BarfBag From India, joined Mar 2001, 2050 posts, RR: 6 Reply 2, posted (4 years 7 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 6522 times:
Chandrayaan-! Launched Successfully
Currently in 23000x240 km orbit . Orbit elevation in progress to enable earth escape. The 590-kg payload will reach the moon in 5 days. It consists of 11 instruments, half from India and the rest from NASA, ESA and other agencies who were invited to provide their own instruments without charge, in return for the ISRO having free access to their data.
Comorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4675 posts, RR: 17 Reply 4, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 6407 times:
Hats off to the ISRO team!
Here's hoping that the LAM works just as well and is able to propel the craft into the various orbital stages.
It's interesting that while India's previous space efforts had clear social objectives (distance learning, weather etc), Chandrayaan's mission seems more scientific in nature. How is the common man viewing this in terms of social benefit?
I guess Pakistan will now feel compelled to launch its own 'Halal' spacecraft.
Venus6971 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 1410 posts, RR: 1 Reply 6, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 6389 times:
Welcome to the club, wonder if they will get close any of the Apollo landing sights for a few pics, you tin foil brigade types need not answer we went there. Congrats and maybe this will spark a competative streak for all in space exploration.
Thorny From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 7, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6379 times:
Quoting Venus6971 (Reply 6): wonder if they will get close any of the Apollo landing sights for a few pics, you tin foil brigade types need not answer we went there.
If the Flat Earthers don't believe photos taken on the ground, why would they believe photos taken from 50 miles up? :-0
Quoting Venus6971 (Reply 6): Congrats and maybe this will spark a competative streak for all in space exploration.
This was actually the third of four lunar missions planned for around 2008. Japan's SELENE (Kaguya) launched in September 2007. China's Chang'e 1 launched in October 2007. India's Chandrayaan launched this week, and NASA's Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter is scheduled to launch in March.
TheSonntag From Germany, joined Jun 2005, 3347 posts, RR: 30 Reply 8, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6373 times:
And the German idiots in charge refused funding for our moon mission ... Congrats to India.
I am really looking forward to the LRO mission, I am quite sure Nasa will release pictures of the Apollo relics with it, as 2009 will be the 40th anniversary of the Apollo moon landing.
BarfBag From India, joined Mar 2001, 2050 posts, RR: 6 Reply 9, posted (4 years 7 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 6316 times:
Quoting Alessandro (Reply 5): Saw that the first Indian satelite launch was in 1975, how many satelite launches has been made by ISRO during the last 33 years and the success rate?
The ISRO has built 45 satellites. A few were also purchased from Ford Aerospace in the late 1970s/early 80s, when they were not experts at advanced satellites yet. During that time, the heavier satellites were launched on the Ariane 4/5 or the Shuttle, but now that the ISRO has the PSLV and GLSV heavy lifters, both of which have proved their reliability, they've moved to doing everything themselves - fabricating the satellite and launcher, as well as even having their own dedicated silicon foundry to produce the hardened microchips used on board them.
Among satellites we've built, there are two primary series - the Indian National Satellite (INSAT) system of telecommunications satellites in geostationary orbit, of which 11 are currently active - the latest of them to enable local direct-to-home TV service. Besides telecom, they are used for distance learning services. The second series are the 9 Indian Remote Sensing (IRS) satellites, which are earth observation satellites used for analyzing soil conditions, meteorological conditions (especially the monsoons and cyclones), flood/drought monitoring and mineral mapping.
Chandrayaan-1's Indian payloads:
Terrain Mapping Camera
Hyper Spectral Imager
Lunar Laser Ranging Instrument
High-Energy X-ray spectrometer
Moon Impactor Probe - which will land on the moon and carry the flag of India on board.
Invited foreign payloads (chosen by competition):
Chandrayaan X-Ray Spectrometer (ESA/Rutherford Appleton Lab, UK)
Near Infrared Spectrometer (ESA/Max Planck Institute, Germany)
Sub-Kev Atom Reflecting Analyser (Swedish Institute of Space Science/ISRO)
Radiation Dose Monitor (Bulgarian Academy of Sciences)
Mini-Synthetic Aperture Radar (John Hopkins University/Naval Air Warfare Center/NASA)
Moon Mineralogy Mapper (Brown University/NASA JPL)
Comorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4675 posts, RR: 17 Reply 10, posted (4 years 7 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 6207 times:
Barfbag, is there a site where you can track progress of the craft while it jumps orbits? I believe it'll take 14 days to make it into Lunar Orbit.
