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First USN EA-18G Growler Rolls Out  
User currently offlineGOCAPS16 From Japan, joined Jan 2000, 4338 posts, RR: 21
Posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 17679 times:

For those who are interested as I stumbled though the U.S. Navy homepage.



http://www.navy.mil/view_single.asp?id=37746

The World's Finest U.S. Navy is officially an all F/A-18 fleet of the future.  Smile

Kevin

57 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMigFan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 17626 times:

What is the USAF using to fulfill this role? RQ-4?

/M


User currently offlineRAPCON From Puerto Rico, joined Jul 2006, 671 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 17628 times:

YOu now that the flyboys at Whidbey just got a boner over that pic. No more flying buses for them. And the ECMO's can act tough now!


MODS CAN'T STOP ME....THEY CAN ONLY HOPE TO CONTAIN ME!!!
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4775 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 17615 times:

Here are more pictures.....
http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles...owler+FA-18+electronic+attack.html

The outdoor shot could have been better.



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineLMP737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 17590 times:

Quoting RAPCON (Reply 3):
And the ECMO's can act tough now!

Maybe not, some of the ECMO's will be "unemployed" with the Growler.


User currently offlineAirRyan From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 2532 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 17550 times:

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 4):
Maybe not, some of the ECMO's will be "unemployed" with the Growler.

I don't feel too hard for them, modern computers took away their jobs years ago!

Quoting MigFan (Reply 1):
What is the USAF using to fulfill this role? RQ-4?

There is no doubt in my mind that the Marines after they get done paying for the V-22's will simply not have the money to morph an F-35B into some sort of similar EAW aircraft and thereby the EA-18G is not only the cheapest way for them to replace their EA-6B it is also the only way. If the Marines don't buy EA-18G's than they are getting out of the business and I have heard specifically that that is not their intention.

I see the Marines also taking their F/A-18D's and their FAC(A) roles and replacing them with F/A-18F's so perhaps they could combine the two and perform both EAW and FAC(A) roles with either the same platforms (plug and play the EAW gear for ordinance) or at least buying two very similar aircraft for those two roles.

If the USAF was wise, they'd buy some EA-18G's sooner rather than later as well with a handful of AESA equipped F/A-18E's to replace the most elderly F-15A/C's that won't be able to be replaced by the F-22. Supplementing Super Hornets with F-22's would be a nice package considering that the Super Hornets can carry 10-11 AMRAAM's.


User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29791 posts, RR: 58
Reply 6, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 17535 times:

Quoting MigFan (Reply 1):
What is the USAF using to fulfill this role? RQ-4?

They used to have the EF-111 but during the Clinton administration they made a goal of trying to reduce the number of replicate roles in the branches. The ECM role was one-the Navy got them with their EA-6B's so the USAF had to send their Ravens to the desert... Still surprises me that the Aussies didn't try to pick up a couple for themselves when that happened.

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 5):
If the USAF was wise, they'd buy some EA-18G's sooner rather than later as well with a handful of AESA equipped F/A-18E's to replace the most elderly F-15A/C's that won't be able to be replaced by the F-22. Supplementing Super Hornets with F-22's would be a nice package considering that the Super Hornets can carry 10-11 AMRAAM's.

The F-15 is a better aircraft then the wannabe bug....period.



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineLMP737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 17518 times:

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 5):
If the USAF was wise, they'd buy some EA-18G's sooner rather than later as well with a handful of AESA equipped F/A-18E's to replace the most elderly F-15A/C's that won't be able to be replaced by the F-22. Supplementing Super Hornets with F-22's would be a nice package considering that the Super Hornets can carry 10-11 AMRAAM's.

Or buy AESA equiped F-16's.


User currently offlinePADSpot From Germany, joined Jan 2005, 1676 posts, RR: 5
Reply 8, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 17512 times:

What are those pods under the central wing stations and central fuselage station? They look similar to Buddy-Buddy Refueling pods as used on our Tornadoes, but that would not make sense here ... . Are those little propellers on the tip of the pods?!

User currently offlineLMP737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 17508 times:

Quoting PADSpot (Reply 8):
What are those pods under the central wing stations and central fuselage station? They look similar to Buddy-Buddy Refueling pods as used on our Tornadoes, but that would not make sense here ... . Are those little propellers on the tip of the pods?!

Those are the ALQ-99 jammer pods used to jam enemy radars. The little propeller drives a generator inside the pod that powers the ECM gear. The aircraft's generators don't have enough juice to do so.


User currently offlineRAPCON From Puerto Rico, joined Jul 2006, 671 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 17504 times:

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 4):
Maybe not, some of the ECMO's will be "unemployed" with the Growler.

