Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Southwest "No New Cities In 2003"  
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5848 posts, RR: 28
Posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3013 times:

It looks like the WN statements about no new cities are definitely being extended to continue through 2003. I guess instead of new cities we'll have to guess about new routes between existing cities.

Most news sources carried a short blurb from James Parker's speech yesterday in Phoenix which said no industry rebound until 2005. But at the bottom of a Phoenix article Parker is also reported to have said:

"Southwest, the second-largest carrier out of Phoenix Sky Harbor International Airport, is growing at a slower rate this year and doesn't expect to add cities this year or next, Parker said. It may add routes within cities it serves next year, he added."
http://www.arizonarepublic.com/business/articles/1016southwest16.html

This also ties with statements by Bob Montgomery, the WN VP of Properties at a conference earlier this month:
"Bob Montgomery - VP Properties, Southwest Airlines. Slow growth ahead. Don't look for new cities in the near future. The airline recognizes that profits are paper thin. No risky moves."
http://www.aviationplanning.com/confreview.htm




"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
27 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDonder10 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 6660 posts, RR: 21
Reply 1, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2998 times:

What is their 73G delivery rate like?
I guess 2003 will be case of joining the dots, so to speak?


User currently offlineLindy field From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 3131 posts, RR: 13
Reply 2, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2985 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I was wondering also what their aircraft acquisition rates will be like for the next year. I understand that they've brought all their parked aircraft into service now. Did they defer deliveries like all the other US carriers? How many 73Gs are left on order?


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © AirNikon



User currently offlineFlying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4166 posts, RR: 36
Reply 3, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2975 times:

All B737-200 on their way out that´s why the B73Gs are moving in at a steady pace as far as I know. -> Streamline fleet down to three types.

Regards
Flying-Tiger
http://fly.to/rorders



Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A380,AT4,AT7,B732/3/4/5/7/8,B742/4,B762/763,B772,CR2,CR7,ER4,E70,E75,F50/70,M11,L15,S20
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5848 posts, RR: 28
Reply 4, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2958 times:

Prior to 9/11 WN was scheduled to receive 26 737-700s in 2003. I don't know if that plan has changed.


"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineONT 737 From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 591 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2936 times:

Listen to the conference call tomorrow. I'm sure a/c deliveries and new routes/cites (or lack thereof) will be covered.

http://www.firstcallevents.com/service/ajwz367849610gf12.html



"The world is run by C students"-Harry Truman
User currently offlineLoneStarMike From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 3868 posts, RR: 33
Reply 6, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2837 times:

If terminal expansions for Southwest at its existing stations is a clue, then I'd expect to see more service out of MDW, HOU, and BWI.

I haven't really kept up with the progress on Southwest's new gates at MDW, but in another thread user Jsnww81 posted:

Southwest will get its first new gates at Midway this coming spring. When their new concourse is fully complete, they'll have 19 gates, over the 13 they have currently. That's an increase of 6 gates - Southwest should be able to expand the MDW operation considerably.

I agee and think you'll see more short-haul flights from places like ALB and BUF, new or increased mid-haul service from places like SAT, AUS and HOU and more service to Florida and the west coast.

Regarding BWI, there was an article back at the end of July about Southwest's future plans for expansion at BWI.

Southwest committed to BWI expansion
07/31/2002

http://baltimore.bizjournals.com/baltimore/stories/2002/07/29/daily36.html

Highlights from the above article were:

Southwest Airlines could nearly double its service to BWI within the next three years,

Bob Montgomery, Southwest's vice president of properties and facilities stated: "Our deepest desire is to add capacity here as soon as we can,"

BWI had 138 Southwest departures a day, making it the third busiest arport in Southwest's sytem.

Southwest has increased it's staff by 20% and could add as many as 14 new domestic flights next year.

Southwest's expansion at BWI includes the construction of a new 31-gate, 500,000-square-foot terminal that is expected to be finished by the end of 2005 and could result in nearly 250 daily Southwest departures.

I think I read somewhere else that construction had been completed on a moving sidewalk airside "connector" between Pier B and C so that passengers at BWI changing planes from B to C and vice versa don't have to exit the sterile area and reclear security again to get in the new concourse.

