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737 Mid-air And The World's Luckiest Pilot  
User currently offlineBackfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3748 times:

No-one here seems to have mentioned the TAAG Angolan 737 which hit a Cessna 404 at 11,000ft over Namibia a few days ago.

The Cessna pilot landed his badly-damaged aircraft safely - as for the 737, it continued to its destination. How's that for good fortune?

26 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePakistania From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 3650 times:

Interesting.
Do you have some more details about it ?
will also do a little searchwork



User currently offlineBackfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3539 times:

Angolan 737 was operating Windhoek-Luanda. Hit the C404 (originated from Eros/Windhoek domestic airport) with its wing, wrecking the tail.

Very, very, very lucky.


User currently offlineEGGD From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2001, 12443 posts, RR: 35
Reply 3, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3508 times:

Well, sometimes it just happens like that.

Does anyone remember the Royal Airforce aircraft that hit a helicopter killing its occupants, without even noticing?

hmmm.....


User currently offlineBrentspeed From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 79 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3506 times:

Talk about a story for Miller Time!!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


User currently offlineBackfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3358 times:

Well, sometimes it just happens like that.

Yes but the point is that it's extraordinarily rare for both aircraft to get away with it, especially given the contrast in size and speed between a commercial airliner and a light twin.

Incidentally the aircraft/helicopter collision you mentioned involved a small propeller-driven RAF Tucano trainer, and the impact did not kill the helicopter crew - it made a successful emergency landing.

You might have been thinking about the RAF Tornado which hit a Cessna over the UK, killing the crews of both the Tornado and the light aircraft.


User currently offlineMEA-707 From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4341 posts, RR: 35
Reply 6, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3312 times:

More amazing stuff has happened... In 1973, a Spantax Convair 990 and an Aviaco DC-9 had a mid air collision. While the DC-9 perished, the 990 made a safe emergency landing with about a third of its wing having been torn off ! Still the Spantax pilots had little to be proud of, check http://aviation-safety.net/database/1973/730305-2.htm.


nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
User currently offlineBR715-A1-30 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3283 times:

as for the 737, it continued to its destination.

Man, Talk about HIT AND RUN.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


User currently offlinePositive rate From Australia, joined Sep 2001, 2143 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 3189 times:

This is indeed a very rare case. In the majority of mid air collisions 1 aircraft is nearly always destroyed and a lot of the time both aircraft end up crashing. I don't think relative size of the aircraft has anything to do with it- look at the Aeromexico DC-9 which collided with the Archer, the PSA 727 which collided with the C172, or a Piedmont 727 which collided with a Baron back in the 1960's. There was a recent mid-air at Bankstown airport in Australia between a Piper PA28 Warrior and a Socata TB10 Tobago. The TB10 emerged almost unscathed whilst the PA28 crashed and its 4 occupants perished. The main factor in a mid-air is what point on the aircraft the impact is taken. The PSA 727 hit with the leading edge of the starboard wing severing fuel lines in the process. The Aeromexico DC-9 hit with its horizontal stabiliser which then detached from the plane causing the DC-9 to dive into the ground. As long as the impact doesn't involve any major flight controls then it should be survivable except of course if it occurs at cruising altitude where the high airspeeds involved mean chance of survival is 0 if a mid-air happens, this is what happened between the BA Trident and Adria DC-9 over Yugoslavia in 1976(combined speed was about 1200MPH!)

User currently offlineKaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 12515 posts, RR: 35
Reply 9, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3142 times:

There was a mid air collision survival very early in the jet age, when an Air Algerie Caravelle landed safely at Orly, south of Paris, after surviving a mid air collision. The whole top of the aircraft was burning.

User currently offlineAlaskaairlines From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2054 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3121 times:

Yes, the pilots sure had there day of there career!

-Dmitry


User currently offlineBackfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3086 times:

I don't think relative size of the aircraft has anything to do with it

If it doesn't then that means the Conservation of Momentum, one of the fundamental principles of physics, has been wrong all these years.

The fact is that if you're in a small aircraft and you get hit by a bigger one, your chances of escaping unscathed are minimal. That's why such collisions rarely see both aircraft survive. Correct me if I'm wrong but in the DC-9/Archer collision and the PSA accident, neither light aircraft survived the impact. The C404 over Namibia did - that's the difference.


User currently offlineEGGD From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2001, 12443 posts, RR: 35
Reply 12, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2991 times:

Backfire - The helicopter crew all perished, but the Tornadoes crew survived and landed safely, without even realizing they had hit something (suspected birdstrike)!.

odd odd world..

