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India To Buy Six C-130Js For Special Forces  
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4851 posts, RR: 1
Posted (7 years 4 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 14992 times:

The DSCA has notified Congress of the possible sale of six LockMart C-130J Hercules aircraft and ancilliaries to the IAF.....

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi...eH8AAAEAAG-Tmo8AAAAJ&modele=jdc_34

The aircraft are reportedly to be configured for Special Operations. Other report here.....

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...-for-special-forces/index.php#more

Would those be the same as the AC-130 gunship?


"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
33 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDL021 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 11447 posts, RR: 75
Reply 1, posted (7 years 4 months 4 days ago) and read 14944 times:

probably more like the RAF and USAF special ops birds which support SOF ops such as helo refueling, low and high level parachute drops, package retrieval, and other special forces mission support operations needed.


Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31684 posts, RR: 56
Reply 2, posted (7 years 4 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 14860 times:

Finally the IAF going west for purchases in this catergory.Will the An12s continue.

regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineDL021 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 11447 posts, RR: 75
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 14486 times:

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 4):
I was just referring to that it takes more than a fancy beret or some crap like that to make your forces "special

The Indian army has some excellent special forces and marines. Their jungle school is on the syllabus for several other militaries including the US.

Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 9):
My main question is, are there significant differences between an AC-130U Spooky, AC-130H Spectre and MC-130 Combat Talon at all?

Oh hell yes. The Spooky/Spectre are very different from the Combat Talon. MC-130s are multi-mission aircraft that are capable of very low flight, hi/lo parachute ops, air-air refuelling (both intake and delivery) as well as special packages for elint and targeting.

Spectre and Spooky are purpose converted gunships unsuited for any of the other operations. You can't really mount guns on the MC airplanes.

India is not looking for the gunships as far as I can tell....they want the multi-mission SOF support aircraft that the RAF has.



Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4851 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 14478 times:

Quoting DL021 (Reply 13):

Spectre and Spooky are purpose converted gunships unsuited for any of the other operations. You can't really mount guns on the MC airplanes.

India is not looking for the gunships as far as I can tell....they want the multi-mission SOF support aircraft that the RAF has.

They wouldn't be needing these bad boys, then.....

http://boeingmedia.com/imageDetail.cfm?id=14861&clr=release



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 14468 times:

I have heard a lot of knocks on the C-130J program, that it isn't really all that great of an aircraft....can someone clarify if it is a good bird?


One Nation Under God
User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31684 posts, RR: 56
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 3 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 14334 times:

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 15):
I have heard a lot of knocks on the C-130J program

Lets hear some.
regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4851 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (6 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 13836 times:

Another deal approved.....

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...rts-utility-helicopter-tender.html

Quote:
"Plans to re-equip the Indian armed forces are moving ahead, with government approval to purchase six Lockheed Martin C-130Js and a fresh tender for utility helicopters.

The $1 billion C-130 contract will be the biggest defence deal between India and the USA if confirmed, as expected, during US defence secretary Robert Gates' visit to New Delhi in March. Deliveries should start three years after the contract is signed.

The C-130Js are intended for India's special forces. Jim Grant, Lockheed's vice-president for air mobility and special operations, says the aircraft configuration for India 'is different from any of the C-130Js being manufactured for international customers'."


Something like this?.....

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Erik Sleutelberg


.....Or these.....

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Photo © Sunil Gupta
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Photo © Gregg stansbery


View Large View Medium
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Photo © Roel reijne
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Photo © Michael van der Mee - Touchdown Aviation


View Large View Medium
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Photo © Koen Leuvering
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © João Eduardo Sequeira - AzoresAirPhotos



[Edited 2008-02-04 13:41:27]


"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineLumberton From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 4708 posts, RR: 20
Reply 8, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 13509 times:

Flight reports that India is seeking 6 options in addition to the 6 that will likely be ordered.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...s-six-lockheed-c-130j-options.html

Quote:
ndia has asked for six options for Lockheed Martin C-130Js, potentially doubling the number of aircraft that it will induct in the next decade.
A $1 billion contract for six C-130Js is likely to be inked when US defence secretary Robert Gates visits New Delhi in March, and will be the biggest military deal between the two countries. Deliveries are expected to begin around 2010.




"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4851 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (4 years 3 months 1 week 16 hours ago) and read 12506 times:

Update:

First Indian C-130J-30 in IAF livery.....

http://www.lockheedmartin.com/data/a...0/c-130J_India-paint-hangar_tn.jpg

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...irst-c-130j-in-indian-colours.html


These will make a good combination with the C-17s they're getting.



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineLumberton From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 4708 posts, RR: 20
Reply 10, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 11746 times:

Speaking of C-17s:

UPDATE 1-Boeing says more India C-17 orders possible

Quote:
FARNBOROUGH, England, July 19 (Reuters) - India could buy 10 to 12 more C-17 transport planes from Boeing Co (BA.N) beyond the 10 planes already planned, Christopher Chadwick, president of Boeing military aircraft told Reuters on Monday.