The EBN-1 orbit raising maneuver has already been performed successfully, according to the news reports so far. The last of them, EBN-5, will be done on November 8. Part of the reason the ISRO is taking such a protracted operation is that they want to use the data from these maneuvers to collect data so they can calibrate the advanced instruments in the Indian Deep Space Network system they just inaugurated. Until now, they have had strictly LEO/polar/GEO operations, never into deep space.
As usual, the ISRO shows their practical side, rather than just make it about prestige. For a mere $85 million, they've not only gained enormous PR for India, but also inspired millions of youngsters to get an education, and to learn science and technology. That can only be a good thing.
Comorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4675 posts, RR: 17 Reply 12, posted (4 years 7 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6149 times:
BB, thanks for the link and more details. It is remarkable that India is able to sling a craft to the Moon, and for just $85M!
I feel that we have gone through a lost decade or two in Science. The best and brightest are all rushing to becoming Javascript jockeys in Silicon Valley or Quants on Wall Street. What a waste of talent! If you look at the published work in Mathematics or Physics, Indian names no longer feature. There are no potential candidates of Nobels or Fields prizes in the near future. The promise of fat bonuses or stock options has slowed down finding cures for cancer or other research for human good. In my time, getting to Caltech was the end-all of life; today it's Wharton.
A per the article, Chandrayaan is in an elliptical orbit with an apogee of about 100,000 miles.
There are three more 'jumps' :
"The three maneuvers are slated for October 29, November 3 and 8. When the Chandrayaan-1’s engine is fired on November 8, the spacecraft will go round the moon in an orbit of 7,500 km by 500 km. On November 14/15, it will reach the final orbit of 100 km around the moon"...
BarfBag From India, joined Mar 2001, 2050 posts, RR: 6 Reply 15, posted (4 years 7 months 6 hours ago) and read 6024 times:
The Chandrayaan is close to EBN-3 now. It is at 160,000 km from earth. The ISRO Deep Space Network seems to be working fine so far.
Quoting Comorin (Reply 12): The best and brightest are all rushing to becoming Javascript jockeys in Silicon Valley or Quants on Wall Street.
Well, the Chandrayaan project itself may be te harbinger of change. There was a news item the other day saying ISRO received several requests in the last few days from a bunch of Indian-origin scientists at NASA asking about job opportunities at ISRO. The recent economic growth has heralded a reverse brain drain, of Indian professors and scientists returning to India. It is true that a lot of youngsters want to make a quick buck out of the IT/finance fields, though the recent economic turmoil and the collapse of investment banking as a field may change things.
Comorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4675 posts, RR: 17 Reply 16, posted (4 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 5992 times:
Quoting BarfBag (Reply 15): Indian-origin scientists at NASA asking about job opportunities at ISRO.
I saw a movie with SRK as a returning NASA engineer - forget the name.. I also hope every kid reads APJ's "Wings of Fire" - what an inspiring book!
TRVYYZ From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 1311 posts, RR: 11 Reply 17, posted (4 years 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 5927 times:
Quoting Comorin (Reply 16):
I saw a movie with SRK as a returning NASA engineer - forget the name..
SWADES.
Quoting BarfBag (Reply 15): There was a news item the other day saying ISRO received several requests in the last few days from a bunch of Indian-origin scientists at NASA asking about job opportunities at ISRO.
They must not be serious. Their pay scale is similiar to the UGC, these guys won't survive in India with that salary after being used to the lavish life. unless of course, ISRO is going to pay them on the same level as the IT guys in India.
As far as the scientists in India/ISRO are concerned, they are one of the best and dedicated and don't think of the money. I have a few friends/batchmates there. I've also been to the two ISRO centres in Trivandrum and they are pretty cool except for the CISF guys at the gate.
Comorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4675 posts, RR: 17 Reply 18, posted (4 years 6 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 5886 times:
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 17): They must not be serious. Their pay scale is similiar to the UGC, these guys won't survive in India with that salary after being used to the lavish life. unless of course, ISRO is going to pay them on the same level as the IT guys in India.
