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B-17 Toggle Switch Confusion  
User currently offlineB741 From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 716 posts, RR: 1
Posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 2245 times:

I heard something about the toggle switches in the B-17 causing confusion and accidents amongst crew members. It could have had something to do with the landing gear. Any historians or operators know any more about this?


Being Bilingual, I Speak English And Aviation
10 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12061 posts, RR: 52
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 1769 times:

Back during WWII, US and UK built aircraft did not have guarded switches that you see in aircraft of today. That contributed to a lot of accidents in every type, not just the B-17.

The guarded switch was a German invention, and most Luftwaffe combat airplanes they flew during WWII had them, including the early Bf-109s and Stukas. The Luftwaffe accident rate (excluding jet aircraft), during WWII was much lower than the RAF, USAAF, USN, IJN, RN, or any other combatent. Only some of this is attributed to guarded switches. But, actually the Luftwaffe aircrews got more flying time and landings than other combat crews in WWII.


User currently offlineB741 From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 716 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1740 times:

That Luftwaffe was really advanced for its time.


Being Bilingual, I Speak English And Aviation
User currently offlineUSAFMXOfficer From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 174 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 1728 times:

Yeah, the Luftwaffe was awesome.....it was the idiot at the top of Germany that decided to turn the world's most advanced fighter (ME-262) into a bomber.....can you imagine if the Germans had pushed the -262 out as a fighter in '42 or '43?


44th Fighter Squadron Vampire Bats - 63 years of history
User currently offlineB741 From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 716 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1716 times:

I saw that ME262 in Flight magazine last year. It was restored to flying condition. I heard that it was the first operational jet aircraft. Awesome speed for its time.


Being Bilingual, I Speak English And Aviation
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12061 posts, RR: 52
Reply 5, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 1656 times:

Quoting B741 (Reply 4):
I saw that ME262 in Flight magazine last year. It was restored to flying condition.

Actually those are new build airplanes. They are copies of the Me-262, built buy a company from Fort Worth, TX and someplace in Oregon. They have GE J-85 engines (without the afterburners), modern avionics, strobe lights, WX radar, and fake guns.

There have been Bf-109s, Me-109s, FW-190s, and Stukas restored to flying condition. But, I have never heard of an original Me-262 being restored, I could be wrong.


User currently offlineSATL382G From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1624 times:

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 5):
They are copies of the Me-262

Actually they are ME-262s. The newbuilds were good enough that MBB issued them Werke Nummers

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 5):
But, I have never heard of an original Me-262 being restored,

The team that did the newbuilds restored a wartime ME-262 for the Navy in exchange for copying the parts.


User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12061 posts, RR: 52
Reply 7, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 1620 times:

Quoting SATL382G (Reply 6):
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 5):
But, I have never heard of an original Me-262 being restored,

The team that did the newbuilds restored a wartime ME-262 for the Navy in exchange for copying the parts.

Thanks, I didn't know that. Where did the USN get a Me-262?


User currently onlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13793 posts, RR: 63
Reply 8, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1612 times:

They captured a rare two seater at the end of WW2. It was in bad condition in their museum. The guys who built the new ME-262s dismantled it completely and took the dimensions of the parts. Then they restored it to static display conditions (non-flying) for the museum and repaired all the corrosion damage.

Jan


User currently offlineSATL382G From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1596 times:

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 7):
Thanks, I didn't know that. Where did the USN get a Me-262?

In addition to MD11Engineers comments, here's a blurb from the projects website...

"The ideal candidate aircraft was found in an unlikely setting: a solitary example of an un-restored and original Me 262 was sitting outside of Willow Grove Naval Air Station in eastern Pennsylvania. The aircraft, once known as "White 35," was a rare Luftwaffe trainer, complete with dual-controls. Having spent decades on outdoor display, the jet was deteriorating rapidly. Unless it could be properly restored, its days were clearly numbered. This made it the single best hope for use in a restoration/reproduction project. It was soon discovered that the U.S. Navy owned the aircraft, but lacked the resources to give the old B-1a a quality restoration."

http://www.stormbirds.com/project/history/phase_1.htm

FYI: If I'm not mistaken I believe the newbuilds are so authentic that MBB issued them a new model number to account for the new engines!!  Smile


User currently offlineB741 From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 716 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1624 times:

I think I have the report on the capture from 1945 but I will have to check the library.


Being Bilingual, I Speak English And Aviation
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