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Schooling In The Rest Of The World  
User currently offlineAirKas1 From Netherlands, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 4028 posts, RR: 55
Posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2599 times:

This is about people who are around 18 years of age and are already looking for full-time jobs or already have them. I'm not bashing those people in any way, I just find it weird.
In Holland we go to school until we are atleast 22 or something.

So how come that teenagers in the UK are already working full-time at 18 years of age?

[Edited 2006-01-13 00:07:36]

22 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2585 times:

Hmmmmmmmm...maybe it's because they have a system-you don't work, you don't eat?

User currently offlineYooYoo From Canada, joined Nov 2003, 6057 posts, RR: 50
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2585 times:

Kas, you should see it over here. It's very common.

I dropped out of school and was working full time, making good money. But, my job was not what i wanted. It took me a few years, and a kick from my dad, but i went back to school.

Now good job, not bad money.

most importantly, happy, happier than if i had stayed at my old job which was a labourer doing everything from cleaning crap houses to sweeping floors. It just wasn't for me.



I am so smart, i am so smart... S-M-R-T... i mean S-M-A-R-T
User currently offlineNoelg From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2582 times:

Quoting AirKas1 (Thread starter):
So how come that teenagers in the UK are already working full-time at 18 years of age?

Over here, compulsory education finishes at 16. You can then choose to go to college which takes you to 18, and then to uni after that if you want to.

A lot of people leave school at 16 to take low-paid jobs, others like me opt for the middle route and leave at 18. I was in a well paid job at age 18.

Lots of people these days go to uni but many still start work earlier and opt to earn the money instead!

Cheers
Noel


User currently offlineBrokenrecord From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 772 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2578 times:

I'm in the US, and I left college and was working full-time as an IT professional at 19, so it's not just the UK. Basically, I look at myself as having a 3 year headstart on the people I was in college with. Most employers, especially in IT, are less concerned with degrees than they are with related experience these days.

User currently offlineBristolFlyer From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 2312 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2575 times:

Schooling finishes at 18 in the UK. University starts after that if you want to go or you can start work without going to Uni if you can't afford it/don't want to go.

Nothing that 'weird' as far as I can see.

BF



Fortune favours the brave
User currently offlineSunshine79 From UK - England, joined Jan 2006, 1760 posts, RR: 30
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2570 times:

I know people who are 25 and still studying at university, so it's not like everyone leaves studies at 18. I finished school at 16, then went to do an apprentice scheme in a travel agent, they sent me to college to earn my qualifications to become a travel agent.


Formerly alcregular, Why drive when you can fly?
User currently offlineSabena332 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2561 times:

Quoting AirKas1 (Thread starter):
So how come that teenagers in the UK are already working full-time at 18 years of age?

It is actually pretty common in Germany, too.

You have to finish 10 school years, you are usually 16 when you finished them. Then you have the choice (or not, it depends on your grades):

- Either you go to school for further 3 years to make you "Abitur" (high-school diploma) to go to university later, or

- you go to another school to make your "Fachabitur" (high-school diploma with a main focus on one topic, for example economics), or

- you make your "Ausbildung" (apprenticeship) in a job which means that you are working full time on three or four days in a week while you go to school on the other one or two days.

In my case:

I went to economics school for two years after my regular 10 years school, then I made an apprenticeship as a "Bürokaufmann" ("office clerk" at a big Finnish mobile phone company (guess who?  Wink), then I had to do my one year lasting civil service, and after that I went to university before I got my first real job.

Patrick


User currently offlineAirKas1 From Netherlands, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 4028 posts, RR: 55
Reply 8, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2549 times:

Quoting Dougloid (Reply 1):
Hmmmmmmmm...maybe it's because they have a system-you don't work, you don't eat?

Well, I know. But most of us here have a part-time job, besides school. Also, we get some funds by the government, and also some additional money if we live on our selfs. I don't know how that's arranged in the rest of the world?

Quoting BristolFlyer (Reply 5):
Nothing that 'weird' as far as I can see.

