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SpaceX Falcon 1 Flight 3 Launch Thread  
User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4318 times:

SpaceX has announced that today, August 2nd, 2008 will be the launch date of the third Falcon 1 rocket. The rocket will be carrying the JumpStart military satellite.

Liftoff was scheduled for 7pm EDT, but has now been pushed to 8pm EDT. LOX loading has begun at Kwaj.

A link to the live feed is available at http://www.spacex.com/.

A.net coverage however, will be here.  Smile

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 

48 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4309 times:

First stage LOX loading complete. Second stage is at 50%.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4306 times:

LOX loading complete. T-55 hold in place.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4304 times:

Correction on the payload:

The Falcon 1 Flight 3 mission carries a total of nearly 170 kilograms (375 pounds) of payload,
consisting of three separating satellite payloads; Trailblazer, PRESat, and NanoSail-D, which are all
carried and deployed from the Secondary Payload Adaptor and Separation System (SPASS) which
is owned and developed by ATSB of Malaysia.


...per the presskit.

http://www.spacex.com/SpaceX_F1-003_PressKit.pdf

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4291 times:

Abort.

Detanking underway. No word on when countdown will resume or if launch will be scrubbed today.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4273 times:

Now in final countdown for launch at 11:00pm ET.

User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4271 times:

T-0.5 sec...ABORT.

Standing by to find out which parameter didn't jive.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4269 times:

Same thing happened to Flight No.2 last year. They still launched that day, but that was a lot earlier in the launch window.

User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4263 times:

Word is, depending on the cause of the abort they may still recycle the countdown from T-10 minutes.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineNomadd22 From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 1899 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4263 times:

Also similar to last year, 1 out of 184 parameters was 1% out of range. Cautious folks.


Andy Goetsch
User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4256 times:



Quoting Nomadd22 (Reply 9):
Also similar to last year, 1 out of 184 parameters was 1% out of range. Cautious folks.

That was basically the cause of most of those last-second Shuttle launch aborts, too.


User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4254 times:

And here we go again... new launch time is about 11:34pm ET.

User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4252 times:

Launch sequence recycled, strongback retracted again, T-7 minutes and counting.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4241 times:

LIFTOFF! Falcon 1 No.3 has cleared the tower.

User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4242 times:

Liftoff.

There has been an anomoly on the vehicle.

More word to come.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4241 times:

Looks like a launch failure.

User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1001 posts, RR: 51
Reply 16, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4223 times:

Wow, talk about hard knocks for Space X. Falcon 1 is sure turning into an ornery little LV  Sad

0-3


User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4213 times:

Tough break indeed. This flight didn't even make it to staging before the feed cut out.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4212 times:

This is bad news all around. I wouldn't be surprised if Elon Musk pulls the plug on SpaceX now. He already went on record as saying he'd only give it three failures before he starts thinking about giving up on it.

If they can't get Falcon 1 flying, forget about Falcon 9.

There's still Orbital with Taurus II/Cygnus, but SpaceX was clearly the front-runner and now they're a gigantic question mark.

Look for Congress to really start arguing for continuing the Shuttle after 2010 now.


User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4206 times:



Quoting Thorny (Reply 18):
This is bad news all around. I wouldn't be surprised if Elon Musk pulls the plug on SpaceX now. He already went on record as saying he'd only give it three failures before he starts thinking about giving up on it.

He did go on record stating he regretted that remark. Of course SpaceX now has a manifest with clients, so pulling the plug may not be so simple.

Quoting Thorny (Reply 18):
If they can't get Falcon 1 flying, forget about Falcon 9.

There's still Orbital with Taurus II/Cygnus, but SpaceX was clearly the front-runner and now they're a gigantic question mark.

I really am hoping to see Dragon fly.  Sad

Quoting Thorny (Reply 18):
Look for Congress to really start arguing for continuing the Shuttle after 2010 now.

