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WN Bag Cart Hits DL 73S @ FLL  
User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 1721 times:

Hey gang....

was just talking with a ramp sup for US, and he was telling me that a runaway Southwest bag cart collided with a Delta 737-200A, causing a 4 foot gash in the fuselage...

that's one more 737-200 for the scrap yard

22 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineScottysAir From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 1708 times:

What's happening for today at FLL with SW cart did got hit by the near of B732 aircraft? Is that was anything of the damage or not? Can you somebody please tell me exactly want to known goes on for today. Please let us know! Thanks!!

User currently offlineSaab340 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 320 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1694 times:

How much damage is needed to scrap an aircraft?

User currently offlineDC10Tony From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1012 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1674 times:

BULLSHIT!

There's no way that could have put a 4 foot gash in a 737, here's why. If that was a baggage cart, and it was a "runaway" it could not build up enough momemtum to put even a significant dent in a 737 because the tongues of baggage carts swivel on about a 300 degree arc. So if it was rolling fast, the tongue would be on the pavement and swerve from side to side, and would not to any major damage to anything it hits. Baggage carts also have rubber ends on the top edges of the cart, so if that hit a plane, it would not make a gash. 737s have pretty tough bodies too.

That supervisor lied to you.


User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1670 times:

Stuff like this is commonly referered to as "ramp rash" and the damage to an aircraft varies.

If the aircraft is hit by something that's unpowered, like a bag cart being blown into the fuselage by surface winds or jet blast, the ensuing damage will most likely be a scrape or a dent in the fuselage versus a puncture. Impact speed is a factor.

If an aircraft is hit with a powered piece of ground equipment like a tug, belt loader, or lav cart, the impact force is greater, and you're more likely looking at more serious damage like a punctured fuselage or popped rivets.

Aircraft are not written off for these relatively minor types of damage. If the damage is severe enough where rivets are popped or the fuselage is punctured, the aircraft will usually be flown out as an unpressurized maintenance ferry to an airport where repairs can be made, assuming it's not already at an airport where it can be accomplished.

The only time I can think of an incident where ground damage was bad enough to write-off an aircraft was at DEN 2-3 years ago. A taxiing 727 (freighter) was hit broadside in the nose by a fast-moving bus or truck on the ramp, and the impact was bad enough to break the captain's left leg.

I'll see if I can find some pictures....


User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1665 times:

Longer ago than I thought, late 1997...

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © AirNikon



User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1654 times:

then why did Delta have to get 45 hotel rooms in Ft. lauderdale tonight? Just call the old Howard Johnson on SE 17th Street causeway...........

I've seen FOD happen and cause a plane to get scrapped.

Someone left a footstool for the Metro 23 out and the engine started up, got swept up and slammed into the fuselage, causing a 3 foot gash and damaging the prop, it's gear box, and the fuselage...

-some of our employees were playing on the Ramp in duluth and hit one of our Brasilias with a wheelchair (no less) and it caused so much damage they had to have a cargo plane bring in a NEW spinner, gear box, and new blade

----
I'll talk w/ my buddies who are supervisors at Southwest tonight @ the airport and see if they can clarify..

-nate


User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1637 times:

well i just called Southwest ops (counter probably wouldn't know anything) and she said they're under a gag order.. so *something* happened today that is being investigated by the DOT/FAA....

-nate


User currently offlineDoug_or From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3402 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 1631 times:

dc-10- I've seen dolly with a similar tongue go pretty fast in the wind.... as long as the tongue is faceing "backwards" it tracks relatively straight.


When in doubt, one B pump off
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 1627 times:

The cart hit the aircraft earlier in the day, and the aircraft was damaged sufficiently where it had to be maintenance ferried to ATL for permanent repairs...

Given that this happened so much earlier in the day, I'm not sure the 45 hotel rooms you mentioned has anything to do with it.


User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 1610 times:

Oh yeah, back to that 727 at DEN...

Look how far the nosewheel got pushed... That bus must have been hauling butt...

http://aviation-safety.net/database/1997/971001-0.htm


User currently offlineHkgspotter1 From Hong Kong, joined Nov 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 1606 times:

Thats not very good is it !!