As far as the scientists in India/ISRO are concerned, they are one of the best and dedicated and don't think of the money. I have a few friends/batchmates there. I've also been to the two ISRO centres in Trivandrum and they are pretty cool except for the CISF guys at the gate.
TRVYYZ,
The 'Return to India' thing just doesn't work well. The guys who stayed behind are proud of what they have accomplished, and may resent interloping NRI stylos with accents! The guys going back have not only to adjust to a very different working culture but also to a different physical environment. It works best if you are going back as the boss of something.
BarfBag From India, joined Mar 2001, 2050 posts, RR: 6 Reply 20, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5765 times:
Payscales for scientists are certainly an issue. If that is addressed, there's a significant opportunity. There's a trend towards niche institutions attracting significant Indian and foreign talent, e.g. in string theory at TIFR. One more thing about ISRO is that those who apply must be Indian citizens. Don't NASA's security requirements mean these people have to become US citizens first ? If so, they lose the chance to work at ISRO.
Quote: The fourth orbit raising manoeuvre of Chandrayaan-1 spacecraft was carried out today (October 29, 2008) morning at 07:38 am IST. During this manoeuvre, the spacecraft’s 440 Newton liquid engine was fired for about three minutes. With this, Chandrayaan-1 entered into a more elliptical orbit whose apogee (farthest point to Earth) lies at 267,000 km (two lakh sixty seven thousand km) while the perigee (nearest point to Earth) lies at 465 km.Thus, Chandrayaan-1 spacecraft’s present orbit extends more than half the way to moon. In this orbit, the spacecraft takes about six days to go round the Earth once. One more orbit raising manoeuvre is scheduled to send the spacecraft to the vicinity of the moon at a distance of about 384,000 km from the Earth.
After the last EBN-5 maneuver, it will move into lunar capture orbit.
Comorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4675 posts, RR: 17 Reply 22, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 5696 times:
Question: Given that the spacecraft is almost a light-second away, does the message to fire the motor say "Fire Now" with ISRO's computers estimating the message lag, or does the message say " Fire at xxx:xxx time on board" assuming synchronized clocks?
I'm not a rocket scientist, but let me try any ways
Why would the lag matter anyways? The speed of communication b/w earth and the satellite would be also 3x10e8 m/s (assuming rf/microwave). Also, it may use some DSP hardware in the spacecraft which is supposed to perform in real time, the lag should be minimal.
The final lag would be the mechanical firing compared to which the previous lags I mentioned would be nothing.
Basically they are trying to remote control the spacecraft to the trajectory or orbit that is desired for which I think the time wouldn't be so critical.Lemme know if my guess is wrong
Comorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4675 posts, RR: 17 Reply 24, posted (4 years 6 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 5663 times:
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 23): Why would the lag matter anyways? The speed of communication b/w earth and the satellite would be also 3x10e8 m/s (assuming rf/microwave). Also, it may use some DSP hardware in the spacecraft which is supposed to perform in real time, the lag should be minimal.
That's about 500 millisecs, so I guess it's not that important!
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 23): The final lag would be the mechanical firing compared to which the previous lags I mentioned would be nothing.
Good point.
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 23): Basically they are trying to remote control the spacecraft to the trajectory or orbit that is desired for which I think the time wouldn't be so critical.Lemme know if my guess is wrong
I think you're probably right. Thanks for the clearing that up
Let's see if any rocket scientists on a.net can add any further to this.
25 BarfBag: According to the ISRO report, the firings are done when the spacecraft is in its perigee, i.e. at the closest point to earth. So the lag would be even
26 TRVYYZ: The biggest concern they may have is too much firing for correction could consume more of the available power. I'm not sure how relevant this would b
27 Comorin: I'm just curious about how messaging actually works in a deep space context - say a Jupiter mission - - do they have a synchronized clock on board or
28 Comorin: I found a cool site that gives you real-time tracking of most satellites: http://www.n2yo.com/?s=33405 Enjoy!