Well that's Congress for ya. That ignores the total tear down and recert for the orbiters, plus the commitment to Orion. I'd say that program will be accelerated...though I wonder about the Ares issues.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1001 posts, RR: 51
Reply 20, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 4192 times:



Quoting Thorny (Reply 18):
This is bad news all around. I wouldn't be surprised if Elon Musk pulls the plug on SpaceX now. He already went on record as saying he'd only give it three failures before he starts thinking about giving up on it.

IIRC, Flight 4 was slated for September prior to tonight's failure. That would probably mean that the next vehicle is nearing completion, barring any modifications that come out of the Flight 3 aftermath. After the hundreds of millions he has already sank, the extra cost of seeing Flight 4 are going to be very small.

So there's no good reason not to stick with it a little longer. But if Flight 4 fails, I think he should drop SpaceX like a hot potato.


User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 4192 times:



Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 19):
He did go on record stating he regretted that remark. Of course SpaceX now has a manifest with clients, so pulling the plug may not be so simple.

Irrelevant. Watch his customers depart at the speed of light (see Delta III.) There are alternatives to Falcon 1 available now (Pegasus, Taurus, Rokot, Dnepr) or very soon (Vega.) No one will trust SpaceX with a payload until they've put one in orbit. Falcon No.4, if Musk doesn't call it quits, will have to fly without a real payload. There's no way around that now. That means a lot more out of pocket expenses for Musk. I strongly suspect his customers won't wait another 17 months for him to prove Falcon 1. And with customers departing in droves and the bills stacking up... no, I think Falcon died tonight.

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 19):
I really am hoping to see Dragon fly.

My bet is that Falcon is dead and SpaceX will switch to launching Dragon on Atlas V. But the price increase will be huge and the program might well go belly-up before it gets to first flight.

I hope I'm wrong.


User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 4186 times:



Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 20):

So there's no good reason not to stick with it a little longer.

SpaceX supporters made that assertion last time. The "easy fix" and "just a few months" ended up taking 17 months to "fix" Falcon 1, and this flight actually did a lot worse than Flight 2.


User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 4183 times:



Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 20):
IIRC, Flight 4 was slated for September prior to tonight's failure. That would probably mean that the next vehicle is nearing completion, barring any modifications that come out of the Flight 3 aftermath. After the hundreds of millions he has already sank, the extra cost of seeing Flight 4 are going to be very small.

So there's no good reason not to stick with it a little longer.

 checkmark 

Quoting Thorny (Reply 21):
Irrelevant. Watch his customers depart at the speed of light (see Delta III.) There are alternatives to Falcon 1 available now (Pegasus, Taurus, Rokot, Dnepr) or very soon (Vega.) No one will trust SpaceX with a payload until they've put one in orbit. Falcon No.4, if Musk doesn't call it quits, will have to fly without a real payload. There's no way around that now. That means a lot more out of pocket expenses for Musk. I strongly suspect his customers won't wait another 17 months for him to prove Falcon 1. And with customers departing in droves and the bills stacking up... no, I think Falcon died tonight.

Of course I'm not a Kool-Aid drinker. The hardware for Flight 4 should be nearing completion, so I think as a matter of investment, we'll see it go up...whether it succeeds or not. You make very sound arguments and I'm not totally disagreeing, but -004 will go to Kwaj, I'm certain.

Quoting Thorny (Reply 21):
My bet is that Falcon is dead and SpaceX will switch to launching Dragon on Atlas V. But the price increase will be huge and the program might well go belly-up before it gets to first flight.

COTS C1 should be in fabrication stages now. They recently were beginning low level component testing for the first flight. After the effort it took to get through CDR for just that flight (they have three CDRs for each demo flight and they're getting through them in lock step), the cost increase at this point would be rather large. Dragon is designed around Falcon 9. Adapting it for Atlas will set it back a lot...to the point where I believe it'd make sense to just go with Orion.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineThorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (6 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 4177 times:



Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 23):
The hardware for Flight 4 should be nearing completion,

I don't mean to be so negative... its just the disappointment talking.

