts, RR: 85
Reply 1, posted (12 years 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 1438 times:
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BA:

Mexico generally is a good market (it can be a great one!), but has its lumps. The Pacific Coast resorts are very seasonal, especially Acapulco, which is both hot and wet (tropical downpours) in the summer.

That's why I'd like to see Frontier add a "business" destination, like Monterrey, in addition to the resorts.

I also wonder about Vera Cruz. It's probably the most underserved city in Mexico for US connections.

It's a big port city, with a hot and humid climate. I can't imagine many tourists wanting to go there - but I could see a lot of business people coming and going.

Las Vegas is easy. There's nothing like it in Mexico, and inlanders love going there instead of the tropical beaches - they can do that anytime, in their own country. In their view, Las Vegas is "something different".

cheers

mariner




aeternum nauta
User currently offlineScottysAir From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (12 years 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1421 times:

Also, there is another one is Aeromexico have flies nonstop from PHX-HMO as for daily 1 roundtrip nonstop by codeshare with Delta skyteam alliance. I think this is very well by the more load factors our of PHX & LAS too. Thsi is willing be one-stop into HMO then connectiing to MEX flight. I did looked it up with the my timetable book as from Delta by myself here at home. So hope this is your helps. Thanks!!

User currently offlineGhost77 From Mexico, joined Mar 2000, 5222 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (12 years 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1391 times:

BA,

Probably Denver is not a "well known" city here in Mexico, I can tell you I've been at mostly all the southern states of the US a few cities... LAX,SAN,PHX, LAS,ELP,DFW,IAH,SAN,MIA, and many other cities I can't remember, in the North I've flown to ORD and went all the way to Toronto, Canada via car, the success of cities such as LAX,SAN,PHX,LAS, etc it's because they are closer than DEN... some people go to the US for shopping only so they prefer cities closer to Mexico... In the case of the high flights demands into Chicago it's because all Mexican people working there....

About Vegas, as Mariner said Vegas is an uncommon city to us, I've been to Vegas for the last 2 year like 6 times, everytime I go I see something changed..., we don't have Cassinos in Mexico because of the United States, years ago they wanted to put Cassinos just like Vegas in different cities like Cancun, Cabos, Vallarta, Acapulco, but when the US knew about this they start talks to Mexico's government... (This was Early 90s, in Salinas administration) for the rejection of this new 'bussiness', they new Vegas demand was going be affected and people would prefer to visit the coasts of Mexico and play in here...

Anyway, good for MEXICANA  Big thumbs up, too bad they dropped freq like SJD, PVR, and MZT., probably this was because they don't have enough aicrafts to cover an estimate of 16 flights to DEN, or they are afraid to have a low seat demand.


Finally, I think Denver needs more promotion in Mexico, I'm shure there are lots of things to do in there!

ghost77  Smile




Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 58
Reply 4, posted (12 years 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 1306 times:

Ghost77,

Thanks for your reply.

I think the reason why they dropped the 3 resort destinations is because of aircraft shortage like you said.

However, I heard that there may be some sort of bilateral agreement that limits the number of flights Mexicana can have.

Since they have been serving Denver, everytime they add a new service. They drop something else in favor of it. I say it's because of not enough aircraft but who knows.

For example, when Mexicana announced non-stop 4x weekly DEN-MEX service. They dropped the 3x weekly PVR service. When Mexicana announced that DEN-MEX would go daily, they dropped SJD-DEN.

So I am assuming it has to do with aircraft shortage. Mexicana didn't operate the service daily in the first place because they didn't have enough aircraft. They were waiting for some more A319s to arrive.

Regards



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlineGhost77 From Mexico, joined Mar 2000, 5222 posts, RR: 51
Reply 5, posted (12 years 11 hours ago) and read 1261 times:

BA,

Maybe MXA got no more pax for continuing the route to MEX, as Frontier they will be worried to fill in the DEN-CUN and back, while MXA has to worry about filling the DEN-MZT/PVR/SJD and then continue the route to MEX with at least with 80 passengers in an A319, all the year...

I know the only billateral agreement between Mexico and the United States is that only 2 airlines from Mexico, and 2 airlines from the US can cover the route, for example Aeromexico and Mexicana fly to LAX direct from MEX, as Delta and United do the LAX-MEX, if Aviacsa wants to fly to LAX it has to do it connecting in other city like Monterrey as they are doing it, because Guadalajara and other cities from the East coast of Mexico are all ready served by AeroCalifornia, Mexicana, AeroMexico...

But this are all theorys and we can't know what the real true is....

ghost77  Smile



Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 58
Reply 6, posted (12 years 10 hours ago) and read 1261 times:

Ghost77,

That is true. I'm sure many passengers found the one-stop to MEX unattractive as it meant sitting in the plane for a little more than 5 hours.

Mexicana should focus mainly on the business market to DEN for the time being. Then possibly later on, they can add some leisure destinations. I am hoping for GDL service one day, at least twice a week on an A320.

Frontier will do very well in the Cancun and other leisure destinations as the leisure market is thriving while business travel is down. This is why Frontier took the decision to fly to Mexican resorts.

My best guess about why Mexicana has always had a strict number of flights from DEN per week is probably due to aircraft shortages. I've checked many other US destinations that Mexicana serves and most have a similar issue with DEN. From what I have heard many times in the past is Mexicana is short on aircraft for all the routes they operate. As you know, they also operate a lot of point-to-point which greatly drains on aircraft resources (hence why Southwest has 400 aircraft).

This is why Mexicana can only operate MEX-DEN 4x weekly at the moment. They simply do not have the resources to operate it daily until November which is when they will have some additional A319s.