29 BarfBag: Chandrayaan-I is now in lunar capture orbit. Chandrayaan enters lunar space for final journey India's first moon mission Chandrayaan-I entered the lun
30 HAWK21M: Great achievement.Another week for complete success. regds MEL
31 Comorin: Looks like it's Destination Moon: http://www.hindu.com/2008/11/08/stories/2008110860851500.htm A crucial manoeuvre, to be performed on Saturday, on Ch
32 Comorin: Lunar orbit insertion succesful: http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/000200811081866.htm Hats off to the aerospace engineers behind this defining ach
33 HAWK21M: Another week to go for the landing. regds MEL
34 BarfBag: The orbit insertion was big news in India.There were news items on TV indicating that the operation was to be performed during evening local time, and
35 Comorin: I think it's more like a Very Controlled Flight into Terrain I wonder what 'unauthorized' items ISRO engineers have snuck in the payload? My guess: 1
36 HAWK21M: True. Hopefully this mission is a success.It will be a big boost for future projects. regds MEL
37 BarfBag: Here's an interesting news item on the orbit insertion: http://www.hindu.com/2008/11/10/stories/2008111058230100.htm The target was a 7500x500km inse
38 Comorin: This also hugely enhances Brand India's reputation in delivering reliability, quality and precision. Best $75M spent.
39 HAWK21M: Was wondering how much magnification can be achieved from the cameras on board. regds MEL
40 Comorin: Chandrayaan-1 successfully enters final lunar orbit: Excerpt from today's ( 11/12/08) Times of India: BANGALORE: Chandrayaan-1 spacecraft reached its
41 HAWK21M: Is that part of the plan....what about the surface of the moon. regds MEL
42 Comorin: Yes. It's mission is to map the Moon's surface. It has a payload that will be launched to crash-land on the Moon which will have an Indian flag paint
43 Osiris30: Not to nitpick (ok.. to nitpick).. uhhh.. 1) US 2) Russia 3) Japan 4) China 5) ESA Four?!?! Anyway.. congrats to India on their accomplishment. But I
44 BarfBag: A few hours back, the Chandrayaan orbiter successfully landed its Moon Impactor Probe, which carried instrumentation and an Indian flag. The ISRO has
45 BarfBag: The NDTV newscast said that the MIP has started transmitting data back to the Chandrayaan-1 orbiter. Apparently the MIP landing site is close to where
46 HAWK21M: Any Idea when the pictures will be released for public view? regds MEL.
47 BarfBag: Mel: ISRO has released two video capture images from the MIP as it was making its descent from the Chandrayaan to the surface of the moon. See their w
48 HAWK21M: Thanks....Is the camera not coloured? regds MEL.
49 BarfBag: Mel, there's nothing much coloured to photograph on the surface of the moon. Further, greyscale provides greater image resolution. The Chandrayaan TM
50 Osiris30: Sounds like the two of them should have gotten together and saved themselves a combined ton of cash to use elsewhere... This is exactly what I was re
51 HAWK21M: True....But if an option was available to choose colour/B&W image it would have helped. regds MEL
52 BarfBag: Here's a new video from the Chandrayaan Terrain Mapping Camera that was just released by ISRO: http://isro.org/pslv-c11/videos/tmc.htm On a related no
53 HAWK21M: After this launch by India....There is a renewed interest in the moon through school kids. regds MEL
54 Thorny: "Okay, Houston. The moon is essentially gray, no color; looks like plaster of Paris or sort of a grayish beach sand. We can see quite a bit of detail
55 Osiris30: What I'm talking about is that repair mission very nearly didn't happen. At the time the repair mission was nearly canceled the given reason was budg
56 Thorny: Can you provide a cite for this? That is not why the mission was cancelled, and was never given as a reason the mission was cancelled. The Hubble Rep
57 Thorny: The problem is that not all Lunar missions are created equal. Europe's SMART-1 was a secondary payload on an Ariane V and was primarily a propulsion
58 Osiris30: http://www.newscientist.com/article/...ubble-condemned-to-slow-death.html To be fair it was a combination decision and not a 'raw' budget decision I
59 Areopagus: Real time firing commands from the ground would be way to iffy. If communication is momentarily lost, if only due to noise, the mission is lost. Cass
60 HAWK21M: Whats the status of chandrayan currently? regds MEL...
61 PP705: Return to India? The question is not whether those who left India want to return but whether India needs them? I think this nation has enough talente
62 Prebennorholm: That's the way NASA always assure their funding. They have always used that system. They announce that they cancel the most popular programs. Next th
63 HAWK21M: The main reason of those returning was that they missed the land & wanted to do something here. regds MEL
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