Perhaps not. If the EF18 is indeed more reliable and cheaper to operate, it could theoretically generate more flight hours, and thus require the necessary crews to operate it.

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 5):
I don't feel too hard for them, modern computers took away their jobs years ago!

I never feel hard for flyboys!!



MODS CAN'T STOP ME....THEY CAN ONLY HOPE TO CONTAIN ME!!!
User currently offlineAirRyan From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 2532 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 17480 times:

Quoting L-188 (Reply 6):
The F-15 is a better aircraft then the wannabe bug....period.

Yeah but the single seat F-15C's are no long available for production and eventually the point will come as to where it will just be cheaper to buy F/A-18E's than to spend any more money upgrading remaining F-15A/C's.

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 7):
Or buy AESA equiped F-16's.

While I'd like to see a qualitative analysis comparing the two, since the F-16E's have little in common with their F-16C counterparts that the USAF uses, I think the Super Hornet with it's greater number of hardpoints (hard to beat 10+ AAM's) would be a better suit to replace the role of the F-15C.

Quoting RAPCON (Reply 10):
I never feel hard for flyboys!!

I'm not even going to go there, but you do remind me of a conversation I was having with some friends a short while back; the one on the left reminds me of my 9th grade science teacher I used to have a thing for... (where were these hot young teachers who put out when I was in school?!)

http://www.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/030503-F-0365G-002.jpg


User currently offlineDeltaGuy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 17459 times:

Quoting RAPCON (Reply 2):
And the ECMO's can act tough now!

And they can reduce their headcount by 2/3's too....less double-anchors running around the boat.

DeltaGuy


User currently offlineLMP737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 17447 times:

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 11):
While I'd like to see a qualitative analysis comparing the two, since the F-16E's have little in common with their F-16C counterparts that the USAF uses, I think the Super Hornet with it's greater number of hardpoints (hard to beat 10+ AAM's) would be a better suit to replace the role of the F-15C.

It still has much more in common with the C than the "super hornet" does. The chances of the USAF choosing the "super hornet" to replace F-15's is about slim to none. And besides what sort of threat exists to teh USAF where it would actaully need ten AAM's straped to one of it's planes?


User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4775 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 17427 times:

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 5):
as well with a handful of AESA equipped F/A-18E's to replace the most elderly F-15A/C's that won't be able to be replaced by the F-22.



Quoting AirRyan (Reply 11):

Yeah but the single seat F-15C's are no long available for production and eventually the point will come as to where it will just be cheaper to buy F/A-18E's than to spend any more money upgrading remaining F-15A/C's.

Don't the F15Ks and F-15SGs destined for South Korea and Singapore also come in single-seat versions? I would think those would be significantly less expensive than F-22s, but still very capable alternatives. Or would the USAF just go with the JSF?

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 11):
I'd like to see a qualitative analysis comparing the two, since the F-16E's have little in common with their F-16C counterparts that the USAF uses,

The F-16NG might work here. The contemplated next-generation F-16s could be defined to closely transition from F-16s in current USAF use, for operational and cost compromise, but the power of the yet to be upgraded engine might not attract the Air Force to launch the type.



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineEBJ1248650 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1932 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 17407 times:

Quoting GOCAPS16 (Thread starter):
The World's Finest U.S. Navy is officially an all F/A-18 fleet of the future.

Kevin

The only obvious change appears to be the addition of ECM pods on the wing tips, replacing missile rails that used to be there. The impression I get is the airplane will rely very heavily on the externally mounted ECM pods, unless the internal equipment fit is vastly different from the fighter version (F/A-18F).



Dare to dream; dream big!
User currently offlineEBJ1248650 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1932 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 17404 times:

Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 14):
The F-16NG might work here. The contemplated next-generation F-16s could be defined to closely transition from F-16s in current USAF use, for operational and cost compromise, but the power of the yet to be upgraded engine might not attract the Air Force to launch the type.

This is definitely news to me. Any further info on this?



Dare to dream; dream big!
User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6483 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 17331 times:

I'm not sure we won't see a UAV of some sort performing this role.


When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offlineMaiznblu_757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 5112 posts, RR: 50
Reply 18, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 17287 times:

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 5):
F/A-18E's to replace the most elderly F-15A/C's that won't be able to be replaced

F-15C/D's have a good 15 years left. If the USAF was smart, they would have new upgraded F-15C/D's built. Could save a lot of money going that route. After all, the F-15 is arguably the best fighter of all time, save the P-51 and F-4U and coupled with good pilots, it can still get the job done.


