Sponsor Message:
Military Aviation & Space Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Formation Flying  
User currently offlineSabenaA340 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (13 years 1 month 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1690 times:

Dear forum,

I am wondering how this is done. How do the pilots keep lined-up?? How do they change course, speed or altitude together, etc...?? How do they group from takeoff or regroup afterwards?

SabenaA340

19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineLucifer From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 106 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (13 years 1 month 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 1583 times:

Leader is in charge and tells everyone else when to alter something etc. Flying is achieved through lining up certain features from the aircraft on which you are formating and keeping the perspective the same. Slick judgement and anticipation required throughout. Usually takeoff in pairs/threes and when coming in to land do a 'run and break' move, involving heading for runway but high, peeling off one by one to the downwind, and landing individaully.

User currently offlineJwenting From Netherlands, joined Apr 2001, 10213 posts, RR: 19
Reply 2, posted (13 years 1 month 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 1570 times:

training, training, and more training...


I wish I were flying
User currently offlineFireblade From Portugal, joined Feb 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (13 years 1 month 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 1569 times:

and avionics,avionics and more avionics

User currently offlineJan Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 2043 posts, RR: 50
Reply 4, posted (13 years 1 month 1 hour ago) and read 1553 times:

Pardon my ignorance, how is avionics involved?
/JM



AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
User currently offlineFireblade From Portugal, joined Feb 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (13 years 1 month 1 hour ago) and read 1548 times:

Thisdays aircraft are made to do many things only with their computer[part of avionics].So avionics help you with data measure distance to other a/c help you see in dark with IRSTs .After a one decade or even few years the pilot will be useless.
Slobodan
p.s. this is a computers world


User currently offlineJan Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 2043 posts, RR: 50
Reply 6, posted (13 years 1 month ago) and read 1549 times:

I have done formation flying when flying for other photographers during air-to-air shoots, and I can't see how any avionics could possibly help.
Eyeball Mk1 is what you use.
/JM



AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
User currently offlineFireblade From Portugal, joined Feb 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (13 years 1 month ago) and read 1542 times:

For air shows yes your eyes are just enaphe .But try to
fly in formation at night ,among the fog like on the assault missions.How your eyes will work than?
Pretty bad man.
Slobodan
p.s. remember when the two russian pilots wrecked themselves during one airshow[i don't remember which one, i watched in the amazing videous]
There was a cloud and one of them enter in it other decoded to believe his eyes unless his instruments and the other one didn't see his college when it came oit of cloud and 2 planes were destroyed.


User currently offlineJan Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 2043 posts, RR: 50
Reply 8, posted (13 years 1 month ago) and read 1536 times:

During night or in clouds, number 1 flies instrument and
the aircraft formating keeps their eyes on his navlights.
/JM



AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
User currently offlineFireblade From Portugal, joined Feb 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (13 years 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1534 times:

aircraft formating keeps their eyes on his navlights
You were joking right?
LOL
Slobodan
Else guys from air gefence will be happy to detect you even without a radar.Just imagine a/c with navlights during the night perfect target for the SAMs.


User currently offlineJan Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 2043 posts, RR: 50
Reply 10, posted (13 years 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1534 times:

I would be quite surprised if SAMs need your navlights on to operate...
/JM



AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
User currently offlineJan Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 2043 posts, RR: 50
Reply 11, posted (13 years 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1530 times:

You do have a point though, and I would be interested in hearing from any military pilot how it is done.
/JM



AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
User currently offlineFireblade From Portugal, joined Feb 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (13 years 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1529 times:

J.M.[hope you don't mind call you thatway]
NAvlights will help them very much .Air defence must turned off the radars when the a/c is close to them bedause for example they could you HARM and blow up the radar.Not good .Also during the clear night vanlights could be seen from a miles and your down man
Slobodan


User currently offlineJwenting From Netherlands, joined Apr 2001, 10213 posts, RR: 19
Reply 13, posted (13 years 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1527 times:

during a clear night NVGs and IR navlights can work wonders (and if the moon is out you might see your wingman in reflected moonlight even without them). You're clearly not reallly into modern equipment.
And before they had those means, they might use faint lights (navlights can be dimmed, or else a keep the instrument lights of the wingman in view...).
SAMs are sometimes optically guided, in which case it helps quite a lot if the target is visible  Laugh out loudD



