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A Monster Awakened Today...  
User currently offlineMirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7444 posts, RR: 62
Posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 1161 times:
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That was said to be one of the lines uttered from a Japanese commander just after the US was attacked in Pearl Harbor.

In another report today:
-"Thousands of Palestinians are celebrating the terror attacks on the US. They have been chanting God is Great and distributing sweets to passers-by, even as their leader, Yasser Arafat, said he was horrified.

He said: "We completely condemn this very dangerous attack, and I convey my condolences to the American people, to the American president and to the American
administration, not only in my name but on behalf of the Palestinian people. "

"America is the head of the snake, America always stands by Israel in its war against us." - quote from a woman-passerby.

-How naive of these cowards to do this! Don't you know that when you taunt a snake, it'll come back at you?"

AS WE MOURN AS A NATION, REMEMBER. WE'VE BEEN SPEARED BEFORE. WE WILL RISE AGAIN.

Keep the States in your prayers.


Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineScotty From UK - Scotland, joined Dec 1999, 1875 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1056 times:

Well now the US knows what it is like to live with terrorism so welcome to the club. Today you have witnessed the ultimate pinnacle of a web of destruction which stretches from East Timor to Dagestan to Omagh to Oklahoma and all the way back.

Now you have to decide. Are you going to join all of the other civilised nations of the world and fight back, or are you going to go your own way and hit out at what will probably turn out to be the wrong target, like your last pathetic attempt to "take out" Mr Bin Laden was. Now will you stop chastising the Russians for their actions in the Caucasus and now will you stop supporting factions in Ulster who think being brave involves blowing up shoppers in a neighbourly town centre or spitting at wee girls who are walking to school?

If anything good comes of today, it may well be to shake the US out of its isolationism and remind it that it has a DUTY to work to the tried and tested principal that an attack on one is an attack on all, no matter if it is from beyond our boundaries or from within.

My good wishes to all US citizens and friends who reside there

Scotty

Alba gu brath


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21495 posts, RR: 53
Reply 2, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1042 times:

Mirrodie: How naive of these cowards to do this! Don't you know that when you taunt a snake, it'll come back at you?

I´m very sure that´s exactly what the attackers wanted: To make the islamic countries unite behind their leadership against the expected retaliation of the USA.

If it´s really Usama Bin Laden behind all this, there is another point: The USA (under Reagan) actively supported and supplied the Taliban fanatics against the Soviets, then abandoned Afghanistan when the Russians had indeed been driven out. Since then, the Taliban have become more and more extreme; And they obviously offer a safe harbour for terrorists.

Today sees the end of a great many things. It should be the end of the old-style foreign policy thru CIA...


We´re all terribly sad and angry. But we should all unite at this time; The most important thing right now is not to do what the terrorists are expecting!


User currently offlineChris28_17 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1439 posts, RR: 10
Reply 3, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1034 times:

i hope i get drafted so i can go drop some bombs on these people...


C.


User currently offlineMirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7444 posts, RR: 62
Reply 4, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1031 times:
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Scotty, bless you too for your seemingly "told you so" philosophy. Peerhaps if your mother, daughter or wife were dining in the WTC observatory, you might feel different instead of offering snide remarks.

For now, we will tend to our wounded, rebuild, regroup and revel.

But let is be said, and I hate to admit it, but they did exactly what they planned. One jet liner into WTC.
THEN, with the WORLD watching, they sent a second plane in, porbablyu as a message to the world. Finally, a downed plane at the doorstep of the Pentagon (now a friggin Trapezoid from what I understand) and the plane in PA(specualtions as to where she was going).



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlineHeavymetal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 1000 times:

You hearty academics seem to forget something, as does practically everyone from Haifa over to the Khyber Pass.

Today something happened that has never happened before. Thousands of Americans died on American soil through a direct attack on the American continent.

Sorry, think-tankers, but all rules are off. The same feeling of dread that filled Admiral Yamamoto as he sailed back to Japan after his brilliantly successful attack on Pearl Harbor should be settling into the stomachs of Imams and Muftis across Persia and Arabia.
And yes, it should be settling into the stomachs of Israeli hard-liners who have this notion that they live in the unofficial 51st state of the union.

