Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Why Are Hatchbacks So Popular In Europe?  
User currently offlineFanoftristars From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1608 posts, RR: 5
Posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10291 times:

I noticed while traveling in italy that at least 90% of the cars you see are some form of wagon/hatch back, while in the US, its the other way around, 90% of passenger cars are regular sedans, and a lot of hatch backs are considered ugly. It's not like Europeans have more cargo to haul around, if anything, americans probably haul more junk around in their cars, so I just don't understand the popularity.


"FLY DELTA JETS"
32 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJamie757 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10278 times:

Quoting Fanoftristars (Thread starter):
I noticed while traveling in Italy that at least 90% of the cars you see are some form of wagon/hatch back,

That's because generally they tend to be more fuel efficient (they weigh less) and they are more user friendly (you can fit a bulkier load into a hatch minus parcel shelf than a saloon/sedan) and a hatch will handle better and not be as susceptible to any pendulum effect.

Quoting Fanoftristars (Thread starter):
It's not like Europeans have more cargo to haul around, if anything, Americans probably haul more junk around in their cars, so I just don't understand the popularity.

Europeans can fit more in their hatches than Americans can their saloons/sedans.

 Wink

Rgds.


User currently offlineDuff44 From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 1723 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10273 times:

I have a hatch, and I love it (2002 Civic Si)

I can put my buddy's wheelchair in it without having to take it apart



I'll rassle ya for a bowl of bacon!
User currently offlineAsstChiefMark From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10271 times:

Without a hatchback, you have to tie crap to the roof.



User currently offlineDerico From Argentina, joined Dec 1999, 4307 posts, RR: 11
Reply 4, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10262 times:

I always thought it was because of the fuel efficiency-haul ratio that is very favorable in hatchbacks.

Having been in Europe, I have seen the most of them in Italy, then France. A bit less in Spain and England, quite a few less in Germany where I've seen bigger cars than elsewhere in Europe.

In South America hatchbacks are ubiquitous in Brazil, also in México, Colombia, and Chile to a slightly smaller extent. In Venezuela they are becoming popular but there they still have old gaz guzzling chevy boxes from the 70s all over the place. In Argentina sedans are just as popular as hatchbacks, for that reason peoplenotice the cars in Argentina are a bit bigger when they arrive from other countries in Latin America.



My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13120 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10250 times:

If you only have one car and it has to be relatively small yet flexible for day to day needs, then a hatchback becomes a good choice. I have owned hatchback sport coupes since 1982 and found the flexibility of the hatchback vs. trunk (boot) to be a significant advantage. You get more usuable area, for stuff, shopping of bulky goods, so I am sold on them.

User currently offlineBohica From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2705 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 10233 times:

I have a Ford Focus ZX5 hatchback. I like it because it is so versitle. It's good on gas, especially when gas is $3+ a gallon and climbing. It has a cargo area behind the rear seat which can hold groceries or a couple of decent sized suitcases. If I have a large item, I can fold down the rear seat, remove the shelf, and I have lots of room to put something in that won't fit in a coupe or sedan.

Besides the Ford Focus, in the US there are more hatchbacks coming out on the road including the Toyota Matrix, Chrysler PT Cruiser, Chevrolet's Aveo and HHR, and the Dodge Caliber. The hatchback is becoming more popular in the US.


User currently offlineScarletHarlot From Canada, joined Jul 2003, 4673 posts, RR: 56
Reply 7, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 10231 times:

I have a 1996 Acura Integra GS-R which is a hatchback. It is quick and nimble, and holds a TON of stuff. We moved houses twice with the Integra, and I could put a buttload of stuff in the hatch, especially with the seats down. I carted home a six foot tall bookshelf from Ikea in it, and a six foot tall cat tree. Couldn't do that in my Mercedes, which is rather bigger than the Integra.

Hatchbacks are wonderfully practical cars, and as stated above, tend to be quite fuel efficient.



But that was when I ruled the world
User currently offlineAirPacific747 From Denmark, joined May 2008, 2412 posts, RR: 24
Reply 8, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 10223 times:

Quoting Fanoftristars (Thread starter):
I noticed while traveling in italy that at least 90% of the cars you see are some form of wagon/hatch back, while in the US, its the other way around, 90% of passenger cars are regular sedans, and a lot of hatch backs are considered ugly. It's not like Europeans have more cargo to haul around, if anything, americans probably haul more junk around in their cars, so I just don't understand the popularity.

