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Official: UAL Files 11  
User currently offlineSccutler From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 5579 posts, RR: 28
Posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2048 times:

NBC News just broke, Chpt 11 filed in Chicago's US Bankruptcy Court.


...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
27 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2039 times:


sad sad ..

CHICAGO (AP) -- United Airlines, reeling from two years of heavy losses and unable to pay off nearly $1 billion in debt that comes due this week, filed for federal bankruptcy court protection Monday.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/021209/united_airlines_2.html


User currently offlineSccutler From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 5579 posts, RR: 28
Reply 2, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2035 times:

Sorry gang, did not know that a colon would truncate the rest of the title; originally read "Official: UAL Files 11"


...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
User currently offlineAamd11 From UK - Wales, joined Nov 2001, 1061 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2025 times:

Now we sit and wait to see what becomes of them.
My guess is a significantly leaner carrier, they will be around for a long time, but not in its "bloated" form.

A sad day for all those it concerns, employees of United especially.

A^A MD-11


User currently offlineSkippy777 From Netherlands, joined Dec 2001, 816 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2006 times:

Another sad day in the aviation history.

United gone as well ??????
I hope they still can work something out


User currently offlineApuneger From Belgium, joined Sep 2000, 3032 posts, RR: 11
Reply 5, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 1950 times:

Sad indeed. Does anybody know if they're still going to fly into BRU tomorrow? If so I'll try to take a picture of one of the birds...

My thoughts are with all the employees right now!

Ivan



Ivan Coninx - Brussels Aviation Photography
User currently offlineLapper From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2002, 1567 posts, RR: 7
Reply 6, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1837 times:

Skippy and Apuneger: United has not gone! Chapter 11 does not mean this is the end of the carrier right now, if indeed ever. Flights will still take place, so no need to rush out and start being sentimaental.

User currently offlineN751PR From Japan, joined May 2002, 1249 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1778 times:

Another airline files for Chapter 11. I hope they emerge out of it instead of flying only in the history books.  Sad

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Glenn Alderton




"Ladies and Gentlemen it's happy hour. You will get two approaches for the price of one."
User currently offlineFlagshipAZ From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3419 posts, RR: 14
Reply 8, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1734 times:

While I feel sorry for the hard working blue-collared employees of United, I have no pity whatsoever for the management & unions leaders. They bought this upon themselves. Sloppiness & greed is & will be their ultimate downfall. United they stood, divided they fell. To the working man & woman of United, things will get better, because they always do. Regards.


"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." --Ben Franklin
User currently offlineBizJets From France, joined Jun 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1731 times:

You can read the filing

User currently offlineN175dz From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2000, 274 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1689 times:

I for one hope they come out of Chapter 11 fine, in better shape than ever. Impressivley, ual.com appears to be already displaying a lot of information describing what this means to the customer.

I have several flights on United booked for next year and I'm looking forward to them. I've never had a bad experience with them and I will continue flying them as long as they're in the air.

United 'should' stand  Smile. I wish the best to all employees out there, espcially those on a.net.

cheers, Phil.


User currently offlinePressclub From Belgium, joined Nov 2001, 774 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1681 times:

Skippy and Apuneger: Chapter 11 is not what you think it is. It is a kind of 'Concordaat' and not the end for the company.

Pressclub

According to a pressrelease I just got their flights continue as normal


User currently offlineBizJets From France, joined Jun 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1645 times:

You can read the filing online

http://news.findlaw.com/cnn/docs/united/120902ch11pet.pdf

Links aren't working for some reason.  Sad


User currently offlineLoneStarMike From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 3859 posts, RR: 34
Reply 13, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1627 times:

I have a dumb question.

Normally when a company has filed for bankruptcy, the trading of its stock is halted, yet I see where UAL stock is still being traded as of right now (12 mllion shares traded so far today.) Why is that?

LoneStarMike

User currently offlineCloudy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1591 times:

Trading in the stock of bankrupt companies does happen. Sometimes trading is halted "pending news" right before or after a bankruptcy filing but there is no rule saying bankrupt companies can't be traded. This is because technically, it is possible for there to be something left for the original stockholders after reorganization. But this is rare. If the company has enough assets to pay all of its creditors + some left for the owners, then there is seldom a reason to file for bankruptcy in the first place.

The final death of a stock, I believe, is delisting from the exchange - not a halt in trading. Those of you who are considering buying United stock in hopes of a Continental-like rebound should keep in mind that the ORIGINAL stockholders of a bankrupt company are nearly always left with nothing. If you believe in a turnaround and have money to burn - buy when NEW stock is issued as part of the reorganization. THAT was the stock you could have bought to make allot of money off of Continental, etc. It is still a huge risk but there is a real chance of making money that way.

