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Embraer Mulling C-130 Size Airlifter?  
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4836 posts, RR: 1
Posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 23015 times:

Flightglobal reports that Embraer is mulling the possible development of a C-130 sized tactical airlifter to diversify its product line.....

http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles...-130-sized+tactical+airlifter.html

The powerplants reportedly under consideration for this study which Embraer wouldn't confirm, are Pratt & Whitney's PW6000 and Rolls Royce's BR715. Interesting that a turbofan is being eyed versus the turboprop alternative.

If this capital-intensive project pushes through, it would be a competitor to Airbus' delayed A400M, the C-130 and the smaller Alenia C27J Spartan - and yet another player in the much needed but woefully underfunded tactical airlifter market.


"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
29 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6485 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 23012 times:

Quoting DEVILFISH (Thread starter):
If this capital-intensive project pushes through, it would be a competitor to Airbus' delayed A400M, the C-130 and the smaller Alenia C27J Spartan

Those three are not really competitors. Think of it as:

C-27 < C-130 < A400M < C-141 < C-17 < C-5 < An-124 < An-225



When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12146 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 23010 times:

Hmmm, this would be more like a mini C-17. I doubt a turbofan airlifter of that size would really hurt the C-130J or C-27J sales very much. But, it could kill the slightly larger A-400M.

User currently offlineCobra27 From Slovenia, joined May 2001, 1012 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 22915 times:

C-130J is selling very badly and so is the 40 ton payload antonov-72

User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6485 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 22909 times:

Quoting Cobra27 (Reply 3):
C-130J is selling very badly and so is the 40 ton payload antonov-72

180 ordered is "selling badly?" And there are RFPs out for many more.



When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29799 posts, RR: 58
Reply 5, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 22815 times:

Quoting Cobra27 (Reply 3):
C-130J is selling very badly and so is the 40 ton payload antonov-72

I think that a lot of counties are waiting to see if the A400 moves beyond the vaporware stage.

but 180 Airframes is still very respectable, particularly when you factor in post-cold war purchasing habits.

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 2):
Hmmm, this would be more like a mini C-17.

I was think mini-Kawasaki C-1. I think Emb may have a winner if they can make it as wide as a C-130



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineFlyf15 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 22765 times:

Sounds like this...



User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4836 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 22277 times:

Another competitor for this has surfaced with an alliance between Russia and India.....

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...al-trasport-project/index.php#more

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...A_Irkut-HAL_Takeoff_Concept_lg.jpg



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineFridgmus From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 1442 posts, RR: 10
Reply 8, posted (7 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 22247 times:
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I've heard there are problems with the C-130J. Can anyone elaborate please?

Thanks,

Marc



The Lockheed Super Constellation, the REAL Queen of the Skies!
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4836 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 21848 times:

Update:

Outgoing CEO says Embraer is considering launch though there is no schedule.....

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...ical-airlifter-to-rival-c-130.html

Quote:
"Eyeing a gap in the market above Alenia Aeronautica’s C-27J, Botelho says Embraer is “testing the concept”, but “would need a real demonstration of interest” to launch a full development programme."


While successor says.....

Quote:
“We are not about to announce something.”



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8964 posts, RR: 39
Reply 10, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 21766 times:

Drawn on the E190. . . sweet. Would prob. look more C-295-ish than a C-27 or C-130.

Can anyone photo-shop it?



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineCancidas From Poland, joined Jul 2003, 4112 posts, RR: 11
Reply 11, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 21641 times:

would defiantely be interesting to see. that i find strange is that they want to power it by turbofans and not turbo props. for an airplane the size of a C-130 i would think you'd want to use it more as a tactical transport than just a mere airlifter. using it as an airlifter just doesn't make sense IMO, you sacrafice range and payload and quite possibly short-field capability. even with the short-field capabilities of the C-17, it's still too big to fill in for a C-130.

i would love to see embraer pull this off. the make a graet product and have such potential if they pick the right market. i think that they should get out of producing 135/45s and maybe try desiging a next-gen airplanes that would ultimately replace the 737/ A320. i only wonder if they'd ever start building big airplanes.



"...cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home."
User currently offline747400sp From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3618 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 21470 times:

Will it be a four engine jet?

User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4836 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 21425 times:

Quoting 747400sp (Reply 12):
Will it be a four engine jet?

Considering the 19-ton capacity, $50M target price and that they're basing it off the E190, it would likely be twin-engined like the HAL/Irkut joint venture in Reply 7. Besides, a four 17,000-22,000 lb. thrust PW6000 or BR715 powered airlifter might prove too ambitious a first effort for Embraer in this category.



