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British Spotters Appeal  
User currently offlineOvelix From Greece, joined Aug 1999, 639 posts, RR: 3
Posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 1010 times:

The group of British plane-spotters found guilty of spying in Greece are due in court on Monday to appeal their convictions.

The topic has been discussed in this forum and the bottomline was that they indeed broke the local law. Many of us are spotters but at least we are aware that our hobby is not above the law.

Kostas

16 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineJetTrader From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 586 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 1001 times:


...and your point is...?



Life's dangerous. Get a f**king helmet!
User currently offlineCapt.Picard From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 987 times:

I thought they were let off? Aren't they back in the UK? At the end of the day, I think the British/Greek governments will work something out, because I really don't think these guys are going to end up in jail.

I agree that you shouldn't break local laws ("when in Rome, do as the Romans do" etc.), but I believe this problem will be resolved amicably.


User currently offlineDonder10 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 6660 posts, RR: 21
Reply 3, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 986 times:

Was there any evidence at all to show they were spies?

User currently offlineOvelix From Greece, joined Aug 1999, 639 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 975 times:

They were initially released on bail. After the conviction they all left for the UK. Their sentences were suspended.

Donder10, they had notepads and photos indicating military planes movements. They never said that they did not take photos or notes. They just deny the espionage charges.

Kostas


User currently offlineJayhup From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 452 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 974 times:

If they were trespassing on gov't property then they should have been punished but to accuse them of spying at an Air Show is utterly ridiculous.



User currently offlineOvelix From Greece, joined Aug 1999, 639 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 971 times:

Jayhup

Please do a search on previous threads about the case. They were arrested outside the fence, well after the end of the show.

Before that they had been taking pictures at several military airports, including a NATO airbase. They were repeatedly advised to leave by security officers but they chose to ignore them.

Kostas


User currently offlineArsenal@LHR From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 7792 posts, RR: 19
Reply 7, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 963 times:
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They should not have broken the local laws, but i still don't think they were there for spying or espionage. Spies and secret agents don't make the themselves so obvious.




In Arsene we trust!!
User currently offlineDavid_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7447 posts, RR: 13
Reply 8, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 926 times:
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This is the thread in question.

With the spotters viewpoint here, here, and here.


David


User currently offlineDonder10 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 6660 posts, RR: 21
Reply 9, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 905 times:

Donder10, they had notepads and photos indicating military planes movements. They never said that they did not take photos or notes. They just deny the espionage charges.

Many spotters note movements.I agree that they were prats to some extent from what I have heard but espionage is a big jump and there doesn't appear to be much evidence for it.The Greeks don't really seem to have understood what spotting is about and so lump the movements logs into intelligence-I thought Greece had signed up to an agreement which stated that they could not withhold some military information on movements etc-Turkey has signed up to this too AFAIK,.


User currently offlineOvelix From Greece, joined Aug 1999, 639 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 894 times:

Many spotters note movements.

And that makes the military obliged to tolerate such actions? When a sign says "No photos" how much more clear needs to be?


I agree that they were prats to some extent from what I have heard but espionage is a big jump and there doesn't appear to be much evidence for it.

Please stop the espionage thing. The court did not say they are spies. They were convicted for "obtaining state secrets". Espionage means that someone uses the info in favour of other countries, persons etc.


The Greeks don't really seem to have understood what spotting is.
And the britons don't really seem to understand that they have to respect the law, even if they don't agree with it.

The agreement you refer to is about information between countries. That means e.g. Greece and Turkey have to inform each other in case or large military movements such as exercises. The info is not for everyone though...

Kostas





User currently offlineDavid_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7447 posts, RR: 13
Reply 11, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 886 times:
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Kostas

What part of When a sign says "No photos" how much more clear needs to be? means no notes can be taken?

I think I'll now look for these "state secrets" that are freely available on the internet.

David


User currently offlineSkymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 861 times:

I thought we were all part of the EU now and things were meant to be "standardised"...

Its about time the Greeks realised that aeroplane spotting and even photography are widely practiced and are legal pretty much across the whole of the EU, that they drop this stupidity against citizens of another EU state, and come into line with the rest of the community that they perport to be a part of.

Andy


User currently offlineDonder10 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 6660 posts, RR: 21
Reply 13, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 830 times:

I have also read that the spotters had permisson to be where they were.

User currently offlineGoing64 From Netherlands, joined Oct 2002, 329 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 4 days ago) and read 817 times:

There're 2 Dutch spotters involved as well!
Peter


User currently offlineDavid_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7447 posts, RR: 13
Reply 15, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 786 times:
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And all have had their convictions quashed! Ho hum.. so much for the bottomline was that they indeed broke the local law, eh Kostas  Big grin

David


User currently offlineIwantaBBJ From Switzerland, joined Jun 2002, 777 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (12 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 780 times:
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Here are some news:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2412705.stm

Mike


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