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A-10 And Harm  
User currently offlineEpten From Macedonia, joined Sep 2007, 184 posts, RR: 0
Posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 6271 times:

Can A-10 carry and launch AGM-88?

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12150 posts, RR: 51
Reply 1, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6239 times:

No, I don't think it can carry the HARM. I doubt the A-10 has the avionics or weapons pylons required to target and launch that missile. Also the A-10 does not have an attack radar. From a weight point of view, it can,

User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16872 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 6231 times:

What aircraft do carry the HARM?..

F-15E?
F-16?
F-18?
EA-6B?



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User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined Dec 1999, 2930 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 6184 times:

Don't think the F-15E does, but the rest of your list can.

Add:
EF-18G
Tornado
MQ-9?
F-4E
The F-35 is slated to carry it too.



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User currently offlineMechatNEW From United States of America, joined May 2005, 101 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 6036 times:

The retired A-7E Corsiar, and A-6E Intruder could alos carry the HARM.

User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12150 posts, RR: 51
Reply 5, posted (4 years 9 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5833 times:

The F-105F Wild Weasels also carried an early version of HARM back during the Vietnam War, too.

User currently offlineEBJ1248650 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1932 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (4 years 9 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 5795 times:



Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 5):
The F-105F Wild Weasels also carried an early version of HARM back during the Vietnam War, too.

You're talking about Standard Arm, I presume? Standard Arm and HARM have two entirely different external configurations so I'm not sure how they're related. And we had that missile on our F-105Gs at George right up to retirement of the plane.



Dare to dream; dream big!
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15745 posts, RR: 27
Reply 7, posted (4 years 9 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 5710 times:



Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 5):
The F-105F Wild Weasels also carried an early version of HARM back during the Vietnam War, too

Those would probably also have carried Shrikes as well, but neither is the same as the HARM.

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 1):
No, I don't think it can carry the HARM. I doubt the A-10 has the avionics or weapons pylons required to target and launch that missile. Also the A-10 does not have an attack radar. From a weight point of view, it can,

Plus, that is not really a part of the A-10's mission nor are large radar guided SAMs a major threat to them. At the altitudes where A-10s operate they are much more likely to be hit by AAA or smaller IR guided SAMs, including MANPADS.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineXT6Wagon From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 3409 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (4 years 9 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5371 times:



Quoting BMI727 (Reply 7):
Plus, that is not really a part of the A-10's mission nor are large radar guided SAMs a major threat to them. At the altitudes where A-10s operate they are much more likely to be hit by AAA or smaller IR guided SAMs, including MANPADS.

in actual use against "front line" military nations, the radar guided missile has proven to be the big killer of A10. They fly high to keep the SA)">AA from eating them alive and the assumption was that the dedicated anti-SAM efforts would keep the A10 safe at higher alititudes (10K ft or higher). Reality set in that during the 92 gulf war the SA-2 wasn't properly in the A10's warning system and plenty of them were left after the day one roll up of the air defenses. Given the A10's radar cross section that resembles that of a barn, and the large size of the usual SAM missile its a very nasty threat.

That said, the A10 did do plenty of work against SAM sites and sites protected by SAMs. Just a little on the dangerous side and they finaly pushed back when the F16's were being used for low threat work close to the border while the A10s were running long range missions against high threat targets.

Its one of the reasons I'd love to see a 2nd gen A10 done from the ground up. Modern computer modeling could likely cut a huge chunk of the radar issue out making medium altitude much safer while also improving all other aspects of survivabliy and offensive capiblity.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15745 posts, RR: 27
Reply 9, posted (4 years 9 months 21 hours ago) and read 5264 times:



Quoting XT6Wagon (Reply 8):
Its one of the reasons I'd love to see a 2nd gen A10 done from the ground up. Modern computer modeling could likely cut a huge chunk of the radar issue out making medium altitude much safer while also improving all other aspects of survivabliy and offensive capiblity.

I agree 100%. We will be in for a surprise if we really think that the F-35 can do what the A-10 can. And the A-10 is a relatively cheap aircraft to boot, and really the A-10 is one of the best out there in terms of bang for the buck.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineSpudh From Ireland, joined Jul 2009, 301 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (4 years 8 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 5045 times:

Pretty hard to 'stealtify' 11 hard points worth of weapons.

A ground up redo of the A10 would not look like the A10 if stealth is a design parameter.
Weapons would have to go internal and the barrel of the gun would be pretttttty hard to conceal, you'd see the start of big argument about how effective the gun really was.

