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First Boeing P-8 Poseidon Out Of Factory  
User currently offlineAeroplaneFreak From Australia, joined Sep 2006, 546 posts, RR: 0
Posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 18794 times:
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It looks like the first P-8 is out of the factory.

http://boeingforums.com/board/showthread.php?t=8

P.S

Sorry you can now view the forum

[Edited 2009-04-20 20:07:45]

47 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21590 posts, RR: 59
Reply 1, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 18721 times:

This plane looks like it has some kind of raked wingtip instead of winglets. Is that right?


Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5951 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 18696 times:
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Yes...the P-8 has raked wingtips. All P-8's will have raked wingtips.

User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21590 posts, RR: 59
Reply 3, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 18591 times:



Quoting Wedgetail737 (Reply 2):
Yes...the P-8 has raked wingtips. All P-8's will have raked wingtips.

Thank you kindly, sir.  Smile



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineAeroplaneFreak From Australia, joined Sep 2006, 546 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 18444 times:
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It has the body of the 800 and the wings of a 900 but not ranked wintips.

User currently offlineRoseflyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9829 posts, RR: 52
Reply 5, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 18434 times:

Good to see the bird out the doors again after the first round of testing. She is extremely close to her first flight. Just weeks away!

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 1):
This plane looks like it has some kind of raked wingtip instead of winglets. Is that right?

Yes the airplane does have unique 737 wingtips that are raked. The reason is that the airplane has to be able to operate at low altitudes during icing conditions which are not conducive to winglets.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineAirTran737 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3708 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 18213 times:
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Quoting AeroplaneFreak (Reply 4):
It has the body of the 800 and the wings of a 900 but not ranked wintips

Looked raked to me

http://lh4.ggpht.com/kobus.nl/Ros55PkUfQI/AAAAAAAABPs/TjZmfDntBj0/p-8a%20poseidon.jpg



Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
User currently offlineBlueSky1976 From Poland, joined Jul 2004, 1912 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 18115 times:

Is it me or does the main landing gear legs seem to be a little taller in comparison to the regular -800? Looking at the engines, the ground clearance seems to be a tad bigger...


Now get your f***ing Jumbo Jet off my airport!!! - AC/DC "Ain't No Fun To Be a Millionaire"
User currently offlineSinlock From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 1652 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 18013 times:



Quoting AeroplaneFreak (Reply 4):
It has the body of the 800 and the wings of a 900 but not ranked wintips.

The P-8 most sure has the Raked wingtips. The only diffrences between the 800 and the 900's wing is internal.

Quoting BlueSky1976 (Reply 7):
Is it me or does the main landing gear legs seem to be a little taller in comparison to the regular -800? Looking at the engines, the ground clearance seems to be a tad bigger...

I'd say it's just the lack of fuel, and cabin fittings that makes it sit high on the gear. Some aircraft can can move over a foot depending how much they weigh.



My Country can beat up your Country....
User currently offlineDiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1638 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 17917 times:

Can't wait to see this thing all decked out with the missiles, torpedoes and mines that it can carry. Gives a whole new meaning to the 737. Hopefully it lasts as long as the P-3's have.


-DiamondFlyer


User currently offlineANITIX87 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 3309 posts, RR: 13
Reply 10, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 17861 times:
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Is the P-3 capable of operating off of carriers since it is a prop? Or am I completely mistaken in thinking so.

If I am correct, which I doubt, how will the P-8's lack of carrier launch ability affect it's use?

TIS



www.stellaryear.com: Canon EOS 50D, Canon EOS 5DMkII, Sigma 50mm 1.4, Canon 24-70 2.8L II, Canon 100mm 2.8L, Canon 100-4
User currently offlineRoseflyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9829 posts, RR: 52
Reply 11, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 17828 times:



Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 10):
Is the P-3 capable of operating off of carriers since it is a prop? Or am I completely mistaken in thinking so.

Not even close to carrier capable. You might be thinking of the E2 Hawkeye.

Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 10):
If I am correct, which I doubt, how will the P-8's lack of carrier launch ability affect it's use?

The P8A can do arial refueling. Also, don't forget that there are 737s in commercial use that operate scheduled transatlantic flights that last 8 hours. It can get where it is needed and is a lot faster than a P-3 while doing it.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5951 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 17516 times:
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Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 11):
The P8A can do arial refueling. Also, don't forget that there are 737s in commercial use that operate scheduled transatlantic flights that last 8 hours. It can get where it is needed and is a lot faster than a P-3 while doing it.

The P-8 isn't the only 737 capable of in-flight refueling. The AEW&C airplane (like Australia's Wedgetail) can also be refueled in-flight.

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 5):
Yes the airplane does have unique 737 wingtips that are raked.

They are raked wingtips.


User currently offlineA342 From Germany, joined Jul 2005, 4722 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 17046 times:

And it's in the air! That was quick!

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...rst-boeing-p-8a-gets-airborne.html



Exceptions confirm the rule.
User currently offlineElpinDAB From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 485 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 16908 times:



Quoting AeroplaneFreak (Reply 4):
It has the body of the 800 and the wings of a 900 but not ranked wintips.

