Sponsor Message:
Military Aviation & Space Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
First-ever Space Tourist Plans Mars Mission  
User currently offlineneutrino From Singapore, joined May 2012, 651 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 4435 times:

Space tourist Dennis Tito plans first human Mars mission for 2018

Is the target of five years realistic for a totally new outfit currently without equipment, experience and most importantly the BIG money needed?

The snippet below looks interesting. Are we seeing the first space lovebirds?
quote: Tito, 72, won’t fly the mission. Instead, he will send a man and woman — preferably married....

http://www.washingtonpost.com/nation...-11e2-b99e-6baf4ebe42df_story.html

edit to post another link: http://www.thenewstribe.com/2013/02/...st-dennis-tito-plans-mars-mission/

[Edited 2013-02-28 08:21:05]


Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis
28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6933 posts, RR: 12
Reply 1, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 4390 times:

There is no point at all in going there without landing.


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently onlinezanl188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3592 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4346 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Aesma (Reply 1):
There is no point at all in going there without landing

Landing makes the mission much more difficult and expensive.



Legal considerations provided by: Dewey, Cheatum, and Howe
User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12961 posts, RR: 25
Reply 3, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4331 times:

Quoting neutrino (Thread starter):
Instead, he will send a man and woman — preferably married....

After 501 days together in a small spacecraft, I doubt they will remain so! 



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10930 posts, RR: 37
Reply 4, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 4264 times:

Dennis Tito flew to the ISS and back on the Russian Soyuz TMA-32. That is the ship they should use if they want to do a 501 days manned mission to Mars.

Space X are not quite up there yet. Still showing problems with thrusters as of today's launch. They are still very far from having their own manned missions to the ISS with their launchers and capsules.

If I was a candidate to fly a space mission I would want to fly on a Soyuz or nothing. The cute little vessel has proved right most every time if not every time.

Not too different from Yuri Gagarin's Vostok and it still goes without fail.

     



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineneutrino From Singapore, joined May 2012, 651 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 4262 times:

The Washington Post also mentioned that "Tito has assembled a team that includes experts in life support systems and space medicine."

It crossed my mind that they will also have to look into "life suppression" as well. I mean, thay have to come up with "space-proof" contraceptives like eg. condoms which have to be 100% effective.
Imagine the complications resulting from a unwanted pregnancy - especially during most of the journey.
The tail end should be ok for a first made-in-space but delivered-on-Earth baby.



Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10930 posts, RR: 37
Reply 6, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 4249 times:

Quoting neutrino (Reply 5):
Imagine the complications resulting from a unwanted pregnancy - especially during most of the journey.
The tail end should be ok for a first made-in-space but delivered-on-Earth baby.

Outlandish.

They should send 60+ aged astronauts in excellent physical condition with a fair experience of space flight. Also they should definitely use Russian equipment so they will minimize chances of failure - unless they really want to put human lives at risk by using newer and less proved equipment.



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineneutrino From Singapore, joined May 2012, 651 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 4246 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 6):
Outlandish


Is that a pun?  
Seriously, they have to have that base covered.
Your suggestion of a menopausal better half for the space-faring couple can be a solution to accidental conception.



Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis
User currently offlineboeingfixer From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 534 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 4242 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 4):
If I was a candidate to fly a space mission I would want to fly on a Soyuz or nothing. The cute little vessel has proved right most every time if not every time.

If you don't count 4 cosmonauts loosing their lives in the Soyuz, then it's proven itself right. That's if you're talking spacecraft. If you're talking launch vehicles, the R-7/Soyuz family, although the most used launcher in history, has had 114 launch failures over the years.

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 4):
Not too different from Yuri Gagarin's Vostok and it still goes without fail.

Last documented launch failure was on 24 August 2011. Also a 6% failure rate over its lifetime. Compared to the Space Shuttles 1.5% failure rate it's not exactly as safe as you think it is.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 1):
There is no point at all in going there without landing.

If we had that attitude during Apollo there would have been a high probability of mission failure. Apollo 8 and 10 were instrumental in the success of Apollo 11.

To be honest I see future space exploration coming from the private sector and if this flight to Mars pans out it will spur further private space ventures. All the best to Tito if he can find the investors for this venture.

Cheers,

John



Cheers, John YYC
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10930 posts, RR: 37
Reply 9, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 4239 times:

Quoting boeingfixer (Reply 8):

Last documented launch failure was on 24 August 2011. Also a 6% failure rate over its lifetime. Compared to the Space Shuttles 1.5% failure rate it's not exactly as safe as you think it is.

Space Shuttles were fabulous I was a big fan I loved going to KSC to see the launches only they are now all grounded and in museums and they will most probably never fly again.