If Southwest does add up to 14 new daily departures next year, I'd look for most of them to be long-haul. I think BWI is big enough to provide point to point service to long haul destinations on its own, but due to Southwest's frequent flights, BWI is also an easy connection city for those folks in MHT, PVD, ISP, BDL, and ORF.

And then there's Southwest's new 24-gate concourse at HOU.

click here to see image

Back when groundbreaking ceremonies were held in June of 2000, the project was supposed to be 374,000 sq. feet, and open in October, 2002 with 20 gates. Since that time, I've read that it will now be more than 500,000 sq. feet and open with 24 gates. I'm not sure when it's scheduled for completion, but I suspect the opening date might have been pushed back a bit to allow for the additional construction of the new gates and to make changes/add extra space for the new baggage screening machines.

I hope to see Southwest gradually add or increase nonstop service to MCI and MDW, the west coast, the northeast and Florida. Like BWI, I think HOU is big enough to support mid- to long-haul point-to-point service on its own, but because of frequent flights between HOU and AUS, HRL, CRP, SAT, and MSY, Hobby could also serve as a good connection city for folks from those areas.

LoneStarMike

User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2825 times:

No industry rebound until 2005!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??

Good god, there's never been a better time to be a low-cost carrier....


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jan Mogren



Ryanair & Southwest-the winning team!


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © PolishAir42 - Chicago Aviation Photography



User currently offlineDonder10 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 6660 posts, RR: 21
Reply 8, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2754 times:

Ryanair-no frills
Southwest-low cost
Figures I have for relative CASKs show WN having lower CASKs than FR!However they are about a year old so the rise of the euro against the dollar may shift this around a bit.Yet,WN's service seems to be a lot closer to that of GO+EZY rather than our Emerald friends.
Also,could somebody inform on what Southwest's transfer policy is please?
Cheers,Alex


User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2744 times:

>>>Also,could somebody inform on what Southwest's transfer policy is please?

Can you be a little more specific?


User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2732 times:

Donder,

I've personally never found FR's service to be 'bad'. It's ranged from 'fair' to 'good', although never 'excellent'. I can't say I've experienced 'appalling' yet, at least not inflight.

MOL has always believed in the Cheapest Fares + Safety + Punctuality = That's all a customer should want equation.

I guess that means that the service side was neglected, although it depends what kind of 'service' you want. I'm happy for the FA's to make the relevant announcements and then disappear-at least on short-haulers. That's why Ryanair suits me down to the ground (no pun intended).

Others, prefer the Easyjet, or indeed Southwest approach to service...cracking jokes over the PA system, giggling during safety demos, and engaging in cheerful conversation with pax...I also enjoy that style, but can live without it if need be.

In any case, a birdie at FR tells me that service all-round should be improving...so that's always good to hear.

FR and WN have a lot of informal links, although it seems as if O'Leary didn't much take to the 'g'day folks, y'all have yourselves a good flight' (in a Texas accent, if you can imagine that for just a second  Big grin ) aspect of inflight service.



User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2730 times:

I believe Donder is talking about connections........as with FR, I don't think you can 'officially' connect with WN....'point to point' and all that....although you can of course try, ensuring plenty of time between flights.

User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7811 posts, RR: 16
Reply 12, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2710 times:

There certainly are connections on Southwest. They just call it changing planes. As an example LAX-BWI currently has the following options. 2 non-stops, 5 one-stop direct, and 4 with a stop and a change of plane (3 in PHX, 1 in BNA). Southwest used to allow 3-stop connect journeys. But has taken those out of the system due to changes in taxing rules for flights. As a result some stations with limited service, especially if they don't have multiple flights to a larger SW city, you cannot get to all of the SW stations from it.

But what I think Donder was talking about was interline transfer. Which Southwest does not allow. If you do fly interline, you have to ticket it seperately and re-check your bags. Somebody correct me if I am wrong.



Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineRedngold From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 6907 posts, RR: 44
Reply 13, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2708 times:

Yes, I have had connecting flights on Southwest -- CLE-BNA-MCO was my trip last December. Also CLE-BWI-PVD once...