You've all acted towards us as a contemptuous older sibling who won't break up a fight between two children over marbles. You cry and moan when we become involved in your affairs, telling us to butt out...then when the fight gets nasty and bloody, you whine that we're being 'isolationist'.

We'll we're in it now, kids. And not in a way either of you expected.

We are out for raw, merciless payback. So make your vacation plans now. The sands of the Middle East may be in for a very unpleasant winter.


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21495 posts, RR: 53
Reply 6, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 980 times:

Heavymetal: You hearty academics seem to forget something, as does practically everyone from Haifa over to the Khyber Pass.

If the world - and the victims of this crime - need something, it´s certainly not even more fanatics frothing at the mouth and calling for vengeance!

Yes, there will have to be consequences. But just lashing out against an entire region of the world is as idiotic as those terrorists´ actions were.

The victims deserve better than being made an excuse for even more death and destruction.

This is extremely sad.


User currently offlineHeavymetal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 971 times:

I see. Everyone can lash out at THIS region of the world, but we cannot. That really has been typical thought , hasn't it?

News flash Klaus. This is not some treaty you guys don't like. This isn't a US airbase sitting out where no one really wants it...

20,000 Americans died today. Not soldiers. Not sailors. Moms and Dads died. Innocents died. What should we do, sit around and discuss it in comittee?

With all due respect, If I were you I'd enjoy the beauty of a German autumn, get ready for Oktoberfest...

And stay the hell out of our way. Personally I think we should DEMAND that Afghanistan turn over Bin Laden by 9 am zulu on Friday. And if they don't, the missiles should be in the air by 9:01.


User currently offlineLearpilot From United States of America, joined May 2001, 814 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 966 times:

Or the Enola Gay brought out of retirement for one last flight! (With heavy fighter escorts, of course.)


Heed our warnings or your future will be underpant free!
User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21495 posts, RR: 53
Reply 9, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 964 times:

Heavymetal: I see. Everyone can lash out at THIS region of the world, but we cannot. That really has been typical thought , hasn't it?

What gives you that idea??
I have not, I will not and I would not ever justify or excuse this terrorist attack. And I take offense that you´re insinuating that I did.


Heavymetal: News flash Klaus. This is not some treaty you guys don't like. This isn't a US airbase sitting out where no one really wants it...

Please, wake up!!! You´re rambling in blind rage!
I´m as sad and angry as anyone else in the world right now. But there is one thing I know for sure: Stirring up a lynch mob to kill the first scapegoat that you come across is not only wrong, it´s also stupid and it´s exactly what the terrorists expect!


Heavymetal: With all due respect, If I were you I'd enjoy the beauty of a German autumn, get ready for Oktoberfest...

You obviously don´t have a clue about anything. Our country has suffered badly from terrorism during the seventies; And in our experience, brutal retaliation is completely useless against it. (Besides, just for your information: The Oktoberfest is a strictly local bavarian custom which we don´t have here.)

Heavymetal: And stay the hell out of our way. Personally I think we should DEMAND that Afghanistan turn over Bin Laden by 9 am zulu on Friday. And if they don't, the missiles should be in the air by 9:01.

If the evidence justifies it, I´m all for putting severe pressure on the Taliban (the US record with them is all but unblemished). But I´m against just killing Bin Laden or whoever is behind this. That would be wrong - and it would be too easy.

People like him must be held accountable - and the only civilized way to do that is trial and imprisonment. All our personal feelings for revenge can´t help the victims any more.

Violent revenge as the only response is one of the very few things those terrorists know and understand. And it would only make them stronger.


User currently offlineLHMark From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 7255 posts, RR: 46
Reply 10, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 964 times:

No. For those proven responsible: A quick, brutal, undignified death. No chance to prance in front of the TV cameras. Just a sudden, crushing end. Never again.


"Sympathy is something that shouldn't be bestowed on the Yankees. Apparently it angers them." - Bob Feller
User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21495 posts, RR: 53
Reply 11, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 960 times:

LHMark: No. For those proven responsible: A quick, brutal, undignified death. No chance to prance in front of the TV cameras. Just a sudden, crushing end. Never again.

I understand you well. But that would accomplish absolutely nothing. It would happen again. And again. And again...

