Norwegian Leopard 2 Falls Into Frozen Bog — Non Aviation Forum

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Norwegian Leopard 2 Falls Into Frozen Bog

N328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6226 posts, RR: 3
Posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2228 times:

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article1251506.ece

When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt

15 replies: All unread, jump to last

ANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2204 times:

Sad news for these soldiers . . . .

I have to ask though - what was a tank doing out on a frozen bog (shallow lake?) - especially one deep enough to submerge the entire tank???

We have tanks in the US Army - we just don't drive them out on to the ice . . . something about 70 tons not being compatible with the strength of the ice. We don't use tanks in Alaska either - they have a tendency to sink up here . . .

My sympathies to their families . . . . tombstone

N328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6226 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2198 times:

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 1):
I have to ask though - what was a tank doing out on a frozen bog (shallow lake?) - especially one deep enough to submerge the entire tank???

My understanding was that such tactics are actually SOP on the Korean peninsula during wintertime. The rice paddies freeze over during that time.

When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt

ANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2196 times:

Quoting N328KF (Reply 2):
The rice paddies freeze over during that time.

That may be the case, but I've never seen an 8 foot deep rice paddy . . . which is how deep it'd have to be to top the turret of an Abrams . . . when I was stationed in Korea in 1987 we took tanks all over in the winter . . . never saw one sunk in a rice paddy.

L-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29366 posts, RR: 61
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2138 times:

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 3):
That may be the case, but I've never seen an 8 foot deep rice paddy

Long Grain rice?

We just had a similar accident up here, a guy was moving an escavator accross a frozen lagoon up by Kotzubue and it went through, Divers found him a couple of days later.

OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.

Doona From Sweden, joined Feb 2005, 3716 posts, RR: 14
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2135 times:

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 1):
We have tanks in the US Army - we just don't drive them out on to the ice . . .

Well, Norway doesn't really have that much flat ground to drive your tank around on. Every inch that is not bog or fjord is covered by mountains. The Norwegian military will now probably replace their Leopards with something smaller... like a snow mobile! With a gun. silly

Cheers
Mats

Sure, we're concerned for our lives. Just not as concerned as saving 9 bucks on a roundtrip to Ft. Myers.

Pelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2530 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2128 times:

Isn't the Leo 2 able to dive? Okay they had probably no snorkel, but shouldn't the interior stay dry for some time?
What's the opinion of our tank experts?

May the two soldiers rest in peace.

pelican

[Edited 2006-03-18 10:35:11]

MD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13368 posts, RR: 64
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 2108 times:

Quoting Pelican (Reply 6):
Isn't the Leo 2 able to dive? Okay they had probably no snorkel, but shouldn't the interior stay dry for some time?
What's the opinion of our tank experts?

Normally you only drive "buttoned up" if there is a threat from outside (e.g. somebody shooting at you) because vision through the periscopes is very limited.
Normal travel is being done with at least two hatches open (driver's and commander's).

I remember that there was a similar incident some years ago during a cold winter in Denmark, when during an exercise an armoured unit got lost and drove out onto the frozen Baltic sea.

Jan

Thom@s From Norway, joined Oct 2000, 11951 posts, RR: 50
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2101 times:

Sad stuff. Focus here now is that too many have been killed during training missions. Steps should be taken to make it safer...

Thom@s

"If guns don't kill people, people kill people - does that mean toasters don't toast toast, toast toast toast?"

AerospaceFan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2096 times:

Bad news, indeed, and what a tragic turn of events for those soldiers!

Pelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2530 posts, RR: 8
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2086 times:

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 7):
Normal travel is being done with at least two hatches open (driver's and commander's).

That explains alot.

pelican

[Edited 2006-03-18 13:37:27]

ANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2059 times:

Quoting Pelican (Reply 6):
Okay they had probably no snorkel, but shouldn't the interior stay dry for some time?
What's the opinion of our tank experts?

It takes time to prepare the tank for Ford a body of water - it's not simply a matter of buttoning up the hatches and tossing up a snorkel - and certainly not as easy as just driving into the water.

Not to mention this thing went down in ice water - hatches open . . .

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 7):
Normal travel is being done with at least two hatches open (driver's and commander's).

And three on the Abrams: Driver, Commander and Loader.

NoUFO From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 7802 posts, RR: 13
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 2014 times:

Sad story.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 11):
It takes time to prepare the tank for Ford a body of water - it's not simply a matter of buttoning up the hatches and tossing up a snorkel

I thought time to prepare a Leo II for fording a river was comparatively short: Put on a snorkel and off you go. But I never drove that thing, so I really don't know.

Quote: Fording Depths (meter): 1.0 Unprepared, 4.0 with snorkel
(Source: FAS.org)

I support the right to arm bears

KaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12043 posts, RR: 42
Reply 13, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks ago) and read 1969 times:

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The investigation shows that it wasn't just a little "water hole", but rather a significant lake it fell into. It also said the studs on the belts were taken off to prevent damage to the road. This caused the tank to slide sideways onto the ice and sink.

1. The Leopard-2 tank comes driving from the north east on E-10
2. The tank takes off 90 degrees off the road
3. It turns slightly left, and backs into position on a small hill north east of the lake
4. The tank sits on firm ground east of the swamp. The ground breaks and the tank slides sideways into the swamp.

911, where is your emergency?

Alessandro From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (7 years 2 months 4 weeks ago) and read 1967 times:

Sad way to go for the two young males, my sincerest condolences.

Thom@s From Norway, joined Oct 2000, 11951 posts, RR: 50
Reply 15, posted (7 years 2 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1939 times:

It has been confirmed that it was indeed a lake and not a swamp the tank sank into. Also confirmed that the two soldiers cause of death was drowning.

Thom@s

"If guns don't kill people, people kill people - does that mean toasters don't toast toast, toast toast toast?"

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