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Need A Little Help Getting Over Tomcats  
User currently online747400sp From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3599 posts, RR: 2
Posted (6 years 7 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 3561 times:

There been many times when I started to accept the Rhinos as the USN main fighter jet, and somebody on my ship talk about how great the Tomcat was. I never got to see one lunch off the flight deck and it bother me. I need a advice on how to let this one go.

17 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineLMP737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (6 years 7 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 3519 times:

Well you could order this book from Amazon.

< http://ultra.glo.be/daco/ >

< http://www.amazon.com/F-14-Tomcat-Da...UTF8&s=books&qid=1201530995&sr=8-2 >

Or you could order the F-14 NATOPS on ebay.

< http://cgi.ebay.com/Grumman-F-14-Tom...sidZp1638.m118.l1247QQcmdZViewItem >


User currently offlineCx747 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 4454 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (6 years 7 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 3454 times:

You're not the only one with this issue. I happened to be home for a while on Sat and saw that "Top Gun" was on. No more Tomcat and no more Miramar for the USN. What a fall from glory.


"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
User currently offlinePetertenthije From Netherlands, joined Jul 2001, 3364 posts, RR: 12
Reply 3, posted (6 years 7 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 3443 times:

Take a trip to Iran. You won't see them launch from a carrier, but at least they are operational.  Wink


Attamottamotta!
User currently offlineMichlis From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 737 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (6 years 7 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 3420 times:

Quoting 747400sp (Thread starter):
I need a advice on how to let this one go.



Quoting Cx747 (Reply 2):
You're not the only one with this issue.

Perhaps a support group?   

Quoting Petertenthije (Reply 3):
Take a trip to Iran. You won't see them launch from a carrier, but at least they are operational

Yeah, but how "operational" are they. Just being able to taxi with a push from the ground crew doesn't count. You'd be better off taking a trip down memory lane at the bone yard.

[Edited 2008-01-28 10:02:03]


If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the outcome of a hundred battles.
User currently offlineB6JFKH81 From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2882 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (6 years 7 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3187 times:

I completely understand your pain. My father worked for Grumman and was involved with the F-14. I would spend many weekends with him at work and watch the F-14's and A-6E's all day. I got my first ride in an F-14 at the age of 9...what a plane! It kills me to see one just sitting at the American Airpower Museum at FRG, an empty shell.

My father told me that there wouldn't be any F-14's preserved here in the US...even for air show purposes. Is that true? The two F-14's that I have seen on display (1 at FRG and 1 in SAN at the USS Midway) seem to only be set up for static display, never to take to the air again.  cry 



"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 6, posted (6 years 7 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3181 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
DATABASE EDITOR



Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 5):
My father told me that there wouldn't be any F-14's preserved here in the US...even for air show purposes. Is that true?

There's one on display in the "Air Zoo" (museum) in Kalamazoo, Michigan.

2H4



Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineMoose135 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 2314 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (6 years 7 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 3111 times:



Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 5):
My father told me that there wouldn't be any F-14's preserved here in the US...even for air show purposes. Is that true?

No, no more flying F-14s in the US. There are lot's on display, but none flightworthy. Hope you got to see the jet at FRG when she arrived - that was the final USN flight of a Tomcat anywhere.

http://moose135.smugmug.com/photos/100142383-L.jpg



KC-135 - Passing gas and taking names!
User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4819 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (6 years 7 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 3075 times:

Still a great looking bird... such a shame... blame Dumbass Rumsfeld and his ego for scrapping the Super Tomcat and the scrapping of the Tomcats.


56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineChecksixx From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 1088 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (6 years 7 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2972 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 6):
There's one on display in the "Air Zoo" (museum) in Kalamazoo, Michigan.

2H4

Point in fact...that F-14A there at the Air Zoo is probably one of the best kept secrets...they've still got everything with it. Engines, gun, cockpit, ejection seats etc...

Made a trip back home in Jan just to get pictures of it along with the SR-71B they have there.


User currently offlineCF188A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (6 years 7 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2927 times:



Quoting 747400sp (Thread starter):
I need a advice on how to let this one go.

Why let go ? Just join the Iranian Air Force  Smile


User currently offlineKPDX From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 2741 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (6 years 7 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2897 times:



Cant say that this video will make help, but it is sure a awesome video!  Smile



View my aviation videos on Youtube by searching for zildjiandrummr12
User currently online747400sp From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3599 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (6 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2555 times:



Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 8):
blame Dumbass Rumsfeld and his ego for scrapping the Super Tomcat and the scrapping of the Tomcats.

Don't blame Rumsfeld, blame his friend Dick Chaney.


User currently offlineAGC525 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 989 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 5 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 2407 times:

My love for aviation started with the movie Top Gun when I was 9 and went from there, I've been in love with the big cat ever since. If a support group won't help, when you're not on a.net (like me) come on over to http://www.tomcat-sunset.org/forums/index.php you'll find plenty of great people with the same love.

 Smile

It's ashame to not only see the F-18 replace the F-14, but the A-6, KA-6, and now in 2009 the EA-6B. Could the E-2C be next??

Anytime, baby...!



American Aviation: From Kitty Hawk to the Moon in 66 years!
User currently offlineCloudy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (6 years 5 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 2402 times:

I was under the impression that the Tomcat's main sin was being a maintenance hog. Would that also be true of the canceled new versions, if built?