There is no solution without a different policy. Neither is there one with just a different policy, though.

We´re all united against the terrorists. That is important.


User currently offlineHeavymetal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 950 times:

Thank you for your enlightened, rational ,intellectual response, Klaus. I don't blame you for thinking this through. It's what we in the States call an "ivory-tower" approach.

Unfortunately someone flew two Boeing 767s into our ivory towers today. So, I'm sorry to say, the rational approach is being tucked away for a later day.

You don't seem like a fool, and any fool can tell what happened today was not the act of stone-throwing Arab teenagers. Someone in those cockpits knew how to fly large multiengined jetliners. Someone knew how to turn transponders off. Someone knew how to navigate.

And someone TAUGHT those someones.

If a nation or nations in any way shape or form was involved in the process leading up to the deaths of thousands of Americans...even just by providing a free apartment to the perpetrators...than that nation was involved in a direct attack on the United States. That nation committed an act of war.

Forgive me for bringing up a touchy subject, but you live in a country that must understand the consequences of undertaking an act of war.

And the United States has a history of taking its' wars very seriously.


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21495 posts, RR: 53
Reply 13, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 942 times:

Heavymetal: Thank you for your enlightened, rational ,intellectual response, Klaus. I don't blame you for thinking this through. It's what we in the States call an "ivory-tower" approach.

Same expression here; But by necessity, even the american government will have to apply reason. There is much too much at stake, here.


Heavymetal: Unfortunately someone flew two Boeing 767s into our ivory towers today. So, I'm sorry to say, the rational approach is being tucked away for a later day.

I can´t blame any citizen of the USA or of any other civilized nation for that kind of reaction (there is not all that much difference in how we´re affected). In all this pandemonium of hate and madness I just felt obliged to at least keep my own emotions in check here. Written words don´t go away as quickly as spoken ones. They keep on building...


Heavymetal: You don't seem like a fool,[...]

And I´m certainly not as cold as you might have guessed.


Heavymetal: If a nation or nations in any way shape or form was involved in the process leading up to the deaths of thousands of Americans...even just by providing a free apartment to the perpetrators...than that nation was involved in a direct attack on the United States. That nation committed an act of war.

Yes. That is unmistakable. But who did it??

Heavymetal: Forgive me for bringing up a touchy subject, but you live in a country that must understand the consequences of undertaking an act of war. And the United States has a history of taking its' wars very seriously.

So do we. And we know very well what blind rage can do to everyone - not least to those who let themselves be overwhelmed by it. I´ve got a suspicion that your original cause starts to fade to insignificance once you´ve started to kill, maim and destroy...  Sad


I have no doubt that the political pressure for revenge on the US government is overwhelming. But I hope that revenge will not stay the only consequence. There must be clear minds in charge, right now and in the coming months. As much as it may hurt to stay calm.

Terrorists feed on frustration, distrust and hate. But they can´t be scared.


User currently offlineFly-By-Pilot From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 209 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 944 times:

Did you guys see that Afgany leader sweating like a pig in one interview. If I was him I would be sweating to.

User currently offlineScotty From UK - Scotland, joined Dec 1999, 1875 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (13 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 927 times:

Hey Mirrodie

You say

"Scotty, bless you too for your seemingly "told you so" philosophy. Peerhaps if your mother, daughter or wife were dining in the WTC observatory, you might feel different instead of offering snide remarks"

Well, would a friend buried under a flaming PanAm 747 on a Scottish highway thanks to airport/CIA/airline blundering make you feel any better? The point is that here, we have ALREADY felt terrorism and everyone should be joining together to fight it, not doing their own thing.

Read the post before you get blood in your brain next time.


User currently offlineWN700Driver From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 917 times:

"Please, wake up!!! You´re rambling in blind rage!
I´m as sad and angry as anyone else in the world right now. But there is one thing I know for sure: Stirring up a lynch mob to kill the first scapegoat that you come across is not only wrong, it´s also stupid and it´s exactly what the terrorists expect! "


Lets revisit this for a second. Perhaps going to WWIII over the issue isn't such a bad idea. It's not really a matter of hate, but what if by wiping out a nation (a cutting off ANY nation that incited this sort of hatred to the USA in the first place), that takes OUR mesage to the world stage? Like, "Blow down skyscraper = enitire nation, to the last man, wiped the f*ck out. I'm not saying we should investigate and make sure we get the right guy, but when we do, no forgiveness, no mercy, and most of all, no warning. The same should apply to any nation (yes by that I mean the entire population of which), that harbors this sort of evil.
we do this a few times, and odds are, the era of terrorism is over. Few, if any, nations can repell or even resist the firepower uniquely avaible in the USA. I say let it get put to good use.