Soyuz still flies and they are doing very well.

The Space X manned missions are still ways away in the unknown they have barely started ferrying cargo to the ISS and still having mishaps - again today. It will be a long while until they fly humans.

    



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10930 posts, RR: 37
Reply 10, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 4237 times:

Picture:

Cmdr_Hadfield Chris Hadfield 1 min
Far behind us in the distance we spotted a Dragon roaring up through the clouds, coming to catch us. Amazing.

pic.twitter.com/gRzR6cGGTg


  



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineconnies4ever From Canada, joined Feb 2006, 4066 posts, RR: 13
Reply 11, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4226 times:

I dunno, but 501 days with your "better half" and no opportunity to at lest go for a walk...sounds like one of the circles of Hell to me.

Also, taking a wave off after going so far, where's the satisfaction in that ?



Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
User currently offlineBEG2IAH From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 980 posts, RR: 18
Reply 12, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4223 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting boeingfixer (Reply 8):
Last documented launch failure was on 24 August 2011. Also a 6% failure rate over its lifetime. Compared to the Space Shuttles 1.5% failure rate it's not exactly as safe as you think it is.

Are you counting Progress in this statistic? The 6% doesn't sound right.



FAA killed the purpose of my old signature: Use of approved electronic devices is now permitted.
User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12961 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4214 times:

Quoting neutrino (Reply 5):
I mean, thay have to come up with "space-proof" contraceptives like eg. condoms which have to be 100% effective.
Imagine the complications resulting from a unwanted pregnancy - especially during most of the journey.

Pulling out would have its complications too, especially in a zero-g environment!

Quoting neutrino (Reply 5):
The tail end should be ok for a first made-in-space but delivered-on-Earth baby.

Hmm, allowing for nooky on the ISS/STS, seems they might be the first members in the 1k, 10k, 100k, 1m and 10m high club, and many points in between!

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 11):
sounds like one of the circles of Hell to me.

I didn't know that Hell was circular.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 11):
Also, taking a wave off after going so far, where's the satisfaction in that ?

Right, another disadvantage of pulling out....



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineboeingfixer From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 534 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4203 times:

Quoting BEG2IAH (Reply 12):
Are you counting Progress in this statistic? The 6% doesn't sound right.

That's why I said lifetime. 1748 launches with 114 failures = 6.52%. It's a bit time consuming to do progress analysis but I am sure the failure rate is lower due to progress. The current Soyuz-U, for instance, has had 745 launches with 21 failures which is 2.8%.

Cheers,

John



Cheers, John YYC
User currently offlinenomadd22 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 1900 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 4 days ago) and read 4188 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 4):
Dennis Tito flew to the ISS and back on the Russian Soyuz TMA-32. That is the ship they should use if they want to do a 501 days manned mission to Mars.

Have you ever seen the inside of a Soyuz? You have to cram the passengers in there with a shoehorn. Two days in one would drive anyone crazy. A year and a half isn't remotely possible.



Andy Goetsch
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6933 posts, RR: 12
Reply 16, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4121 times:

Quoting boeingfixer (Reply 8):
If we had that attitude during Apollo there would have been a high probability of mission failure. Apollo 8 and 10 were instrumental in the success of Apollo 11.

Apollo's goal was landing on the Moon. The journey being short, there was no problem in doing trial runs without landing. The proposal here doesn't help much in the goal of landing on Mars. In fact they don't even use an interesting propulsion, they plan a fairly long voyage.

By the way, nobody remembers Apollo 8's crew, there's a reason for that.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlinerwessel From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 2412 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4090 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 4):
If I was a candidate to fly a space mission I would want to fly on a Soyuz or nothing. The cute little vessel has proved right most every time if not every time.

Not too different from Yuri Gagarin's Vostok and it still goes without fail.

The Soyuz spacecraft is pretty much a ground up new design compared to the Vostoks and Voskhods.

The were all launched on R-7 derivatives, of course.

Quoting boeingfixer (Reply 8):
Last documented launch failure was on 24 August 2011. Also a 6% failure rate over its lifetime. Compared to the Space Shuttles 1.5% failure rate it's not exactly as safe as you think it is.

You really cannot count the vast majority of non-man-rated R-7 launches in that sort of comparison. And from what's left, it's hard to give any clear statistical advantage to either Soyuz or the Shuttle, both had a number of close calls which have to at least be considered, and the timing of accidents has to be considered as well (the Soyuz fatalities happened quite early in the program, and counting Soyuz-1 at all is problematic, as it's clear as an unready spacecraft was launched due to political pressure).


User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10930 posts, RR: 37
Reply 18, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4087 times:

I don't see them doing a Manned mission to Mars any time soon when no proven manned capsule exists at this point in time.