User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days ago) and read 1575 times:

well, the person who told me about is a US ramp sup, and they're on other side of Delta, so of course he either saw it happen and heard about the damage 2nd hand, or he was told the story from someone who was there.

But still, no one at Southwest is saying a thing...


User currently offlineAC320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (11 years 8 months 5 days ago) and read 1559 times:

What was a Southwest cart doing anywhere near a DL plane? I thought SW was still operating out of concourse F on terminal 3, until their new B concourse at terminal 1 is finished? If you the runaway cart would have had to pass through the AA and US gates, then hang a 90 degree turn to hit a DL plane, unless it hit the plane while taxiing, but even then it would cross a few taxiways and some grass probably......

I'm confused


User currently offlineDL Widget head From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 2091 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (11 years 8 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1512 times:

It's true...ship #322 sustained damage by a WN baggage cart resulting in a hole in the fuselage measuring over 70in in length and 12in wide. The a/c was not ferried to ATL as previously posted and is currently undergoing repairs at FLL (at least enough to ferry to ATL).

User currently offlineDC10Tony From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1012 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (11 years 8 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1468 times:

SegmentKing-

I think if you call a hotel to ask if there's someone staying there, or why certained rooms were booked, I think they're not allowed to tell anyone who wants to know, but that's a different story.

You really called Southwest to ask about an incident? Of course they're under a gag order, you don't think they'd tell anyone who called what happened, do you?  Insane

DL Widget head-

A 5'10" by one foot gash? Come on, I think someone is exagerrating a little. Even if that baggage cart was loaded to capacity, moving at 25 MPH when it hit the 737, and had no rubber pieces on the top edges of the cart (making it easier to penetrate anything it hits), I seriously doubt it would make a gash that big. I'm not saying it didn't happen, but I find it extremely hard to believe.


User currently offlineGoingboeing From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4875 posts, RR: 16
Reply 16, posted (11 years 8 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1448 times:

SegmentKing...I think I'd read that you worked for UAL. If there was an incident involving UAL, would their legal department have a bit of an issue with a counter person making statements? Other places I've worked have had a standing order that anyone inquiring about incidents were to be referred to a specific person or department. I never though of you as one of the "black helicopter" types.

User currently offlineDL_Mech From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 1937 posts, RR: 9
Reply 17, posted (11 years 8 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1346 times:

WN Bag Cart.....Made of plate steel

DL 732 Fuselage....Made of aluminum

Which one do you think gets the gash?



This plane is built to withstand anything... except a bad pilot.
User currently offlineHlywdCatft From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 5321 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (11 years 8 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1328 times:

How can a baggage cart gain much momentum being that this is in the ultra flat Fort Lauderdale?

User currently offlineUAL Bagsmasher From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 2146 posts, RR: 10
Reply 19, posted (11 years 8 months 4 days ago) and read 1321 times:

Some jetblast or a strong gust of wind against a cart with Inop./weak brakes will set it flying pretty quickly. I've seen it happen.

User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (11 years 8 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1240 times:

Nah, i'm not with United. I got in trouble years ago when I was working for UAX and one of our 1900s was involved in a fatal crash, so I learned my lesson. I'm an 'independent contractor' per se with the airlines, I just do work on the side for them when i'm not working on a project for a start up out of Chicago.

-nate


User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (11 years 8 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1233 times:

In regards to the hotel, I was trying to find a hotel room for one of the mechanics for a company associated w/ one I do some work with (just being helpful) ... I normally got the best airline rates @ the HoJo, so called them, and they volunteered the info over the phone......

anyway, Southwest also uses concourse "E" at FLL, although Delta is just around the corner.

Delta also parks one of its planes in the holding pad between E / F concourses now....

-n


User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (11 years 8 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 1210 times:

back again,

reason I called WN Ops in FLL is i know a large deal of their supervisors and ops folks (non-work related) and they normally let me know what's going on, so I figured it was worth a shot.

No one is still talking, but I'm wondering if a bag cart strayed and hit one of their parked planes in the E/F static ramp.... i mean, the winds DO get strong in FLL.... strong enough to send one flying across a ramp if the tongue isn't locked in the 'up' position...


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