User currently offlinePWM2TXLHopper From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1324 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (6 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 2241 times:

Quoting 747400sp (Reply 12):


Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 8):
blame Dumbass Rumsfeld and his ego for scrapping the Super Tomcat and the scrapping of the Tomcats.

Don't blame Rumsfeld, blame his friend Dick Chaney.

I loved the Tomcat too, but let's not get political. If you want to throw around blame, then why not blame President Regan and Gorbachev for bringing an end to the Cold War? That's the war the bird was designed to fight, and the days for a long range interceptor were numbered once the Cold War came to an end. It's really that simple. Doesn't have that much to do with politics, but I'm sure those suffering Bush Administration Derangement Syndrome love having one more thing to try and contribute the blame to? If that's really the case, that doesn't make sense though because I thought the Administration was just burning us into further national debt and wasting our tax dollars? This just can't be if the other major reason for retirement was to save the vast amount of hours and dollars in maintenance it kept to keep the Tomcat flying. So which is it?

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 5):
I completely understand your pain. My father worked for Grumman and was involved with the F-14. I would spend many weekends with him at work and watch the F-14's and A-6E's all day. I got my first ride in an F-14 at the age of 9...

If I may ask, just how did you get that opportunity? That would be awesome! And I thought I was a lucky kid when I use to get to fly on Delta or United 2-3 times a year to visit family! I didn't think it was possible for a civilian to get a ride in a fighter like that no matter whose family member they were? Especially at nine years old! Unless you're one of the local news reporters that go up in the Blue Angels or Thunderbird jets the day before an airshow. I wouldn't think a nine year old would be too compatible with an ejection seat if it were necessary to use one!

[Edited 2008-03-12 18:42:28]

[Edited 2008-03-12 18:44:08]

User currently offlineZkpilot From New Zealand, joined Mar 2006, 4819 posts, RR: 9
Reply 16, posted (6 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2179 times:



Quoting PWM2TXLHopper (Reply 15):
Quoting Zkpilot (Reply 8):
blame Dumbass Rumsfeld and his ego for scrapping the Super Tomcat and the scrapping of the Tomcats.

Don't blame Rumsfeld, blame his friend Dick Chaney.

I loved the Tomcat too, but let's not get political. If you want to throw around blame, then why not blame President Regan and Gorbachev for bringing an end to the Cold War? That's the war the bird was designed to fight, and the days for a long range interceptor were numbered once the Cold War came to an end. It's really that simple. Doesn't have that much to do with politics, but I'm sure those suffering Bush Administration Derangement Syndrome love having one more thing to try and contribute the blame to? If that's really the case, that doesn't make sense though because I thought the Administration was just burning us into further national debt and wasting our tax dollars? This just can't be if the other major reason for retirement was to save the vast amount of hours and dollars in maintenance it kept to keep the Tomcat flying. So which is it?

Rumsfeld (not sure about Cheney but it wouldn't surprise me) backed the wrong horse so to speak back in the day and so was spiteful of Grumman ever since... he bided his time until he was in a position of enough power and pulled the plug on production of the Super-Tomcat which would have been a much more advanced aircraft, much less maintenance intensive and would have offered greater capability with lower operating costs. Once the Super-Tomcat was killed, it was only a matter of time before the rest of the Tomcats got served their death sentance as many were getting old, they were maintenance intensive, and whilst they adapted and performed many roles better than Hornets/Super Hornets, Rumsfeld wanted to stick it to Grumman (now Northrop Grumman) and that was that.



56 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
User currently offlineBaron95 From United States of America, joined May 2006, 1335 posts, RR: 8
Reply 17, posted (6 years 5 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 2083 times:



Quoting AGC525 (Reply 13):
's ashame to not only see the F-18 replace the F-14, but the A-6, KA-6, and now in 2009 the EA-6B.

I actually think it is great that the USN got the green light for the F-18E/F/G. The cost and operational efficiencies will actually enable the Navy to be relevant. The F14 was mostly irrelevant by the first Gulf war. It performed nothing more than token CAP missions at a very high cost.

How is the USN better off with the F-18EFG?

Going forward even a solo/unsuported (by USAF tankers, AWACS, etc) navy package will probably be a a couple of F-18Gs with enough radar/comm jamming pods each to warm up your coffee from 100 nm away plus the anti radiation missiles, 4 or so a-2-a configured F18Es with Slammer Ds, two tranmitting, two hunting, 4+ F-18E/Fs with JDAMs, enough F18 buddy tankers. All of these with EASA radars, datalinked, low RCS, mapped ingress/egress routes.

Do you get the power? A single type jamming, harming, bombing, CAPing, refueling, all coming in at M0.95+. The Gs will stear you between radar strong holds, JAM/destroy the critical ones, mess up your comms. The Es will CAP with EASA, the E/Fs will come in with optical fiber towed decoys do drop the load. It is very unlikely that a non AESA/less stealthy can challenge the CAP. It is very unlikely that SAMs would be effective unless they fire on the order of 100 missiles at the package.

How was the USN better off before the Super Bug, having to send in mixed packages of F14s, A6, KA16 and short ranged F-18C/D.

Now, in 10 years, we get rid of the F18C/D and replace them with F35s. What an awesome air wing it will be.

The F14 is an awesome plane - but its time had really passed it by. I, for one, am glad it was retired from service before turning into a caricature of a plane with no mission.



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