Boeing, the No. 2 U.S. defense contractor, is forecasting strong demand for the C-17 planes, which have been used heavily during the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, Chadwick said at the Farnborough Airshow outside London.



"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4851 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 11642 times:

And none of this.....

http://media.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_AC-130U_Interior_30mm_Bushmaster_lg.jpg.
http://media.defenseindustrydaily.co...0U_Interior_30mm_Bushmaster_lg.jpg



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineebj1248650 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1932 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 14 hours ago) and read 11418 times:

C-130J had some problems during development and from what I understand it caused significant delays in initial deliveries. Since then, I've neither heard nor read anything that even remotely suggests the C-130J has turned out to be less than what the specifications called for.


Dare to dream; dream big!
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12150 posts, RR: 51
Reply 13, posted (4 years 2 months 1 week 13 hours ago) and read 11403 times:

Quoting ebj1248650 (Reply 26):
C-130J had some problems during development and from what I understand it caused significant delays in initial deliveries. Since then, I've neither heard nor read anything that even remotely suggests the C-130J has turned out to be less than what the specifications called for.

That was true with the launch customer, the RAF. However, LM has fixed all those problems in the last 10 + years. The C-130J program is just fine now.

Quoting Lumberton (Reply 24):
Speaking of C-17s:

UPDATE 1-Boeing says more India C-17 orders possible

Quote:
FARNBOROUGH, England, July 19 (Reuters) - India could buy 10 to 12 more C-17 transport planes from Boeing Co (BA.N) beyond the 10 planes already planned, Christopher Chadwick, president of Boeing military aircraft told Reuters on Monday.

Boeing, the No. 2 U.S. defense contractor, is forecasting strong demand for the C-17 planes, which have been used heavily during the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, Chadwick said at the Farnborough Airshow outside London.

A new twist for the C-17?


User currently offlinekaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 12480 posts, RR: 34
Reply 14, posted (4 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 11194 times:

It must be a very big culture change for IAF pilots converting from current types - such as the An-12/30 etc - to the C-130J and C-17A. I don't know how many crewmembers are on the older Russian types, but presumably the avionics on the Herk and particularly, the C-17, will make most of them redundant. I know some of the older Russian types now have GPS devices, but even still, they are very different machines from the newer types; the training regime required to convert IAF pilots to the new machines must be quite lengthy and complex.

User currently offlineUH60FtRucker From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (4 years 2 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 11181 times:

Honestly, I don't know why the US is so apathetic towards fostering a stronger relationship with India. Especially considering how much energy we waste on Pakistan. Having personally worked along side Pakistan, they are pathetic and not worth the effort.

India could be our best ally in the region, our next "UK". A strong and confident India would help to counter others such as Pakistan, Iran, China, Burma. We have a hell of a lot more in common, economically and politically than any other nation in the region. They're technically and tactically competent. We ought to be training more with them, and selling them more equipment.

It drives me nuts how much crap we put up with, when it comes to the Pakistanis. Ugh.


User currently offlinecomorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4896 posts, RR: 16
Reply 16, posted (4 years 2 months 7 hours ago) and read 11060 times:

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 15):
Honestly, I don't know why the US is so apathetic towards fostering a stronger relationship with India

There's blame on both sides. It started from the days of John Foster Dulles, and the US was never happy with India's ties with the USSR. On the other hand, India was sore when the US did not step in to help during its wars with its neighbors. Also, India has a significant number of communists in its body politic and they too are anti-US.

But times have changed, much for the better. The US-India relationship is in full bloom, and the cultural and economic basis is very strong. A lot of hard work by the Indian diaspora in the US has helped build trust, as both countries have been hurt badly by Jihadists.

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 15):
Having personally worked along side Pakistan, they are pathetic and not worth the effort.

To paraphrase your tag line, 'An army of asses led by asses?'  
Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 15):
India could be our best ally in the region, our next "UK". A strong and confident India would help to counter others such as Pakistan, Iran, China, Burma. We have a hell of a lot more in common, economically and politically than any other nation in the region. They're technically and tactically competent. We ought to be training more with them, and selling them more equipment.

Totally. But dealing with a chaotic democracy like India is also no walk in the park! Indians are very prickly as national pride is a big deal. I think Bush, the Clintons and now Obama have done a lot to forge a new relationship based on mutual respect, as has Israel, now arguably India's largest defence supplier.

To play a larger role in India, the US will also have to assure the Indians that they will supply through thick and thin - which is asking a lot of Congress and the Administration. India, in return, will need to understand that it is evolving into an ally of the US, and that the US can count on it for support.

The US should outsource its role as peacekeeper to India for the region. A win-win for all and poetic justice indeed!


User currently offlinecaliatenza From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 1577 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (4 years 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 10969 times:

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 15):

It drives me nuts how much crap we put up with, when it comes to the Pakistanis. Ugh.

The same thing me and my dad have been saying for years whenever we discuss this topic. Im a proud Indian-American and i would love India to become the US's strongest ally in the region. Hopefully the IAF picks US hardware in the MRCF competition.