Just look at WN's timetable and you will see connections right there!

redngold



Up, up and away!
User currently offlineDonder10 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 6660 posts, RR: 21
Reply 14, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2701 times:

In any case, a birdie at FR tells me that service all-round should be improving...so that's always good to hear.
Like yourself I have never had any problems with FR and do not care for any service en route.However, you do hear some horror stories about FR in the press but I tend to believe that most reporting is o so slightly OTT.However,if WN could get a lot more biz passengers,IMO, if they improved the service levels on board slightly.Then again the FAs are too busy flogging the 'most expensive cheese sandwiches in Europe' especially on short segements Big thumbs up
Not overly surprised about WN's interling transfer policy really.They have enough frequencies on some routes to enable 'casual' transfer so to speak.


User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2679 times:

Wow, surprised to hear of the connections WN allows....so does this mean WN holds aircraft on the ground if a connecting passenger(s) is/are late? Isn't this more of a 'hub-and-spoke' strategy?

As I said, it's not 'officially' an option with FR, although plenty of people still seem to purchase connecting FR flights. Guess since they're still relatively new, and with intense competition on all sides, they don't want to start complicating ops with connections.

I guess since WN is now well-established in the market, they're able to start branching out into FFPs, offering connections, peanuts etc.

FR is still very much bare-bones service, with zilcho in the way of food/drinks...not even a peanut!


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33289 posts, RR: 71
Reply 16, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2672 times:

Ft. Lauderdale-Manchester (which actually does start 18 January as a Saturday service)
Ft. Lauderdale-Providence
Ft. Lauderdale-Austin
Ft. Lauderdale-Phoenix
Ft. Lauderdale-Albuquerque (hey, TPA and MCO have ABQ)

None would surprise me. WN is getting a lot of new gates at FLL this year.



a.
User currently offlineScottysAir From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2629 times:

That's right, MAH4546!!!

Sooner, that will be schedules as for opened with the new concourse B into FLL airport by the mew terminal 1. After that SWA will be moving from T3 to T1 and also, Spirit Airlines will be taking over at old ex-SWA ticket counter and gate counter, too. I will ask with my friend Steve Belleme at my FLL airport about what dates will be schedules as for public grand opening into the new concourse B and I'm will bring with the my camera with me at FLL airport. I knew that already now with nonstop from FLL-MHT/BDL, too by January 2003. Well, later!

Regards,

Scott W.


User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2624 times:

>>>I will ask with my friend Steve Belleme

Ask him if he ever used to work at Air Florida flight control in MIA. If so, tell him hello, and have him email me...

Thanks...


User currently offlineLoneStarMike From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 3868 posts, RR: 33
Reply 19, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2521 times:

Longer term (2004) it looks like Southwest may be planning to add more service at MCI. There's an article in today's Kansas City Star about it.

Southwest Airlines plans to expand space at KCI
10/17/2002

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/business/4300959.htm

Highlights of the article were

The expansion would allow Southwest to increase its daily flights out MCI from 75 to 120.

Kansas City is Southwest's 11th busiest station in terms of daily departures.

When the terminal renovations are completed in 2004, Southwest will have 12 gates in Terminal B.

Under the new proposal, all of the Southwest area would be expanded, and the passenger holding areas would be contiguous between all 12 gates.

(I'm taking that last statement to mean that passenger arriving at one gate will be able to change planes without having to exit the sterile area and reclear security at another gate like it is now.

Also, I was under the impression that the current renovations involved adding more space by extending the terminal out about 8 feet where the entrance vestibules are now. It sounded like Southwest's expansion is adding space on at the back of the terminal towards the ramp.

LoneStarMike

User currently offlineJohn From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 1374 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 2476 times:

Will the FLL-PVD service be seasonal 'Saturday only', as well? I definitely know the PVD market could support a 'daily' FLL/PBI.

User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 21, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 2461 times:

Mike - that's the plan at MCI...there's no room to expand the terminals any other way. Keeping all 12 gates in the same secured area will be a real benefit for connecting passengers. The article didn't say, but I would hope that this is part of the plan - put some restrooms inside the secured area. KC's got a great airport, but should you need to relieve yourself, you've got to reclear security. This whole thing is in addition to the terminal renovation that the city of KC is doing at the airport. As a local, I love to see LUV grow here.

