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What Happened To The Romanians Buying F16's?  
User currently offlinefpetrutiu From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 876 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 11 months 18 hours ago) and read 13370 times:

A while back the Romanians were approved to buy used F16's? What happened to that?

12 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineoly720man From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 6682 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (3 years 11 months ago) and read 13219 times:

They're probably going through the paperwork.

Some background here

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...w-fighters-come-from-israel-01499/

Lockheed Martin personnel in Romania have reportedly confirmed that the aircraft with be F-16 C/D fighters, without mentioning the production year or their number of flight hours. The US DSCA request noted AN/APG-69v1 radars and PW F100-220 IPE engines as expected equipment, however. This strongly suggests F-16 C/D Block 25 aircraft, delivered between 1984-1986, and currently operational with American Air National Guard units.

Romanian sources say that the planes will be free, but there will still be costs of about $400 million for personnel training in the USA, $500 million for refurbishment and infrastructure improvements, and money to equip the planes with weapons. The total sum is estimated to be about $1.2 billion.



wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4775 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (3 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 13173 times:

See last post here.....

Netz For Romania? (by DEVILFISH Oct 25 2007 in Military Aviation & Space Flight)



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineDevilfish From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4775 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 10911 times:

At last, we may yet get to see the finale of this saga.....

http://www.defensenews.com/article/2...odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

Quote:
"WARSAW — Romanian Defense Minister Corneliu Dobritoiu said his country aims to buy an undisclosed number of second-hand F-16A/B jet fighters from Portugal, reported local news agency Agerpres.

'The machines are in a very good technical condition,' Dobritoiu said. Romania needs to acquire new jet fighters to replace its fleet of 49 Soviet-built MiG-21 Lancer jet fighters, the defense minister said. Dobritoiu said that without purchasing the F-16 aircraft, the Romanian Air Force would lose its combat capacity in about nine years."



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"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineDevilfish From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4775 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (1 year 9 months 4 weeks ago) and read 9384 times:

Update:

Now with number, price and term.....

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/art...-buy-used-f_16s-from-portugal.html

Quote:
" BUCHAREST --- Romania will pay Portugal USD 600 million in a period of five years for 12 F-16 jet fighter aircraft, the Macedonian news website Libertas reported.

The news was confirmed by Defense Minister Corneliu Dobriţoiu. He said that Romania would pay EUR 70 million in the first tranche next year.

The aircraft will be presented after the pilots’ training is over in 2016."



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlinesovietjet From Bulgaria, joined Mar 2003, 2563 posts, RR: 17
Reply 5, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 9371 times:
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12 old F-16s to replace 50 old MiG-21s? Seems like it is not enough....

User currently offlinegipsy From Germany, joined Mar 2009, 106 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 9238 times:

What an idiotic decision. Why not take the 24 Gripens for 1.3 billion? That would them give an aircraft for the next 25 years, in sufficient numbers. I doubt these old F16 will make it that long. So in 10 to 15 years a replacement is needed again anyway. Then 600 millions plus an unknown (old birds only get worse) amount of money for spares and maintenance is down the drain. Very smart...someone must have persuaded them properly.

User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12128 posts, RR: 52
Reply 7, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 9175 times:

I have to agree with gipsy, the Gripens would be a better deal and a long term solution. Romaina could probibly get a better financing deal, too.

User currently onlineThePointblank From Canada, joined Jan 2009, 1669 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 9050 times:

Quoting gipsy (Reply 6):
What an idiotic decision. Why not take the 24 Gripens for 1.3 billion? That would them give an aircraft for the next 25 years, in sufficient numbers. I doubt these old F16 will make it that long. So in 10 to 15 years a replacement is needed again anyway. Then 600 millions plus an unknown (old birds only get worse) amount of money for spares and maintenance is down the drain. Very smart...someone must have persuaded them properly.

What isn't reported if the $600 million includes spares and maintenance or excludes it, or it includes something that wasn't reported.


User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12128 posts, RR: 52
Reply 9, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 8776 times:

Quoting ThePointblank (Reply 8):
What isn't reported if the $600 million includes spares and maintenance or excludes it, or it includes something that wasn't reported.