That seems like a winning combo, and one that could be beneficial on the BBJ/BBJ2's, which are optimized for range. The blended winglets of the 737's are best for climb, while the raked wing tips of the 764/772LR/773ER are better for reducing induced drag during the cruise portion of flight.

How much range will the P8 have? It seems like it would have alot, since it will be optimized for long range recon missions over the open seas.

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 5):
Yes the airplane does have unique 737 wingtips that are raked. The reason is that the airplane has to be able to operate at low altitudes during icing conditions which are not conducive to winglets.

I originally read that the P8 would have raked wingtips for increased range, and not for the reason that you stated. I'm just wondering how an aircraft with hot wings could be vulnerable to low-altitude icing? The main portions of the wing would be heated, thus eliminating icing, although it seems that either a blended winglet or raked wingtip would be un-heated, allowing for ice build-up, in which case neither would provide any significant increase in performance.


This is a really cool plane! I wonder if Boeing will use this 738 fuselage/ 739 wing w/ raked wingtip on a commercial or VIP variant? It seems like a nice platform.


User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined exactly 15 years ago today! , 2994 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (5 years 8 months 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 16903 times:



Quoting ElpinDAB (Reply 14):
although it seems that either a blended winglet or raked wingtip would be un-heated, allowing for ice build-up, in which case neither would provide any significant increase in performance.

The APB wimglets are unheated, however I'm not sure whether the raked wingtips are. I'd be surprised after identifying an issue with wingtip icing, if the clean-slate raked wingtip design wasn't heated. It would be a simple bleed air duct extension after all.

Could also be thinking ahead. Raked tips interfere less with side-looking scanners.



The last of the famous international playboys
User currently offlineZANL188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3594 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 16767 times:
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Some pix to illustrate the discussion....


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Andrew W. Sieber
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Joe G. Walker




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User currently offlineZANL188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3594 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 16750 times:
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First flight pix and timeline here....

http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/fl...oeing-p-8a-poseidon-makes-fir.html



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User currently offlineANITIX87 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 3309 posts, RR: 13
Reply 18, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 16714 times:
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Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 11):
Not even close to carrier capable. You might be thinking of the E2 Hawkeye.

Must have been that. Thanks for the correction.

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 11):
The P8A can do arial refueling.

Makes sense. Does the Navy have KC-135's to do refueling? I thought all of these belonged to the Air Force.

TIS



www.stellaryear.com: Canon EOS 50D, Canon EOS 5DMkII, Sigma 50mm 1.4, Canon 24-70 2.8L II, Canon 100mm 2.8L, Canon 100-4
User currently offlineMCIGuy From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 1936 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 16685 times:

The opening act for the 787 rollout.  Silly


Airliners.net Moderator Team
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 16590 times:



Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 5):
Yes the airplane does have unique 737 wingtips that are raked. The reason is that the airplane has to be able to operate at low altitudes during icing conditions which are not conducive to winglets.



Quoting ElpinDAB (Reply 14):
I originally read that the P8 would have raked wingtips for increased range, and not for the reason that you stated. I'm just wondering how an aircraft with hot wings could be vulnerable to low-altitude icing? The main portions of the wing would be heated, thus eliminating icing, although it seems that either a blended winglet or raked wingtip would be un-heated, allowing for ice build-up, in which case neither would provide any significant increase in performance.

I don't know that low-level icing is the real issue here. On the NG family (the non-military ones, that is) the most outboard L/E slats are NOT heated. If that's also the case with the P8, deciding not to equip them with winglets due to an inability to heat the winglet becomes a moot point. If Boeing decided to equip the P8s with A/I on *all* L/E slats, then the winglet heat issue becomes a possibility.

Quoting Spacepope (Reply 15):
Could also be thinking ahead. Raked tips interfere less with side-looking scanners.

That'd be my guess.

Anyone notice in the above pictures that there's a small bulge in the outboard #1 engine nacelle, but no similar bulge on the outboard nacelle of the #2 engine. If the bulge was an antenna, you'd think there would also be one there on the outboard side of #2. That leads me to wonder if #2 has a similar bulge, but on the *inboard* side of the nacelle. If so, both engines (viewed from the front) would appear identical, suggesting that the bulge on each engine nacelle is to accomodate additional accessories like two electrical generators per engine (versus the "normal" one). With all the electronic gear that'll undoubtedly be aboard, it stands to reason that they'd need the additional capability over the stock 737.


User currently offlineZANL188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3594 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 16543 times:
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Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 20):
If so, both engines (viewed from the front) would appear identical, suggesting that the bulge on each engine nacelle is to accomodate additional accessories like two electrical generators per engine (versus the "normal" one). With all the electronic gear that'll undoubtedly be aboard, it stands to reason that they'd need the additional capability over the stock 737.