Regards



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 58
Reply 7, posted (12 years 10 hours ago) and read 1256 times:

One thing I noticed interesting about Mexicana's DEN service is the flight overnights in Denver and returns the next day.

For example, the flight will arrive at 8:50PM, then will overnight and depart back to MEX at 8:00AM the next day. Anyone have any idea why they do this? They must have some high operating fees for parking the aircraft for that long, and DEN's operating fees are among the most expensive in the country.

Regards



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1393 posts, RR: 14
Reply 8, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 1222 times:

mariner:

I guess a flight DEN-MTY will be a total failure. Thought MTY is a relevant business centre, there is few demand to the Rockies, even the Pacific.
Currently, there are only 6 destinations to the US: IAH, DFW, SAT, ATL, JFK and LAS... The last two are served only 5x...

I guess most of the international traffic goes through IAH, DFW and ATL. Even NW effort to develop MTY linking it to MEM was short lived.

PZ



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1393 posts, RR: 14
Reply 9, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 1217 times:

Oops!
I am sorry.
I missed MTY-ORD with MX.

However my point still stays... Most flights originating from MTY tend to be to TX or eastern. Only LAS is served west of TX, and that is for known reasons... But there is not even a service to LAX or SFO... so there is no chance for Frontier in DEN-MTY

or... who knows?



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineDelta_fan From Mexico, joined Jul 2001, 132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1202 times:

Not completely true Pzurita1

( 6A ) Aviacsa has daily LAX service non-stop from MTY ,,,,, we used to have a lot more international flights but for schedule reasons the did not lived long enough to make a profit , MTY-YYZ departed MTY at 430am and MTY-MIA departed MTY at 1000pm arriving to MIA a little late .................

just my 2 cents

Delta_fan


User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1393 posts, RR: 14
Reply 11, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1193 times:

Delta_fan:

Is 6A flying MTY-LAX?
They announced MTY-PVR and MTY-LAX, but I was not aware it was already a fact.

Did they drop any other service? May be MTY-TIJ, or MTY-CUN




Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineDelta_fan From Mexico, joined Jul 2001, 132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 1173 times:

No , they continue to expand operations from MTY since MEX is a bit crowded the MTY-PVR is a seasonal service , but the MTY-LAX is year round , strangely AM had MTY-LAX with one stop in HMO and the flight never carried more than 3 or 4 pax , but I guess it was the fare becuse 6A is doing pretty good , well the should , their starting fare was 199usd round trip ..........


Delta_fan


User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1393 posts, RR: 14
Reply 13, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 1170 times:

Delta_fan:
If you are based in MTY, may be you can help me.
Take a look to my post titled "US cities served from Mexico. 31?" The list is now in 34... The goal is 40 and then compare it to US services from Canada



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineGhost77 From Mexico, joined Mar 2000, 5222 posts, RR: 51
Reply 14, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 1139 times:

BA,

Well Mexicana got 6, 319s, all ready and as you said Nov and Dec will be 2 more acfts joining the fleet... and they expect 4 more for a total of 12 and I heard rumors saying MX was interested in getting 12 more for the replace of F100 and will be better to have a fleet of 319-320s and the B757.

Probably in other destinations Mexicana got no more flights, because of other companies competing, in the US, its Delta, American, United, while here is AeroMexico, and sometimes in Aviacsa in LAX,LAS... so imagine how strong all is the network of American Carriers and AeroMexico competing with MX. I think Mexicana has been doing a great job, trying to expand in the North and South America, which results are shown, in the last 2 years, Mexicana started new destinations, more frecuencies, acft renovation, all this in America.. while AeroMexico still the same company as 2 years, the only thing they've done this far is to get more MD87s, and put an order of 737sNG, but we have to wait and see when the 737s are going to fly in the Mexican skies.

About MX staying at DEN, I think it's because most of the passengers hate to fly at night, imagine 8:50 pm arriving, plus some more minutes if the flight is delayed, let's say 9 o clock, acft will be ready for going back at 10, so imagine who would like to be at 9 o clock for the check in, and then a 5 or 6 hour flight get at MEX around 4 am?, Think it's better to fly the next day....

Pzurita1,
Haven't read your post of "US ....... " I can imagine what is been said on that post but I think you can't compare Mexico with Canada., we all know Canada's economical situation is way much better than Mex  Sad.

ghost77  Smile




Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
User currently offlineCx340 From Mexico, joined Sep 2000, 609 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 1133 times:

Well I hope Aviacsa keeps tha LAX flight because I'm supposed to be on it next February! It is not my original choice but I am taking a really long trip to Asia leaving from MTY and I really didn't want another stop at DFW, IAH, HMO, MEX or wherever. . . Delta_fan, do you know how well is the flight doing?



User currently offlineGhost77 From Mexico, joined Mar 2000, 5222 posts, RR: 51
Reply 16, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 1134 times:

Cx340,

AFAIK, 6A has been doing great in the MTY-LAX and MTY-PVR. Think MTY will be a detonator of 6A, adding flights, routes, and more... also it's good to know Aviacsa worries of MTY's demand!

ghost77  Smile



Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
User currently offlineBA From United States of America, joined May 2000, 11153 posts, RR: 58
Reply 17, posted (11 years 12 months 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 1103 times:

Thanks for the replies Ghost77. Mexicana's performance seems to be improving in DEN which is certainly good news. The fact that they are having an aircraft equipment upgrade on 2 days of the week before it even becomes daily is good news.

I heard a while ago that they would evaluate the possibility of a 2nd flight. I guess we'll see, although 1 flight is I think will be it. What I think is possible is all 7 days of the week may be upgraded to an A320.

Regards



"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
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