But then again, we have things that seemed like they were meant to be. There was the KLM/Pan Am Collision where a string of events for nearly a day led up to the final accident, and the 757/tu-154 collision over the German/Swiss Border where somehow both managed to collide despite being given many warnings to avoid the collision (one goes up, other goes down, then other goes up etc etc etc).

Spooky stuff..


User currently offlineBackfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2987 times:

The helicopter crew all perished, but the Tornado crew survived and landed safely, without even realizing they had hit something

Exactly when did this happen? I don't recollect any such event, and I've been through a fair number of records. Where did it happen, and was it recent?

I know that in the RAF Tucano/helicopter incident the Tucano carried on without realising what had happened. But I can assure you that the helicopter crew did survive.


User currently offlineEGGD From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2001, 12443 posts, RR: 35
Reply 14, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2981 times:

Backfire - As far as I know it occured on the 23nd of June 1993 at 11am, involving RAF Tornado ZG754 and a Jetranger 206B helicoptor, G-BHYW. The collision occured near Kendal, Cumbria.

Sorry I couldn't have been of any more help  Laugh out loud

Dan.


User currently offlineBackfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2970 times:

That's further back than I expected...thanks for the information Big grin

User currently offlinePositive rate From Australia, joined Sep 2001, 2143 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 2881 times:

There was another mid-air from back in the 1970's that i just remembered. An ANA 727(i think) collided with a Japanese Airforce F4 Phantom. The 727 crashed with the loss of all on board whilst the F4 pilots managed to eject after the collision crippled their aircraft.

User currently offlineHkgspotter1 From Hong Kong, joined Nov 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 2878 times:

It was not a major carrier or location so the press don't care.

User currently offlineKaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 12515 posts, RR: 35
Reply 18, posted (11 years 9 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2807 times:

I remember reading some time ago on PPRuNe, on a thread about MK Air, one of its DC8s suffered a birdstrike. Nothing terribly unusual about that, except that people were a little concerned because the bird was in its nest in a tree at the time! Maybe it should be a case of a bird suffering a planestrike!

User currently offlineRick767 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2000, 2662 posts, RR: 51
Reply 19, posted (11 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2670 times:

"as for the 737, it continued to its destination"

Deryck Leathers of the Airline Pilots' Association of South Africa quite rightly chastised the 737 crew for such reckless behaviour.

How completely irresponsible to continue to your destination having suffered a mid-air collision without knowing the extent of the damage to your own aircraft and therefore subsequently putting the lives of your passengers at totally unnecessary risk.

Makes you wonder... it really does.



I used to love the smell of Jet-A in the morning...
User currently offlineAirbus_A340 From Hong Kong, joined Mar 2000, 1560 posts, RR: 20
Reply 20, posted (11 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2659 times:

"The World's Luckiest Pilot"

I wouldn't say so after being hit by a 737  Smile But yes, he's lucky to have escaped disaster!

Airbus_A340



People. They make an airline. www.cathaypacific.com
User currently offlineHkgspotter1 From Hong Kong, joined Nov 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (11 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2622 times:

Could have been a ex SQ pilot !!. You know, strike a tail stand during the taxi and continue with the departure  Nuts

User currently offlineBhill From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 990 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (11 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 2504 times:

Backfire...regarding the Conservation of Momentum.. F=ma...size does not matter...if a pea hit an aircraft at tremendous velocity is could be just as catastrophic as a larger object moving slower...

bhill



Carpe Pices
User currently offlineDC-10 Levo From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2001, 3432 posts, RR: 3
Reply 23, posted (11 years 9 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 2498 times:

That pilot sure is lucky.
I wouldn't have thought that the 737 would have carried on to its destination though.

DC-10


User currently offlineBackfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (11 years 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 2457 times:

Bhill:

This discussion was purely about the chances of a small aeroplane escaping a collision with a big aeroplane - that's all. Given a constant typical aircraft speed, it's mass (size) which makes the difference.

Never mind collision dynamics equations. You can prove it by jumping out in front of a skateboarder. And then doing the same with a bus.


25 Post contains images Star_world : backfire - if you're going to dismiss someone's opinion, at least do it right! Mass and size have nothing to do with each other... Both are relevant b
26 Post contains images Backfire : Star_world: Thanks for the clarification. Since I have a degree in physics, I'm reassured that such things are still as true today as they were in uni
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