WrenchBender From Canada, joined Feb 2004, 1779 posts, RR: 9 Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 5866 times:
Yeah, disappointing that they are dealing with Herc replacement ahead of the Fixed Wing SAR program (which would free up Herc assets). Its probably a moot point if the Gov't is punted sometime in the next few weeks/months.
Jaws707 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 708 posts, RR: 1 Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 5839 times:
I actually read about this in a defense magazine this week. The C-130's Canada flies are all between 18 and 40 years of age and are having major maintence issues. The advantage the C130J is that it can be delivered sooner, while the A400M would require a little more of a wait. Also it talked about how Boeing is suggesting the C-17 to replace some of the airplanes. Personally I would love to see them get at least 4 or 5 C17's to help keep that line open.
19 of the newest Herc's will remain in the fleet with the 16 replacements.
As for the A400, considering the protracted development programs of most military aircraft these days (ATF/F-22, JSF, EF-2000, Gripen, etc) I don't think I would want to depend on a program that doesn't even have a flying prototype yet. Of course, as Italy has show with the Tornado & F-16, there is always the option of leasing until you can get what you want.
Rest assured, the C-17 is still very much on DND's wishlist, but it's probably priority number 5 right now (Herc replacement, heavy lift helicopters, Buffalo/SAR replacement, & Joint Support Ship).
CO737800 From Canada, joined Dec 2003, 545 posts, RR: 1 Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 5663 times:
The Minister of Defense was on the CKNW last week and said big transport planes is not even on the table. He went on to say "why buy them when you can rent them, if a time comes and you can not rent big transports then we will have to look at it". It was from the Bill Good show www.cknw.com sometime last week
MissedApproach From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 713 posts, RR: 2 Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 5640 times:
Never said they'd get it, just that they want it
The Canadian military has a time-honoured tradition of becoming infatuated with equipment the government can't afford or is unwilling to buy. The Avro Arrow, a new plane with new engines, a new fire control computer & an untried missile system (Sparrow). The Navy's nuclear sub program ate their budget for years before it finally died. The Joint Support Ship will probably suffer the same fate.
But to return to our favourite subject, didn't the USAF just retire their C-141B's? They probably have what would be considered "low mileage" in Canada.
MissedApproach From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 713 posts, RR: 2 Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 5523 times:
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 7): How 'bout a couple of good "low milage" C-5As? Only flown on Sundays, to church, by little old ANG crews.
Hah! We have some of them come up here (YTR), usually during the summer. They do touch & goes & say they come here because there's no traffic. Woohoo, the home of Canada's strategic airlift has "no" traffic. I think they're from a New York unit.
Your military would not have the aircraft available on a ready basis, and would have to rely on previous charters booked for the Antonov.
Nato decided to lease some An 124 instead of buying C-17 because it is cheaper. They made an agreement that the plane is available any time they need it. Since Canada is a Nato member they can use these pool of aircraft so they don´t have the need for C5 Galaxies.
I think they will go with the C130J but I hope that they will order the A400M.
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
L-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29513 posts, RR: 59 Reply 15, posted (8 years 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5050 times:
Quoting Columba (Reply 14): They made an agreement that the plane is available any time they need it. Since Canada is a Nato member they can use these pool of aircraft so they don´t have the need for C5 Galaxies.
I am just flashing back a few years ago when Canada was bring it's armor back from the Balkans. They hired a ship through a broker to move all those tanks (1/10 of all the armor in the canadian forces). Anyway the broker allegedly didn't pay the ships crew so they stayed out at sea and refused to bring the ship into port in Canada. In the end the Canadian Navy had to send a couple destroyers after the ship and land a boarding party on her to get their tanks back.
I could see see how a similar situation could occur with airlift, if a military force doesn't own it's own airlift capablity.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
KC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 11899 posts, RR: 52 Reply 17, posted (8 years 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4928 times:
Quoting Columba (Reply 14): I think they will go with the C130J but I hope that they will order the A400M.
The C-130J would be faster/easier/cheaper to buy. But, Canada often thinks of itself as part of the EU, instead of being located in North America. So, even giving a choice, they will buy the A-400M. Even if they have to wait for production slots behind Germany, UK, France, Spain, and Italy.
Columba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 6991 posts, RR: 4 Reply 18, posted (8 years 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4920 times:
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 17): The C-130J would be faster/easier/cheaper to buy. But, Canada often thinks of itself as part of the EU, instead of being located in North America. So, even giving a choice, they will buy the A-400M. Even if they have to wait for production slots behind Germany, UK, France, Spain, and Italy.
Regarding its defence policy Canada mostly buys its equipment from the USofA.
Especially the airforce has a long history of buying either homemade or US made products.
I donÂ´t see the Canadian Air Force buying the A400M because it is an European product. If they go for the A400M then because of its size. It is bigger then the C130J and offers a greater flexibility. But therefore the C130J has the advantage -as you already said-of being cheaper and available in a shorter time.
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
MissedApproach From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 713 posts, RR: 2 Reply 19, posted (8 years 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 4903 times:
Quoting Columba (Reply 18): I donÂ´t see the Canadian Air Force buying the A400M because it is an European product.
Irrelevant. The biggest strike against the A400 is it's timeline. The Air Force would prefer a larger aircraft, but the availability of the Herc fleet has suffered in the last two years. They could always lease something until the A400 is ready, but I don't think they will.
By the way, much of the Army's fleet is of European origin (Leopard tank, Steyr-based heavy truck, Iveco-based light truck, Iltis jeep & Mercedes G-Wagon), plus Fabrique Nationale light & medium machine guns & Aerospatiale anti-tank missiles.
Quoting LY744 (Reply 16): the biggest piece of armor in the Canadian Forces inventory will soon be the LAVs.
Don't remind me. I feel like I'm going to be sick everytime I think about it.
Here's another alternative I found on the SPAR website: "Herc 2020", a refit for E & H model Hercs at about half the cost of new. Meant to add 15-20 years of service. The program includes modification of the center & outer wing sections. http://www.spar.ca
Can you hear me now?
25 Socal: Wow where can I get that repaint at BAe146? nice repaint. And Canada should buy C-17A's and C-130J's.
26 L-188: There you go, get Canadair to refit a bunch of those out in the desert with ramp tails
27 BAe146: You might like my Blue Angels C-17 also Here's my site