User currently offlineRAPCON From Puerto Rico, joined Jul 2006, 671 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 17202 times:

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 11):
I'm not even going to go there, but you do remind me of a conversation I was having with some friends a short while back; the one on the left reminds me of my 9th grade science teacher I used to have a thing for... (where were these hot young teachers who put out when I was in school?!)

In ref to your wet dream and the pics of the USAF bambi's...remind me one day about the ol' Navy expression about dating women in uniform!

Quoting DeltaGuy (Reply 12):
And they can reduce their headcount by 2/3's too....less double-anchors running around the boat.

The problem is not the FO's, it's the Jocks--specially the ringnockers with the unfounded illusions of grandeur.



MODS CAN'T STOP ME....THEY CAN ONLY HOPE TO CONTAIN ME!!!
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4775 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 17168 times:

Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 16):
This is definitely news to me. Any further info on this?

It is mainly Lockheed Martin's attempt at bagging the IAF fighter deal, and other tenders that might come along. Here you are.....
http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles...eed+works+to+define+next+F-16.html



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineAirRyan From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 2532 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 17159 times:

Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 14):
Don't the F15Ks and F-15SGs destined for South Korea and Singapore also come in single-seat versions? I would think those would be significantly less expensive than F-22s, but still very capable alternatives. Or would the USAF just go with the JSF?

Modern Eagles are Strike Eagles only, and even a current F/A-18F is cheaper than a new Strike Eagle.

Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 14):
The F-16NG might work here. The contemplated next-generation F-16s could be defined to closely transition from F-16s in current USAF use, for operational and cost compromise, but the power of the yet to be upgraded engine might not attract the Air Force to launch the type.

The F-16NG is nothing more than a hybird of all the goodies available on LM's parts shelf, but more importantly it's intended for export use. No doubt that if the USAF were to buy any more F-16's (which they won't because LM is making them the new F-35A) they would be specifically tailored to exactly what the USAF wanted and for the record, CFT's on a Viper look like crap.

Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 15):
The impression I get is the airplane will rely very heavily on the externally mounted ECM pods, unless the internal equipment fit is vastly different from the fighter version (F/A-18F).

There are a lot of internal modifications for the EA-18G but suffice to say I believe I read that all F/A-18F's that roll of the line now have the extra 50 pounds of wires necessary to be able to convert over to an EA-18G with minimal time and effort.

Quoting Maiznblu_757 (Reply 18):
F-15C/D's have a good 15 years left.

While I'm not privy to the exact details I'll use the F-14 and an old factor we refer to as age to argue against the statement - Tomcats we're severely limited in top airspeed and manuvers per NATOPS due to thier aged airframes towards the twilight of their service. F-15's are no spring chicken and that is why the F-22 was sought out.

Quoting RAPCON (Reply 19):
In ref to your wet dream and the pics of the USAF bambi's...remind me one day about the ol' Navy expression about dating women in uniform!

More than an expression - words to live by as I did so myself whilst enlisted in the Marines. Of course now that I'm a former Marine I would at least be open to commissioned female! Too bad though, the hottie up there on the left already has a ring, but she does fine to enunciate my point.


User currently offlineLMP737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 17131 times:

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 21):
The F-16NG is nothing more than a hybird of all the goodies available on LM's parts shelf, but more importantly it's intended for export use

And what does make that the "super hornet"?


User currently offlineMigfan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 17095 times:

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 22):
And what does make that the "super hornet"?

The F/A-18E-F is an improvement on an existing design. It is the Navy's way to make the hornet replace the tomcat. To facilitate this, substantial differences wer incorporated into the design.

The super hornet is a very underrated aircraft...

/M


User currently offlineAirRyan From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 2532 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (7 years 11 months 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 16957 times:

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 22):
And what does make that the "super hornet"?



Quoting Migfan (Reply 23):
The F/A-18E-F is an improvement on an existing design. It is the Navy's way to make the hornet replace the tomcat. To facilitate this, substantial differences wer incorporated into the design.

The super hornet is a very underrated aircraft...

That is exactly what I was going to rebute with: the Super Hornet is an all new from the ground up design (that just happens to resemble a legacy Hornet so they could bypass Congressional approval back when the program needed money for procurement,) while the F-16E/F and NG are just modern updates of the same aircraft that was originally fielded back in the early 80's. I agree, the Super Hornets are an underrated aircraft if you don't compare them to the F-14D or what it could have been, and although the Navy is buying 400+/- airframes, hopefully with more orders from the Marines and elsewhere the price will only come down for everyone.