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8964 posts, RR: 39
Reply 14, posted (7 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 21395 times:

Rumor is they are to announce a "study of viability" of the project at Latin America Aero & Defence (LAAD) this coming thursday. . .

http://www.laadexpo.com/en



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlinePanAm_DC10 From Australia, joined Aug 2000, 4162 posts, RR: 89
Reply 15, posted (7 years 5 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 21215 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
COMMUNITY MANAGER

Quoting PPVRA (Reply 14):
Rumor is they are to announce a "study of viability" of the project at Latin America Aero & Defence (LAAD) this coming thursday. . .

And they have. The following is from a subscriber service so just a summation so as to not breach copyright.

- They have confirmed that they have launched a "study of viability"
- Designation is the Embraer C-39
- Capacity to carry up to 19 metric tons of cargo

The full statement will be available on Embraers website shortly.

Regards, PanAm_DC10



Ask the impossible to achieve the best possible
User currently offlineLMP737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 5 months 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 21200 times:

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 2):
Hmmm, this would be more like a mini C-17. I doubt a turbofan airlifter of that size would really hurt the C-130J or C-27J sales very much. But, it could kill the slightly larger A-400M.

Even if it were to be launched it's not like the various european governements are going to dump the A400M in favor of whatever Embraer comes up with.


User currently offlineChecksixx From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1095 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 5 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 21159 times:

Quoting Fridgmus (Reply 8):
I've heard there are problems with the C-130J. Can anyone elaborate please?

Thanks,

Marc

Marc, could you just tell us what you've heard and then we can comment on it. No problems reported that I've heard of.


User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8964 posts, RR: 39
Reply 18, posted (7 years 5 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 21134 times:



Now that is cool!! I don't see much resemblance to the E-190, but I like it Big grin

Still interested to see what becomes of this. I hope they find it viable and launch it, but the jet versus prop use still puzzles me.



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (7 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 21111 times:

The wing looks like the Emb190. The Tail seems odd from a cargo load and aerodynamic standpoint.

There sure seems to be a sizeable market. The C-130 is over time, the A400 will be twice as large.

Getting some cockpit commonality with the A400 ( http://www.airbusmilitary.com/gallery/a400mcockpit1024.jpg ) might be smart idea. Also the engine could be considered. http://www.skycontrol.net/UserFiles/...ry_img/200603/200603avio_tp400.JPG


User currently offlineLifelinerOne From Netherlands, joined Nov 2003, 1922 posts, RR: 7
Reply 20, posted (7 years 5 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 21063 times:

Well, this is a good thing for Embraer if they do go on with this. Not only to fill a niche in the military transport area, but they will also gain knowledge on building bigger planes. I'm very curious if Embraer is going to walk in the B737/A320 segment in about 10 years. I think they can deliver a very cost-effective plane if they do.

Cheers!  wave 



Only Those Who Sleep Don't Make Mistakes
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8964 posts, RR: 39
Reply 21, posted (7 years 4 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 20900 times:







Interesting how the aft fuselage is "humped" up.

Looks like a whale moving it's tail to swim!  Smile



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineFridgmus From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 1442 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 20812 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Checksixx (Reply 17):
Marc, could you just tell us what you've heard and then we can comment on it. No problems reported that I've heard of.

Thanks Checksixx, I think I read it somewhere here on A.net. I'm racking my brain as to where. IIRC, it had something to with software and the USAF had some sort of problem with it. I'm at an airbase in northern Iraq and see the J models here all the time.

Thanks again,

Marc



The Lockheed Super Constellation, the REAL Queen of the Skies!
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 20778 times:

Quoting Checksixx (Reply 17):
Quoting Fridgmus (Reply 8):
I've heard there are problems with the C-130J. Can anyone elaborate please?

Thanks,

Marc

Marc, could you just tell us what you've heard and then we can comment on it. No problems reported that I've heard of

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5499155/
http://www.govexec.com/dailyfed/0105/012405cdpm3.htm
http://www.airliners.net/discussions/military/read.main/29524/
http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...sure-saves-c130j-program/index.php


User currently offlineFridgmus From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 1442 posts, RR: 10
Reply 24, posted (7 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 20766 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Thanks Keesje,  bigthumbsup  You too Checksixx!

Looks like they got the bugs worked out. They're starting to show up more and more here.

Thanks again,

Marc



The Lockheed Super Constellation, the REAL Queen of the Skies!
25 Post contains links PPVRA : http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...90-can-challenge-the-hercules.html
26 DEVILFISH : This would likely be targeted at those who could not quite afford the A400M or C-17, but need something different from the C-27J or C-295. It could b
27 Post contains links DEVILFISH : Update: Embraer claims strong market response to its proposed C-390..... http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...mbraers-c-390-makes-an-impact.html
28 Post contains images PPVRA : That is very good news! Also, Looks like potential Tucanos for the Army/Marine Corps.?
29 Post contains links DEVILFISH : More like for the Iraqi Air Force. See..... http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...i-counter-insurgency-aircraft.html Thread here..... U.S.A.F. Bids
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