User currently offlineMirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7444 posts, RR: 62
Reply 17, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 897 times:
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"Scotty, bless you too for your seemingly "told you so" philosophy."

"we have ALREADY felt terrorism"

Two points showing your arrogance:

1) Blood to the brain= life. Without it you die.
2) So we've felt terrorism? Welcome to the club??? Thanks. Thanks for the enlightenment.

We are all losing here. But the tone of your post is less than self-satisfactory. Perhaps the lack of blood to yours is the problem.

Now, maybe we can band together and resolve the problem.



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlineScotty From UK - Scotland, joined Dec 1999, 1875 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 891 times:

I never had any other intention.

You said

AS WE MOURN AS A NATION, REMEMBER. WE'VE BEEN SPEARED BEFORE. WE WILL RISE AGAIN.

We know you will. You always do. And that is what we want. All I'm saying is that it will be so much better if we are many nations not one. People in Europe have already felt the full force of terrorism, not in the horrendous way that the US did yesterday but thugs are thugs and there is no difference between the sick bastard that blows up the WTC with a 767 and the sick bastard that throws bricks at wee girls walking up a Belfast road to their first day at school.

Keep the States in your prayers.

We always do. Especially now. And btw, I just found out that a friend of 16 years old is missing in NYC since yesterday. Its everyones problem

PAX

Scotty


User currently offlineJetService From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 4798 posts, RR: 11
Reply 19, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 881 times:

Klaus, please stop telling us to not be outraged. It's not helping.


"Shaddap you!"
User currently offlineSkyhawk From United States of America, joined May 2001, 1066 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 876 times:

Two things-first Admiral Yamamoto said that he was afraid that they(Japenese) had awakened a sleeping giant not monster.

Second- I would think that we can agree on at least one point here, that being the persons ultimately responsible for this hideous act should be brought to justice. Right? I like many other Americans at first wanted simply go out blasting the ones that I was so sure had done this and anybody related to them by blood or by nationality. But of course that isn't right. We will pull together as a nation and those responsible will be prosecuted. That may take time, it may take a long time(just as it took a long time to try those responsible for PA103), but in the end it will happen...
What we need to be grateful for is for the worldwide support of virutally every other country. They have come to our defense in condemning this act and those who committed it. God bless America!


User currently offlineRedngold From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 6907 posts, RR: 44
Reply 21, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 864 times:

If we have to do any dirty deed (aka killing someone) let's do it right. Don't go in there and do a half-a**ed job like in the Persian Gulf war.

Note: I am normally a pacifist and reconcilliationist, but this makes me downright sick.

redngold



Up, up and away!
User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21495 posts, RR: 53
Reply 22, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 859 times:

JetService: Klaus, please stop telling us to not be outraged. It's not helping.

I am very much with you in your outrage.

The only thing I say is that mass murders and genocide would make yourself not better than those sick bastards.

There is no excuse for that!
Decisive action is required. But no crime will make another crime undone.  Sad


User currently offlineRayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 8025 posts, RR: 5
Reply 23, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 856 times:

I think right now Israel may be planning a response to the attacks that is very likely orchestrated by one Osama bin Laden.

Remember, it's an open secret that the Israelis have nuclear weapons, and also have the means to reach a long way from Israel with the Jericho II missile.

Can you say downtown Kabul reduced to radioactive molten glass by Israeli missile within a month?


User currently offlineYAZOO From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 487 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 840 times:

man, shut up, if israel nukes the region, it will nuuke itself too... how can they nuke palestine if palestine is just miles from israel?
that would be pretty fuckin stupid



Purple Pride!
User currently offlineMirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7444 posts, RR: 62
Reply 25, posted (13 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 827 times:
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Yazoo, thanks! I needed a laugh.

Scotty- Understood. PAX.



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