The Sweds have gone out of their way supporting the JAS-39 in sales to other countries. I think they are about to lend the Swiss some of their Gripen C/Ds for training in 2015 before the Swiss Gripen E/Fs arrive beginning in 2018. I believe this will allow the Swiss to begin retiring their F-5E/Fs.


User currently offlineDevilfish From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4775 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 6388 times:

The deal is sealed.....

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...w-fighters-come-from-israel-01499/

Romania Struggles to Field (Almost) New Fighters

Quote:
"Sept 24/12: Portugal. Romania apparently outbids Bulgaria for 12 PoAF F-16s, offering EUR 600 million over 5 years for the jets (EUR 125 million) and associated training and maintenance (EUR 475 million). The planes will arrive in 2016, by which time Romania’s pilots will also be fully trained.

The fighters are described as 'multirole,' but this is a bit of a stretch for the F-16 Block 15 OCUs. They can use AIM-120 AMRAAM air-to-air missiles, but their previous-generation AN/APG-66 radars have limited ground capabilities, and the fighters’ main precision strike weapon is the short-range AGM-65 Maverick missile. On the other hand, the price for 12 was pretty good."



Unless something unexpected happens, it seems the RoAF will finally get their Vipers in 2016.

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The MLU treatment could be worthwhile if substantial airframe life remains in the batch they're getting.



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently onlineThePointblank From Canada, joined Jan 2009, 1669 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 months 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 3196 times:

UPDATE: Contract signed with the Portuguese:
http://actmedia.eu/daily/defense-min...t-for-f-16-aircraft-purchase/48538

Quote:
Defense Ministry signs contract for F-16 aircraft purchase
Friday, October 11, 2013

Defense minister Mircea Dusa announced on Thursday that he had signed a contract with the Portuguese for the purchase of F-16 airplanes and had paid the first installment of 100 million euro from the total amount of 600 million euro as stipulated by contract.



Minister Dusa said, early this month that the equipping program with multirole aircraft would begin this fall by modernizing the airplanes Romania purchased from Portugal. The first F-16 planes will reach Romania in 2015, according to the protocol.


User currently onlineThePointblank From Canada, joined Jan 2009, 1669 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2176 times:

DSCA notification is out:

http://www.dsca.mil/sites/default/files/mas/romania_13-59.pdf

Quote:
The Defense Security Cooperation Agency notified Congress on November 8, 2013 of a possible Foreign Military Sale to Romania of weapons, equipment, and support for 12 F-16 MLU block 15 for an estimated cost of $457 million.

The Government of Romania has requested a possible sale of weapons, equipment, and support for 12 F-16 MLU block 15 aircraft that will be procured through a third party transfer from Portugal. Articles and services will include:

13 Embedded Global Positioning Systems/Inertial Navigation Systems (EGPS/INS) with GPS Security Devices, Airborne
3 AN/ALQ-131 Electronic Countermeasure Pods
30 AIM-120C Advanced Medium Range Air-to-Air Missiles (AMRAAM)
5 AIM-120C Captive Air Training Missiles (CATMs)
60 AIM-9M Sidewinder Missiles
4 AIM-9M CATMs
48 LAU-129 Launchers
10 GBU-12 Enhanced Guided Bomb Units
18 AGM-65H/KB Maverick Missiles
4 AGM-65 CATMs
15 Multifunctional Information Distribution System/Low Volume Terminals
2 Multifunctional Information Distribution System Ground Support Systems

Also included are spare and repair parts, support equipment, tanker support, ferry services, repair and return services, software development/integration, test and equipment, supply support, personnel training and training equipment, publications and technical data, U.S. Government and contractor technical services, and other related elements of logistics and program support. The estimated cost is $457 million.

The proposed sale will support the Romanian Air Force’s (RoAF) efforts to equip and utilize the 12 F-16 aircraft it is procuring from Portugal. These aircraft will provide the RoAF with a fleet of modernized multi-role combat aircraft. This proposed sale of weapons, equipment, and follow-on F-16 support will enable Romania to support both its own air defense needs and coalition operations. The RoAF will have no difficultly absorbing these systems into its armed forces.


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