Check out the Motley Fool website if you want to learn more. Enter Bankruptcy as a search term and you should be able to find a better explanation for this.


User currently offline727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 6555 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1489 times:

I'll bet the guy that started that Anti-United Airlines website is filled with glee.


Listen Betty, don't start up with your 'White Zone' s*** again.
User currently offlineMSY-MSP From United States of America, joined Jun 2002, 151 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1471 times:

I just read the bankruptcy filing. Very interesting. I also have my contact in the Bankruptcy court who read the proposed reorginization plan. It is very interesting according to him. We will hear more about the plan following the first hearing with the judge regarding access to the DIP financing.

On a side note, in the list of affiliated companies co-filing for chapter 11 one of the companies is AIR WISCONSIN, INC. I did not know that they were going to file also with UAL. If anyone knows the reason for this i would be interested to hear. IT is on page 4 of the petiton.

MSY-MSP


User currently offlineLoneStarMike From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 3859 posts, RR: 34
Reply 17, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 1420 times:

Trading in the stock of bankrupt companies does happen. Sometimes trading is halted "pending news" right before or after a bankruptcy filing but there is no rule saying bankrupt companies can't be traded. This is because technically, it is possible for there to be something left for the original stockholders after reorganization. But this is rare.

Thanks for the great explanation, Cloudy, and now that you mention it, I believe someone on another board had said that the America West bankruptcy several years ago was like that, where there was actually some money left for the orignal stockholders.

LoneStarMike

User currently offlineArsenal@LHR From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 7792 posts, RR: 20
Reply 18, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 1420 times:
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Depressing news.  Sad
UA is one of my favourite carriers.



In Arsene we trust!!
User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7801 posts, RR: 16
Reply 19, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 1387 times:

From what I read this morning in the Washington Post it said United is planning for a 18 month stint in Chapter 11. Makes me wonder why they aren't trying to do a fast track reorg like USAirways is doing. Can anybody speculate as to why.


Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineMSY-MSP From United States of America, joined Jun 2002, 151 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 1355 times:

The main reason they are looking at a longer period of time in Chapter 11 is the complexity of some of thier debt issues. THe other reason is the shear size of UAL. The larger the company, the larger the debts, the longer it takes to sucessfully work your way out of bankruptcy.

The first thing UAL will need to do in bankruptcy is get the DIP court approved. THe second thing is to meet with the secured comittee, and negotiate with them repayment/forgiveness terms on their debts. Then they will need to meet with the unsecured comittee and work the same deal. Also during this time UAL will trim its costs. It will do this anyway it can. As others have speculated, there are many areas where this will occur, some we know about, but some will suprise even the best of us. The amount of debt here is amazing, and the time required will be extensive. That is why they are looking at 18 months.

MSY-MSP


User currently offlineJjbiv From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 1226 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 1336 times:

That's rather shocking that Air Whiskey is also filing with UAL. Anyone have any more information?

joe


User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5843 posts, RR: 28
Reply 22, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 1286 times:

MSY-MSP and Jjbiv,

I'm only making an educated guess, but I would imagine that the Air Wisconsin Inc. refers to a corporation that UAL formed to own AWA in 1992. Today it is probably just a shell corporation that UAL kept active and could use if needed.

I believe the corporate names involved with owning and operating AirWisc today are:
Air Wisconsin Airlines Corporation
and
CJT Holdings, Inc.

Note the name difference between the 2 Air Wisconsins.




"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineMSY-MSP From United States of America, joined Jun 2002, 151 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 1266 times:

That is what I thought, but when I read the petition it made me think otherwise. I just had to ask, in case I missed something on the ownership. Thanks for the input. Glad to see they aren't in this too.

MSY-MSP


User currently offlineBlatantEcho From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 1920 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (11 years 11 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 1264 times:

here's to hoping Chap 11 will also force them to reorganize their website.

George



They're not handing trophies out today
25 Post contains images Apuneger : Pressclub and Lapper: I knew that one (National,...); I just think Skippy777 got me goin' Anyway, I heard that BRU flights will resume as usual. Ivan
26 Gigneil : Is Air Wisconsin no longer a wholly owned subsidiary of UAL? N
27 Post contains links FATFlyer : AWA was purchased from UAL in 1993. For more details, check this link at their website. http://www.airwis.com/corporate.htm
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