I wish I were flying
User currently offlineJan Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 2043 posts, RR: 50
Reply 14, posted (13 years 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 1526 times:

So, over enemy territory, in clouds; how is it done?
/JM



AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
User currently offlineJohnM From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 351 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (13 years 4 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 1495 times:

We never fly IMC formation flights in helicopters. At least not in my unit. That is a great way to meet your maker. We have a SOP for IMC formation breakup if we encounter clouds. As mentioned before, if NVGs are used, formation flight with no lights is no problem. It is easy to see the fire in the tailpipe of the guy in front of you, and for that matter the entire aircraft. If ground lights are encountered, it is best to be slightly below the aircraft in front of you, to keep lead above the horizon. Then you won't loose him in the ground lights and have a big problem. Our aircraft are not equipped with SKE (station keeping equipment) that some airlifters use.

User currently offlineJan Mogren From Sweden, joined Dec 2000, 2043 posts, RR: 50
Reply 16, posted (13 years 3 weeks 4 days ago) and read 1468 times:

I'm sorry but I still don't understand how avionics help you flying formation in clouds. Anyone cares to tell me how such a device works?
/JM



AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
User currently offlineXFSUgimpLB41X From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 4224 posts, RR: 37
Reply 17, posted (13 years 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 1466 times:

Avionics are not used for formation flying- except for the lead plane of course. Fireblade doesnt have a clue... It is lall about being lined up on certain point on the aircraft visually.


Chicks dig winglets.
User currently offlineJohnM From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 351 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (13 years 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1457 times:

Aircraft that are equipped with a station keeping system (SKE) do indeed use avionics to maintain position, even in IMC conditions. SKE for example will show your position in a formation and give cues to maintain position. To my knowledge used mainly in airlifters and larger helicopters. I don't know if the fighter world uses this system. Of course in good weather, the good old Mk 1 eyeball is the primary system used.

User currently offlineEricCieslar From Australia, joined Apr 2001, 45 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (13 years 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1456 times:

dont know if this helps but some planes have formation lights

Top Of Page
Forum Index

Reply To This Topic Formation Flying
Username:
No username? Sign up now!
Password: 


Forgot Password? Be reminded.
Remember me on this computer (uses cookies)
  • Military aviation related posts only!
  • Not military related? Use the other forums
  • No adverts of any kind. This includes web pages.
  • No hostile language or criticizing of others.
  • Do not post copyright protected material.
  • Use relevant and describing topics.
  • Check if your post already been discussed.
  • Check your spelling!
  • DETAILED RULES
Add Images Add SmiliesPosting Help

Please check your spelling (press "Check Spelling" above)


Similar topics:More similar topics...
RNoAF Low Level Flying - F16 posted Sun Oct 7 2007 11:38:13 by Mortyman
F-18 Flying With No WSO posted Thu Sep 13 2007 19:58:11 by Cancidas
V-22 Flying At AZA (IWA) Today posted Tue Aug 7 2007 19:53:20 by FlyAZA
Youngest VC10 Still Flying? posted Sun Jul 22 2007 21:47:31 by Readytotaxi
Formation Of Some Variant Of H-53s Over Kent, WA posted Fri Jun 15 2007 02:41:59 by Ulfinator
Flying On A RAF VC-10? Possible? posted Mon May 28 2007 08:59:00 by SIBILLE
Joing The RAF - Odds Of Flying A AC Not A Desk? posted Sat Apr 7 2007 15:55:32 by Jamesbuk
Flying Into Air Force Bases posted Wed Mar 14 2007 21:10:08 by SuseJ772
Video: Flying In A MiG-21 posted Wed Feb 21 2007 17:57:52 by A342
Low Flying A-10... You Think? posted Tue Feb 20 2007 07:14:31 by Maiznblu_757

Sponsor Message:
Printer friendly format