Sorry, my title is not the best one around. I don't mean to upset people.

I don't have any disrespect for people leaving school that early, let me just make that clear. It just made me think.

Edit: Changed title

[Edited 2006-01-13 00:08:25]

User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 9, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2548 times:

In the US, you have to stay in school until you are around 16ish, but most people finish high school (if you don't, you won't go far, since the most basic jobs require at least a high school diploma). After that, you either go to college for the next two or four years, or get a job.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2532 times:

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 9):
In the US, you have to stay in school until you are around 16ish, but most people finish high school (if you don't, you won't go far, since the most basic jobs require at least a high school diploma). After that, you either go to college for the next two or four years, or get a job.

Harry

And a lot of the fellows and gals go to work poundin' the boonies for their Uncle, too.


User currently offlineAirKas1 From Netherlands, joined exactly 11 years ago today! , 4028 posts, RR: 55
Reply 11, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2532 times:

Here in holland, when you're 16, you're still in high school. For atleast 2 more years. There's probably a difference in that then.
And I think most people opt to go to university or MBO/HBO (those are basically college)

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 9):
In the US, you have to stay in school until you are around 16ish, but most people finish high school (if you don't, you won't go far, since the most basic jobs require at least a high school diploma). After that, you either go to college for the next two or four years, or get a job.

Basically the same then I think.

[Edited 2006-01-13 00:13:08]

User currently offlineSabena332 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2525 times:

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 9):
or get a job.

By the way, I was always wondering about that in the USA (and any other country).

Here in Germany you actually "must" do an apprenticeship in the job you want to work in later. That means that you are working full time on a few days in a week, combined with school on the other days of the week, after three or two years (it depends on the job you are learning) you have to do a written and a practical exam. When you passed this, you are not any longer an "Azubi" (apprentice) but a regular employee and you do - of course - earn much more money than during your apprenticeship.

It is actually very, very rare there in Germany that someone starts directly to work without doing an apprenticeship. And of course do you earn not much money when you do so, you have no big chances to get a higher position, and you have big problems to find a job at another employer in case you get fired.

Patrick


User currently offlineSchoenorama From Spain, joined Apr 2001, 2440 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2505 times:

Quoting AirKas1 (Reply 11):
And I think most people opt to go to university or MBO/HBO (those are basically college)

Only those who qualify and/or want to go to university actually continue their education. There's also loads of other young Dutch people who prefer NOT to go to university and get a job directly. And of course there's also those who simply cannot afford going to university (at, lets say, Nyenrode  Wink).

Your remark in the thread-opener that Dutch people go to school until at least their 22nd birthday is an extreme generalization.



Utinam logica falsa tuam philosophiam totam suffodiant!
User currently offlineJafa39 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2504 times:

If you count my time as a "mature student" I didn't finish my education until I was 41!!!

User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 15, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2498 times:

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 12):
Here in Germany you actually "must" do an apprenticeship in the job you want to work in later. That means that you are working full time on a few days in a week, combined with school on the other days of the week, after three or two years (it depends on the job you are learning) you have to do a written and a practical exam. When you passed this, you are not any longer an "Azubi" (apprentice) but a regular employee and you do - of course - earn much more money than during your apprenticeship.

We have internships and co-ops while in college, where you go to a real job for a semester of over the summer. These are not required, but certainly help your job prospects after college. You may even be hired by the same firm if you foster a good relationship with them. But we don't have the formal apprenticeship here that you describe.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineTheSonntag From Germany, joined Jun 2005, 3763 posts, RR: 29
Reply 16, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2479 times:

Two different kind of approaches, very visible for me when I was studying in Denmark last year as an Erasmus student.

In Germany, we usually are finished with University when we are 27. We are great in terms of theory and have become very mature when we seek a job, however we know nothing about practical things.

The few people from the UK I met in Denmark did it exactly the other way around... They finish school early, are great in practical work, but they certainly also lacked a lot of theoretical background.