I'd be more interested to see more avionics/power go into the existing airframe and let it actively take up the role as a Sam killer.

And dare I say it, how about a second seat?


User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined Dec 1999, 2930 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (4 years 8 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 5044 times:



Quoting XT6Wagon (Reply 8):
in actual use against "front line" military nations, the radar guided missile has proven to be the big killer of A10.

What were the actual losses of the A-10 vs radar SAMs? None in OIF, OEF, Kosovo or Serbia... Were there any in ODS?



The last of the famous international playboys
User currently offlineThePointblank From Canada, joined Jan 2009, 1721 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (4 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 5016 times:



Quoting Spacepope (Reply 11):
What were the actual losses of the A-10 vs radar SAMs? None in OIF, OEF, Kosovo or Serbia... Were there any in ODS?

6 A-10/OA-10's lost in Desert Storm; 5 to IR guided SAM's, and 1 to AAA.


User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined Dec 1999, 2930 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (4 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 4994 times:



Quoting ThePointblank (Reply 12):
6 A-10/OA-10's lost in Desert Storm; 5 to IR guided SAM's, and 1 to AAA.

So the question now is, has the A-10 ever suffered losses to radar SAMs at all?



The last of the famous international playboys
User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29800 posts, RR: 58
Reply 14, posted (4 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 4902 times:



Quoting Spudh (Reply 10):

And dare I say it, how about a second seat?

Was done back early in the program. For night interdiction, the Air Force didn't take Republic up on it, so only one flying prototype was built.

Quoting Spacepope (Reply 13):
So the question now is, has the A-10 ever suffered losses to radar SAMs at all?

I don't think so. Radar guided SAMS have a big disadvantage, namely a big radar transmitting signals to everybody, including the wild weasels flying top cover, saying "HERE I AM!!!"

In the desert the Iraqi's really couldn't turn their radars on period, without a HARM headed back their direction.

I

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 1):
No, I don't think it can carry the HARM.

As a weapon probably not, but it's rail probably can be carried on the hardpoints, they should be a standard size. But that is a hard way to ferry weapons to somebody that can use them. I have only heard of that being done in WWII, using pursuit assets to move ordinace to the field and even that was a last resort.



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User currently offlineThePointblank From Canada, joined Jan 2009, 1721 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 4574 times:



Quoting L-188 (Reply 14):
As a weapon probably not, but it's rail probably can be carried on the hardpoints, they should be a standard size. But that is a hard way to ferry weapons to somebody that can use them. I have only heard of that being done in WWII, using pursuit assets to move ordinace to the field and even that was a last resort.

Didn't the F-111F's of the 48th TFW when they deployed to Saudi Arabia during Desert Shield carry a full complement of Paveway's when they flew from their base in the UK to their new base in Saudi Arabia to provide the initial stock of weapons?


User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined Dec 1999, 2930 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 4558 times:

Sounds plausible. The us burned through most of their remaining stock of MK117 750 pound bombs at that time, and there are rumors of B-52s dropping Spanish and British bombs.

On the flipside, UK Reapers in A-stan are using US weapons (bombs and hellfires).



The last of the famous international playboys
User currently offlineBhill From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 975 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 4263 times:

Curious, what wavelength/frequencies does the HARM "lock" on to? All/any microwave emissions, or select frequencies base on the type of radar being used?


Carpe Pices
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12150 posts, RR: 51
Reply 18, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 4055 times:

I don't think the OA/A-10A, or a follow on design really needs stealth. Its main mission is all ground attack stuff, going after tanks and troop consintrations along with the AH-64A/D. The biggest threats to an A-10 is MANPAKs and AAA like the Zu-24-4. At that point, enemy defenses can actually see the A-10s, so radar is not needed to find them.

User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined Dec 1999, 2930 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 4049 times:



Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 18):
The biggest threats to an A-10 is MANPAKs

What exactly is a MANPAK, you've used this term a few times.

Is it similar to a MANPAD?



The last of the famous international playboys
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12150 posts, RR: 51
Reply 20, posted (4 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4029 times:



Quoting Spacepope (Reply 19):
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 18):
The biggest threats to an A-10 is MANPAKs

What exactly is a MANPAK, you've used this term a few times.

Is it similar to a MANPAD?

It is very bad spelling for MANPAD......sorry.


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