User currently offlineTbonecapalbo From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2436 times:

Southwest will also be getting a new concourse at TPA in the next couple of years. TPA is demolishing airside C, and rebuilding it to house Southwest. With the new terminals at MDW and HOU southwest will certainly have a lot of nice new terminal facilities throughout their network.

User currently offlineChrisNH From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 4167 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2420 times:

It seems, while not iron-clad, that Southwest opens up a route by (in some cases) introducing these 'Saturday Only' flights. Up here in Manchester, they started with one daily nonstop to Orlando (MCO) but added a 'Saturday Only' flight which then turned into their second daily nonstop (there are now three dailies on this run). I think they might have done the same thing with the now-second TPA daily out of here, too. That's why I envision the FLL service going daily at some point in 2003.

Also in 2003, we expect to see nonstops to PHX and LAS from Manchester. One member of my Manchester Airport Yahoo! Group is speculating that MHT-OAK might be a way to 'short-circuit' any desires by JetBlue to enter the MHT market. We know that B6 wants to enter the Boston market, but the 'Boston market' actually means three airports in total (BOS-MHT-PVD). We speculate that if Boston-Logan is unworkable (read: no gates, high fees, lousy slots), then PVD and MHT should enter the mix (despite B6's 'claim' that they don't want to go head-to-head with Southwest). Well, as long as WN continues to 'add a few flights here, a few there.' then B6 will find fewer and fewer open spaces. And between MHT and PVD, I (with some admitted bias) think that MHT has the upper hand. 9,250 feet of new concrete mid-next-year is only one of several reasons I say that.

Indeed, if I were B6, I would enter MHT and debut with brand new MHT-OAK nonstops, garnering the PR edge ('First-ever transcon nonstops to a New England city other than Boston!') as well as the competitive edge. To the extent that B6 'shys away' from WN, this 'competitive edge' ends up going to WN.

Chris in NH


User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6733 posts, RR: 24
Reply 24, posted (12 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2331 times:

('First-ever transcon nonstops to a New England city other than Boston!')

This wouldn't be true though because AA has flown BDL-LAX nonstop in the past.

I'm not real surprised by WN's moves. It's cheaper to expand within the existing system instead of adding new cities. WN is being financially smart...no need to add capacity like crazy and drive down loads and yields....ala FRNT.


25 Boeing757/767 : Also, UA had BDL-SFO non-stops. As to WN and Ft. Lauderdale, they're starting BDL-FLL flights as Saturday-only as well soon.
26 ScottysAir : Yes, that's is correct this one for the nonstop from FLL-BDL and also, that schedules will be opened for the new concourse B in January 2003. Thanks!
27 AeroGlobeAir7 : I agree with GoingBoeing, it's great to see them expanding here. Hopefully we'll see nonstops to FLL, MSY, JAX, AUS, IAH, HOU, SYR and more flights be
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Southwest - No New Cities In 2001 posted Tue Feb 6 2001 05:32:47 by Republic
AirTran: No New Cities In 2004 posted Fri Feb 6 2004 20:12:23 by Alphascan
Qatar Adds 7 New Cities In 2007: JFK/DPS... posted Mon Nov 6 2006 21:49:37 by Jimyvr
Allegiant: Over 30 New Cities In Next 2-3 Years posted Tue Feb 28 2006 20:09:39 by FATFlyer
Court Rules : No New Airport In Berlin! posted Thu Apr 14 2005 16:14:33 by Beaucaire
Why No New Cities For Spirit Airlines This Year? posted Sat May 15 2004 05:06:48 by ScottysAir
777 New Order In 2003 posted Sun Nov 30 2003 02:31:23 by 1stclass
MASKargo:1new Aircraft And 2 New Cities In Europe posted Fri Nov 14 2003 20:04:22 by RJ100
WN's CFO - Plan To Add New Cities In 2004 posted Thu Feb 13 2003 23:44:20 by FATFlyer
Southwest CEO: New Orleans Is "Top Priority" posted Wed Feb 1 2006 13:36:31 by MSYtristar