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What New In Iraq With Helicopters?  
User currently offlinePJFlysFast From United States of America, joined May 2006, 463 posts, RR: 1
Posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 3763 times:

So what is new? I have not heard much about helicopters in Iraq lately and I was just wondering how things are working. I read somewhere lately that the insurgents have developed new tactics and weapons that are very sophisticated. For example I read that they set up these ambushes for them when they fly over by shooting at them with machine guns, AK-47's and RPG's and that gets the crew distracted and while they are busy countering these threats they shoot up a new heat seeking missile that was given to this certain cell of terrorists by a Saudi prince and the weapon in made in Russia. I know that we have encountered these types of missiles before but I the counter measuares used were not intended for this missile.

6 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13184 posts, RR: 77
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 3747 times:

Don't know about any of that, but if there is an increased threat, it's most probably aided and abetted by Iran-or elements within it's complex security/intel structures.
Who are the real winners in this now nearly 6 year folly.
And don't let any politico/think tank person who thought this was all such a good idea, tell you any different.

A Channel 4 programme shown in the UK yesterday, did feature the reporter (along with UK Foreign secretary David Milliband), flying around in a RAF chopper but in all honesty, what they showed in countermeasures, did not look too different from any other operational theater, from Afghanistan to RAF helicopters in Northern Ireland in the 1980's and 90's.

There just so many man-portable SAM's out there, in these theaters, from the 'AK-47' of the MANPAD world, the old, largely now ineffective SA-7 (and it's Chinese copy), to rather more effective SA-16 models onwards.
With likely a whole bunch of groups involved in their supply and use.

Let's just hope it is the case that all those Stingers the US supplied to Afghanistan in the 1980's, really are time expired in the area of critical components. (Though apparently, there were reports that a US chopper was brought down by one in Afghanistan as late as 2002).

But it does seem that gun and RPG fire has really been the most effective in terms of damaging or bringing down choppers, due really because there are just so many RPG's out there (the 'AK-47' of the anti tank rocket world).
These were never seen as a real threat to choppers before the US action in Somalia in 1993, although in truth only really close up in urban environments.
(Which seemed to be forgotten until Iraq in 2003).


User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4797 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3681 times:

Quoting PJFlysFast (Thread starter):
So what is new? I have not heard much about helicopters in Iraq lately and I was just wondering how things are working.

Here's what's new in the helo scene.....

Iraq – Helicopters and Related Munitions
(Source: US Defense Security Cooperation Agency; dated Dec. 10, web-posted Dec. 11, 2008)

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi...A&cat=3&prod=100570&modele=release

And perhaps this.....

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_AT-6B_Concept_Desert_lg.jpg
http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...es/AIR_AT-6B_Concept_Desert_lg.jpg

Iraq – Texan II Aircraft, Spare Parts and Other Support

.....to mitigate the havoc being wreaked by RPGs and manpads -- among other nice things.....

Iraq – M1A1 and Upgrade to M1A1M Abrams Tanks

Iraq – Coastal Patrol Boats, Offshore Support Vessels

[Edited 2008-12-13 22:17:36]


"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineUH60FtRucker From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 3617 times:

Flying a helicopter in Iraq is considerably safer today, than at any point during the war.

US helicopters feature the most advanced forms of ACE, that we've seen yet. Tactics have improved, and typically any helicopter being shot down these days can be traced to failures in proper tactics (ie: flying over the same ACP 5 times a day, for 5 weeks straight).

Mostly, gunships are providing support, Chinooks are flying night bulk transport, and utility birds are flying people and mail.

It's a lot less exciting, but in my opinion, that's a very good thing.


User currently offlineLumberton From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 4708 posts, RR: 20
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3604 times:



Quoting PJFlysFast (Thread starter):
I read somewhere lately that the insurgents have developed new tactics and weapons that are very sophisticated.

I remember reading this too--two years ago.

Is there something current?



"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
User currently offlinePJFlysFast From United States of America, joined May 2006, 463 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3429 times:

Well its good to hear that we are doing good with all that right now. I know that this is no easy task.

User currently offlineUH60FtRucker From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3401 times:

They don't have "new weapons" - they have the same deadly weapons that have threatened helicopters for decades: large caliber guns, RPGs, and manpads. The only significant note is that Iran has been caught providing some of those weapons.

As for tactics, of course they improve and evolve their tactics. They watch and learn from our tactics, and respond accordingly. It's the natural progression of the battlefield.

But in the end, rotary wing assets are benefiting most from the overall reduction in violence, in Iraq. In fact, in general, soldiers in Iraq are probably safer today than at any point in this war.


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