25 RAPCON : They officially passed on the 18E/F.
26 EBJ1248650 : Could the wiring be there to interface externally mounted pods with what might be called swapped black boxes (pull a fighter dedicated box and replac
27 AFHokie : You cannot simply "plug and play" between a FAC A role and EAW. The gear in an AEW aircraft is highly specialized, there is a lot more to it than jus
28 AirRyan : For the time being - they'll have no money left for a EAW version of the JSF as they are now hoping for, especially if the Dems return to power. Perh
29 AirSpare : For a strictly cool factor for airshows, a modern variant of the F-16XL would have been a 10 on the wow scale. The cranked arrow wing would add a lot
30 DeltaDC9 : Until the F-35. Speculative. We will see in 10 years or so if that is true. This comment, while I understand it, is not totally true. The P-51 was la
31 RAPCON : Last time the Dems were in power, there was barely enough $$ in the budget to maintain--forget good quality training.
32 DEVILFISH : Couldn't the same arguments be used for the F-16NG? Its development was evolutionary and if the most ambitious option was to be pursued, it would lit
33 EBJ1248650 : Late model F-15C's and perhaps some F-15E's?
34 Post contains images DEVILFISH : You quoted the wrong guy. Anyway, maybe I should have added an "incredulous" Smilie to more clearly indicate my thoughts.
35 ElmoTheHobo : Oh come on, you and I both know that the last time the Dems had power was what? 1993-1995? After that it was the Republicans that had control of the
36 DeltaGuy : Won't happen for a looong time. Our squadron is about to recieve some 80's-build C and D models, upgrading our mid 70's A and B's....I'd imagine that
37 ElmoTheHobo : The JSF is going to replace every F-15, F-16 and F-18. The F-22 is already replacing some of the F-15s, but years down the road, the flying forces of
38 DeltaDC9 : Maybe, but I am not real familiar with the NG. The Super Hornet shares very few parts with the original. They basically took the Hornet blueprints an
39 DEVILFISH : It is, at this stage, only a concept. But I believe enlarging it as was done to the Super Bug would further diminish its originally fine attributes,
40 Post contains links DEVILFISH : Update: The Growler flies, one month in advance!..... http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles...r+for+first+time%2c+one+month.html
41 Migfan : Yeah, I guess we can rename the thread now. /M
42 Socal : Wow......looking good.............!!!
43 Post contains images Boeing4ever : I don't get it...is there another not-so-fine U.S. Navy out there? B4e-Forever New Frontiers
44 Post contains links and images DEVILFISH : Photos of first flight with jamming pods here...... http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles...flies+with+electronic+warfare.html Looking good! I think th
45 L-188 : I could say something about the Coast Guard at this point, but I won't.
46 Post contains links DEVILFISH : Update..... Growler to NAS Patuxent River. http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles...rowler+delivered+to+test+base.html
47 DeltaDC9 : Actually yes there is. The US Navy mothball fleet is the 3rd largest navy in the world. I guess you could add the F-14s and all the other retired pla
48 JakeOrion : Then the P-40 would have to be on the very top of that list, as that aircraft virtually saw combat in every theater of the war, yet it receives very
49 Post contains links DEVILFISH : The "rumor" is described in the link in Reply 20. Unlikely, yes. But with the delays and funding problems for the Lightning II, the F-16NG might just
50 Post contains links DEVILFISH : Update: Boeing is ramping up the Growler's schedule with the second prototype set to enter tests. Flightglobal also reports that carrier tests to cert
51 Post contains images DeltaGuy : We won't get em until they're well broken in and need some work Wonder what's going to become of Whidbey Island once the Growler is fully in and the
52 Post contains links DEVILFISH : As you said, "Improved Eagles" still and no "Mud Hens"..... http://www.f-16.net/news_article1920.html Quote: "The 33rd FW's F-15 Eagles will be redis
53 AirRyan : The Marines will no longer have a choice now that the Dems control the House and Senate because the Marines will no longer have the budgets with limi
54 Post contains images StudeDave : Good question... that'll be an interesting one to see the outcome of!!! During all the BRAC closures in the 90's it was a hard-fought battle to keep
55 Venus6971 : Ive read in yesterdays USA Today about how some Jacksonville NIMBY's voted down a move for the Navy to send the F-18's from Oceana to Jacksonville. I
56 LMP737 : And they have had a "limitless" amount to spend the past five years? When a co-worker of mine had to buy his USMC son the new style body armor two ye
57 Flynavy : Well, maybe not in the way of flight control surfaces and powerplants, but the avionics are virtually identical. The AYK-14 mission computers, the AY
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