[Edited 2010-08-03 02:45:26]

User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4851 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (3 years 12 months ago) and read 10346 times:

Pictures here of IAF C-130 first flight.....

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...eed-flies-indias-first-c-130j.html

Quote:
"India's first US-built military transport has made its debut flight, with the Lockheed Martin C-130J having taken to the air from Marietta, Georgia on 4 October.

The first of six stretched-fuselage Hercules on order for the Indian air force, aircraft KC-3801 will be followed by two more examples getting airborne 'within the next few weeks', Lockheed says."



And as an aside, talks are ongoing for a further four P-8Is.



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlinehimmat01 From India, joined Dec 2004, 1047 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 10158 times:

Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 18):
Quote:
"India's first US-built military transport has made its debut flight, with the Lockheed Martin C-130J having taken to the air from Marietta, Georgia on 4 October.

Certainly not the first US built military transport aircrafts with the IAF, It has flown the C-119 Flying Box Car in the past. IAF also flew the C-47 Dakota.



An airplane might disappoint any pilot but it'll never surprise a good one.
User currently offlinebikerthai From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 2137 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 10077 times:

Quoting comorin (Reply 16):
But dealing with a chaotic democracy like India is also no walk in the park!

The US have to deal with Italians, Greeks, and the French . . .

I would assume that at least the India Government have control over the Indian Military as opposed to the other way around (AKA Pakistan). That is always a plus.

And finally both India and the US can look at their common past as they step into the future . . . be glad that both were once ruled by the Brits and not the French.  
Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 18):
And as an aside, talks are ongoing for a further four P-8Is.

Everyone is saying that things will become official when Obama visit India.

Lets hope there are no major crisis to arise from now 'till then.

bikerthai



Intelligent seeks knowledge. Enlightened seeks wisdom.
User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7628 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 10049 times:

This means one more country NOT buying the A400M

User currently offlineDEVILFISH From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4851 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (3 years 11 months 4 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 10027 times:

Looking good.....

http://media.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_C-130J-30_India_1st_flight_lg.jpg
http://media.defenseindustrydaily.co..._C-130J-30_India_1st_flight_lg.jpg



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineDevilfish From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4851 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (2 years 12 months 18 hours ago) and read 7566 times:

They must've liked the first six a lot so they want six more?,,,,,

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...ks-to-buy-six-more-c-130js-362935/

Quote:
"The Indian air force is in negotiations to order a second batch of six Lockheed Martin C-130J Hercules, the US-based manufacturer has confirmed.

The new order will expand the fleet of six C-130Js India ordered in 2008, which Lockheed has already delivered.

The Indian air force immediately deployed its newly-delivered C-130Js in humanitarian missions, including relief flights to remote areas in northern India."


http://www.flightglobal.com/assets/getasset.aspx?itemid=42238



"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlineJoeCanuck From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 5472 posts, RR: 30
Reply 24, posted (2 years 12 months 7 hours ago) and read 7480 times:

Quoting caliatenza (Reply 17):

The same thing me and my dad have been saying for years whenever we discuss this topic. Im a proud Indian-American and i would love India to become the US's strongest ally in the region.

This will happen...and I think it is happening right now, but relatively quietly so not to upset Pakistan and China.

The US has much more in common with India than it has with either of the other two countries.

Pakistan is a necessary but temperamental ally and China will never be fully trusted enough to be a true ally.

If, (hopefully when), India better controls, (or directs), the corruption in government, they will overtake China.

At the moment, China speaks and acts with one voice, (regardless of behind the scenes drama), and that solidarity allows them to progress. India needs this kind of solidarity while maintaining the ingenuity and innovation that can flourish in an environment where free thinking and inspiration is not only allowed, but encouraged.

I think many forget that India is still a very young democracy. I have no doubt India will learn the lessons needed to become a true economic giant.



What the...?
25 HAWK21M : I guess the Security Interests of each will determine the Alliance. US is drifting away from PAK thanks to the Pak logic of supporting Terror private
26 JoeCanuck : I really do think there is a huge diplomatic effort to bring the US and India closer...and I take the silence of any interaction between the two as a
27 HAWK21M : I think India has been disapointed at US reaction to cross border terror against India & has been trying to refrain India from any strong respons
28 JoeCanuck : Which is also why I am thinking that especially with the very public scolding of Pakistan by the US, it is more likely the US is finally trying to ac
29 HAWK21M : The Pak nukes are monitored closely by most concerned countries & they will be eliminated before they fall in wrong hands. India thru experience
30 JoeCanuck : Which is the best way to go. India's self sufficiency economically and militarily will be the cornerstone to stability in the region...in my opinion.
31 Post contains links and images Devilfish : Update: Congress notified of additional six-frame sale..... http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...possible-india-c-130j-deal-364006/ Quote: "The US D
32 Post contains links and images vishaljo : Sweet plane the Hercules, shot it arriving for its first public appearance @ Aero India in February View Large View MediumPhoto © Vishal Jolapara - I
33 HAWK21M : Time will tell......China seems more of a concern though.....Its not a Democracy so its tough to know whats going on within....
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