That were my experiences in the field of law. Both systems certainly have advantages and disadvantages, but I personally would never trade our system. Being able to study some years and discover yourself, strenghts and weaknesses, is an invaluable tool which also serves you in your job later. There is plenty of time to work afterwards.

I will be finished when I am 26 or 27. Some of the Erasmus girls from England are already working now. Will they be better than me when I am 26? I doubt it, but time will tell. Yet I think, good education takes time.


User currently offlineUSAFHummer From United States of America, joined May 2000, 10685 posts, RR: 52
Reply 17, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2464 times:

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 15):
We have internships and co-ops while in college, where you go to a real job for a semester of over the summer.

Along those same lines, in my high school and other high schools in my area, during your junior and senior years (last two years of HS), students were able to attend a vocational technical school ("vo-tech") in the area for roughly half the school day, and the other half of the day students would return to their high schools for normal classes...this way some students (I didnt do it), got some education in a specific field of work, while still able to get a high school diploma in the process...not sure how common nationwide the vo-tech option in HS is though...

Greg



Chief A.net college football stadium self-pic guru
User currently offlineKiwiinOz From New Zealand, joined Oct 2005, 2165 posts, RR: 5
Reply 18, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 2446 times:

In New Zealand, we are generally considered to be smarter than the rest of the world so finish school a little earlier.

User currently offlineIndianFlyboy From India, joined Sep 2003, 294 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2422 times:

India is pretty straight forward and we follow the 10+2+3 scheme. 10+2 , is the high school level , 12 years of formal education, 3 years of undergraduate if you are doing a BS , BA or a BCOM or 4 years of undergrad if you are doing a BE /BTECH. Post 10+2+3 or 10+2+4 you have a 2 year masters degree. so effectively you complete your academics when you are about 22. Most of the masters degree courses (atleast the tech one's ) have some kind of internship /project in the last semester.

Regards


User currently offlineAirdolomiti From Germany, joined May 2003, 694 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2417 times:

In Italy, compulsory education finishes at age 16, although I believe it is being brought up to 18 this year as the reform of the schooling system is completed.
I don't know of many 18-year-olds in Italy working full-time. Besides, most people are around 19 when they do their high school finals.

After school, a good number of people go on to university, which follows a 3+2 scheme for most degrees after a recent reform of the system - I believe it works like this (not sure anyone *really* knows how it works  Silly ) :

-a 1st cycle university degree, (called "laurea di 1^ livello" or "laurea breve"), with both theoretical and applied studies. I think it is more or less the equivalent of a Bachelor's degree.
-and a 2nd, 2-year cycle, which is our version of a Master's degree.

After that, one can choose from a number of options, such as:

- a Dottorato di Ricerca (research doctorate, min. 3 years)
- a Diploma di Specializzazione di 2^ Livello (2nd level specialisation degree, 2 to 6 years depending on the subject, and more professionally-oriented)
- a 1st or 2nd-level Master Universitario (min. 1 year), depending on whether you already hold a Bachelor's or a Master's

This webpage explains the system quite well.

In Italy we seem to put great importance on theory rather than practice; studies can therefore take quite a bit of time when compared to other countries: I myself have only just started university a few months ago at 19, if all goes well I hope to hold my Laurea Specialistica by age 25 or so. Plus I guess I will have a go at a Master's, so make that 27, like in Germany.

Federico


User currently offlinePilot kaz From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2414 times:

It depends what sort of person you are and your learning ability to determine if you choose to stay on after hitting 16..

People have different learning abilities, If you feel you can carry on with education and have had no problem in the past its likely they will carry on until uni (to age 19-21?) But if you struggle and don't feel you can hack anymore or are having problems at the level you are at usually you drop out at 16-18...


User currently offlineZKSUJ From New Zealand, joined May 2004, 7110 posts, RR: 12
Reply 22, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2396 times:

I know people with fulkl time jobs that are only 16. But then I also know a few in their late 20s and are still full time students.

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