On the other hand, Boeing left lots of Delta III components lying around too. Customers wouldn't go near the thing. And that was Boeing.


25 Post contains links 787atPAE : I find it ironic that inertial guidance was supposed to kick in when this failure occurred (L+2:20). The launch sequence can be read via www.spaceflig
26 Boeing4ever : All we can do at the moment is speculate. When the cause of the failure of 003 is known, then the picture will start getting clearer. Note I said 004
27 Post contains links Nomadd22 : The message from Musk tonight says the next two Falcon 1 rockets being prepared for launches. "SpaceX will not skip a beat in execution going forward.
28 BWilliams : Any other information on what the exact faillure mode was? Obviously, a total loss of vehicle and payload? Too bad, for a project that seemed to have
29 Nomadd22 : Sorry for the cheap shot. It looks like the stages failed to separate. Possibly a problem when the second stage tanks pressurized prior to separation.
30 787atPAE : This may be a silly question, but when was the last time a startup company tried to do what SpaceX is doing now? They seem to be essentially starting
31 Thorny : Nope. SpaceX boarded up the windows and hid in the cellar the second the thing failed. Not exactly the best way to "win friends and influence people.
32 Nomadd22 : I'd be greatful if you never mentioned Roton again. I'd always been disappointed that the Dotcom millionaires seemed to be so lacking when it came to
33 Post contains links 787atPAE : Speaking of camera feed: http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewnews.html?id=1299 While watching the video at that link, it really bothered me to hear folk
34 Thorny : That was 50 years ago and we learned a lot of lessons the hard way through all those launch failures. SpaceX seems to be deliberately, even enthusias
35 Boeing4ever : Did anyone else notice the oscillations early in the flight before inertial guidance activation? Looked similar to what happened to DemoFlight 2's 2nd
36 Post contains links Nomadd22 : A few second hand words from Elon "We're not quite ready to release details on the initial investigation yet, but we should do it very soon. We think
37 BWilliams : Quoting the above article: "The light-lift Falcon 1 was lost after its two stages failed to separate during the launch from the Kwajalein Atoll in the
38 Boeing4ever : The most recent flight (#3) on Aug. 2nd, 2008. B4e-Forever New Frontiers
39 Post contains links Nomadd22 : Four methods of analysis – vehicle inertial measurement, chamber pressure, onboard video and a simple physics free body calculation – all give the
40 Nomadd22 : SpaceX has the unedited video up now. You can see the first stage drop away and come back up to hit the second stage. It turns out they thought they c
41 Boeing4ever : Disappointing is a word thrown around alot lately in this thread. But this is NOT a new problem that was just recently discovered. The issue in which
42 Thorny : Yes, NASA had a close call with Apollo 15. They'd deleted too many separation motors from the Saturn V to save weight for the J missions and 15's fir
43 Boeing4ever : Glad I held off citing a specific example, I had it in my mind that it was Apollo 6. As long as Falcon 1-004 isn't victim of the pogo effect... Well,
44 Thorny : ATSB (a Malaysian satellite) has been bumped to Flight 5. There will still be a payload on Falcon 1 No.4 (there has to be to test it properly) but it
45 Nomadd22 : I tried to do a dirty calculation of what 5 seconds of extra freefall before separation would do to payload and came up with 120 pounds of extra fuel
46 Gigneil : I just want to point out that the majority of delay between those two was the switch from Merlin A1 to Merlin 1C. Also, Falcon 1 doesn't need to succ
47 Thorny : That was a mistake. They should have gotten the baseline vehicle working before they started upgrading it. Flight No.3 would probably have made it if
48 Boeing4ever : "We won't make the same mistakes again, I can assure you that!" - Hammond "No, no John, you're making whole new ones!" - Malcom As preachy as The Los
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