  

The Wedgetail & Turkish AWACS airplanes also had the nacelle bulge to accomodate the increased electrical generating capacity.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jet City Aviation Photography



[Edited 2009-04-26 17:13:07]


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User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 16515 times:



Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 21):
The Wedgetail & Turkish AWACS airplanes also had the nacelle bulge to accomodate the increased electrical generating capacity.

Thanks...

Any idea if the APU is likewise equipped with a second electrical generator to provide the same 4-generator level of redundancy in case of an engine shutdown?


User currently offlineCCA From Hong Kong, joined Oct 2002, 846 posts, RR: 14
Reply 23, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 16511 times:



Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 20):
Anyone notice in the above pictures that there's a small bulge in the outboard #1 engine nacelle, but no similar bulge on the outboard nacelle of the #2 engine. If the bulge was an antenna, you'd think there would also be one there on the outboard side of #2. That leads me to wonder if #2 has a similar bulge, but on the *inboard* side of the nacelle. If so, both engines (viewed from the front) would appear identical, suggesting that the bulge on each engine nacelle is to accomodate additional accessories like two electrical generators per engine (versus the "normal" one). With all the electronic gear that'll undoubtedly be aboard, it stands to reason that they'd need the additional capability over the stock 737.

Yes you're correct it's on the left side of both engines.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/34080950@N04/3474040785/in/photostream/



C152 G115 TB10 CAP10 SR-22 Be76 PA-34 NDN-1T C500 A330-300 A340-300 -600 B747-200F -200SF -400 -400F -400BCF -400ERF -8F
User currently offlineZANL188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3594 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (5 years 8 months 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 16462 times:
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Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 22):
Any idea if the APU is likewise equipped with a second electrical generator to provide the same 4-generator level of redundancy in case of an engine shutdown?

I suspect they'd be shedding loads and beating feet to the nearest airfield if they had to shut one down. The additional generating capacity is for mission equipment not flight...



Legal considerations provided by: Dewey, Cheatum, and Howe
25 PolymerPlane : How many P-8 has already been built? The pictures in the OP looks like it's already painted while the first flight pictures shows that it is still in
26 StudeDave : That is my understanding. I can't remember where I saw the information, though. The first one is not yet painted, the second one is...
27 757GB : I can't find the source right now, but I'm sure I've read that the "unpainted" P8 was the one that flew. The painted one has not flown yet.
28 DEVILFISH : See the link in Reply 13. Flightglobal's description is conflicting..... Quote: "Boeing has built two P-8A flight test aircraft -- T-1 and T-2. The l
29 Post contains links and images DEVILFISH : Didn't see this in time for my previous post..... View Large View MediumPhoto © Jeremy Lindgren / New England Airports
30 StudeDave : That could've been it, thanks. Between this thread and the one in CivAv I wasn't too sure where I saw it what I though I did...
31 Usnseallt82 : Its about freakin time. Now when we'll actually get to fly it in the fleet is a whole 'nuther discussion altogether. This thing is taking forever to
32 Spacepope : Amazing. This is sure a hybrid! -900 wings, -800 fuselage length, -700 center fuselage section (only one overwing exit). Puts my Lego sets when growin
33 ElpinDAB : I just noticed that the 800 and 900 both have the same wing span. Is there a difference between the two aircraft's wings? (Besides the P-8 having rak
34 DfwRevolution : The -900 is the exact same wing as the -800. The -900ER wing has been reinforced to allow for an additional ~14,000 lbs in max take-off weight. I do
35 Wedgetail737 : The P-8A has already flown once from Renton to BFI.
36 Spacepope : What does this have to do with what you quoted? The Wedgetail has flown lots of times too, but it's still not yet "in the fleet".
37 Usnseallt82 : I think he covers this for me... Thanks. The P-8 hasn't flown in the fleet yet, meaning any type of operational status. That takes lots of testing an
38 HAWK21M : This is one keenly awaited type by the IAF.I think they've ordered eight. regds MEL.
39 Post contains links and images 11Bravo : Another nice pic in full USN paint: View Large View MediumPhoto © Andrew W. Sieber Cool looking jet; it'll be even cooler with a couple of Harpoo
40 SP90 : Anyone have an idea why they have those two really big window on either side between the wing and L1/R1 doors is for? They look almost as big as the e
41 ZANL188 : Scanner window. Good for photography, visual searches, etc.
42 SP90 : Thanks. Wish they would put that into the civilian models too.
43 KC135TopBoom : No, the USN does not have any KC-135s (they used to have one KC-135A for electronic fleet exercises but not refueling) all of the E-6B and P-8A air r
44 Venus6971 : Given the low reguard that Navy personnel take in ACFT apperance that will probably the best that acft will look until it comes out of a D check late
45 StudeDave : Yeah-- 'cuz looks are everything. Don't fly it if it ain't pretty? Plus~ white paint it so easy to maintain on birds that are in the air as much as t
46 Post contains links DEVILFISH : They may not care too much about how their aircraft look, but the Navy certainly cared about where their P-8As would stay until their D-Checks after
47 11Bravo : I believe that is a maintenance hanger. I suspect the operational units will be out on the flight-line just like the P-3s.
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