Seems quite a bit illusory just as much as Musk all-vegetarian colony on the Red Planet.

It will be a while - if ever in our life time. And it needs the $$$$ also and if private it means it will have to draw much profit.

  



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6933 posts, RR: 12
Reply 19, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 4058 times:

A capsule is not what you need anyway, you need something bigger.


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineneutrino From Singapore, joined May 2012, 651 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4013 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 19):
A capsule is not what you need anyway, you need something bigger.

A photo in the article below shows an artist's impression of the rocket with an inflatable module section in front.
http://symbolic-mirage.blogspot.sg/



Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6933 posts, RR: 12
Reply 21, posted (1 year 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 3995 times:

Wow that's an "interesting" website !


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineMrCazzy From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 35 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 3874 times:

One of the problems I see about sending a man to Mars is giving him the necessary supplies to survive the trip. Food, drink, exercise machines etc. would be needed. And I agree with some of the top comments how they might as well land even though it will be more expensive. A long journey just for orbit is not worth it in my opinion.

User currently offlinerwessel From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 2412 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 3833 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting MrCazzy (Reply 22):
One of the problems I see about sending a man to Mars is giving him the necessary supplies to survive the trip. Food, drink, exercise machines etc. would be needed

Assuming you don't recycle, you need about 5kg of supplies per person, per day. That includes food, water and oxygen, and the trace stuff you need. If you can recycle the water, that's down to 1.5kg/day, and if you recycle the oxygen, you can knock off another .8kg/day. If you want your astronauts to wash and bathe, you need to double the amount of water you allocate, for an extra 3.5kg/day.

So a couple of people on a 501 day mission would need about five tons of supplies, assuming no recycling or bathing. Recycling can clearly drastically reduce that number, even if not 100% efficient.

Those are not insurmountable numbers, especially if you recycle.

Other things, like the exercise equipment, doesn't get consumed, so other than perhaps a supply of spare parts, the length of the mission is limited by how much you can carry in consumables (as modified by any recycling), how much radiation exposure you're willing to give the crew, and how much you value their sanity.


User currently offlineRIXrat From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 789 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 3823 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 21):
Wow that's an "interesting" website !

I guess that if there is a serious delay on the return trip, we know what mortuary to contact.


25 AF1624 : You need a lot more than a capsule to go to Mars. First of all, no-one is going to survive 501 days in a capsule without going completely insane. Seco
26 rwessel : Capsules are not all as small as a Soyuz reentry module. The Apollo CM was much larger, for example. But yes, you'd probably want a descent sized hab
27 Aesma : About radiations, what is the latest thinking on that. In a book I read or a movie/TV series I saw they used the water tanks as temporary shields when
28 rwessel : The problem is mass. Radiation shielding (at least against gammas, which is what counts here) is pretty simply a mass effect. The more of it you have
Top Of Page
Forum Index

Reply To This Topic First-ever Space Tourist Plans Mars Mission
Username:
No username? Sign up now!
Password: 


Forgot Password? Be reminded.
Remember me on this computer (uses cookies)
  • Military aviation related posts only!
  • Not military related? Use the other forums
  • No adverts of any kind. This includes web pages.
  • No hostile language or criticizing of others.
  • Do not post copyright protected material.
  • Use relevant and describing topics.
  • Check if your post already been discussed.
  • Check your spelling!
  • DETAILED RULES
Add Images Add SmiliesPosting Help

Please check your spelling (press "Check Spelling" above)


Similar topics:More similar topics...
Dutch Firm Seeks Colonists For 2023 Mars Mission posted Sat Jan 12 2013 17:33:15 by Aloha717200
Space Tourist Files Suit For Refund posted Thu Sep 25 2008 16:15:45 by RedFlyer
Should The Mars Mission Be International? posted Sun Jan 6 2008 09:35:18 by Virgin747LGW
Bring Back Saturn-5B For Mars Mission? posted Mon Nov 26 2007 08:44:35 by KC135TopBoom
First Ever Int'l Air Show HAF posted Mon Sep 5 2005 12:06:02 by Iakobos
50th Anniversary Of First Man In Space posted Thu Apr 12 2012 07:36:11 by PanAm707320B
Will Nasa Ever Build A New Space Shuttle? posted Fri Jul 8 2011 23:19:22 by United Airline
Boeing Plans Commercial Space Taxis By '15 posted Fri Aug 6 2010 18:27:48 by GAIsweetGAI
For First Time In 50 Years, No US Manned Space Flt posted Fri Jan 29 2010 08:53:24 by Dreadnought
Space Shuttle Mission Numbering posted Mon Dec 25 2006 00:42:46 by FlyMKG

Sponsor Message:
Printer friendly format