They are more fuel efficient which benefits everyone on this planet!


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7073 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 10210 times:

Quoting Fanoftristars (Thread starter):
It's not like Europeans have more cargo to haul around, if anything, americans probably haul more junk around in their cars, so I just don't understand the popularity.

Americans drive SUVs, Europeans prefer station wagons or hatchbacks to carry their stuff. They are more flexibel than a sedan and more fuel efficient than most SUVs. In a car magazin I have read the other day that the numbers of classic sedans is sinking, about 14% of all new cars are sedans. The only sedans that are bought new are high class cars such as Mercedes, BMWs, Jaguars etc....



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineOli80 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2006, 685 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 10184 times:

I doubt I speak for all European cities, but I also think that road size is an issue. Of all the places I've visited in the US (NYC, Boston, Denver, Miami and their surrounding areas) I've noticed that the roads are very wide.

If you compare this for example with Leiden in the Netherlands (a small version of Amsterdam) you have extremely narrow roads where you have to parallel park alongside a canal, normally with no guard rail, so if you make a mistake, in you go. It is for roads like these, that the Smart car was invented.


User currently offlineBill142 From Australia, joined Aug 2004, 8451 posts, RR: 8
Reply 11, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 10130 times:

because they fit down those tiny european streets in those tiny european towns.

User currently offlineMolykote From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 1340 posts, RR: 29
Reply 12, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 10122 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Fanoftristars (Thread starter):
I noticed while traveling in italy that at least 90% of the cars you see are some form of wagon/hatch back, while in the US, its the other way around, 90% of passenger cars are regular sedans, and a lot of hatch backs are considered ugly. It's not like Europeans have more cargo to haul around, if anything, americans probably haul more junk around in their cars, so I just don't understand the popularity.

Here's what I consider humor....

Wasn't it last week on these forums that Europeans (and I seem to remember Italians being used as a major example) were giving Americans massive quantities of shit about dressing in a way that was too casual/practical without a sense of style.

Wasn't the American response to criticize the Italians for wasting money on needless, expensive, over-the-top clothing?

What looks better?:
(1) Shorts in a BMW
(2) Gucci in a Fiat

I personally would compromise and go with the well dressed Italian girls moving about Rome via scooter.  Smile



Speedtape - The asprin of aviation!
User currently offlineOli80 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2006, 685 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 10116 times:

Quoting Molykote (Reply 12):
What looks better?:
(1) Shorts in a BMW
(2) Gucci in a Fiat

But BMW (1 series), Audi (A2) and Mercedes (A class) make small cars too.  Wink


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7073 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 10100 times:

Quoting Molykote (Reply 12):
I personally would compromise and go with the well dressed Italian girls moving about Rome via scooter.

Me, too !!!!!!!!!!!!



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 10087 times:

Quoting Derico (Reply 4):
I always thought it was because of the fuel efficiency-haul ratio that is very favorable in hatchbacks.

That's basically it. It may not be so pretty, but it is efficient, relatively inexpensive to runa and insure, does everything you need, and can be (in the case of GTIs and other "hot hatches") plenty of fun.


User currently offlineFanoftristars From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1608 posts, RR: 5
Reply 16, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 10087 times:

It's interesting to see the direction that this thread has gone. I wasn't talking about the size of cars. I'm talking about the shape of cars. I don't see the versatility of the hatchback as being the main factor for the huge split. I have only one car, an ocassional need to haul things around, and I drive a sedan. Sure my seats fold down, but seriously, it's not believable to me to think that Europeans would need the versatility of a hatchback that much more than North Americans.

I find the argument that Europeans need hatchbacks for versatility as believable as Americans needing their huge SUVs with 4wd for conquering the jungle. Americans drive SUVs because of the image they think it portrays or because they need the space and wouldn't want to be caught dean in a mini-van. Is there any negative stigma about driving a sedan in Europe? I just find it hard to swallow that everyone is so practical in Europe that even the shape of their autos is all about practicality, when there are so many impractical things about Europe (Fashion was mentioned above as an example.)



"FLY DELTA JETS"
User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 10082 times:

Quoting Fanoftristars (Reply 16):
I have only one car, an ocassional need to haul things around, and I drive a sedan. Sure my seats fold down, but seriously, it's not believable to me to think that Europeans would need the versatility of a hatchback that much more than North Americans.

But when you want to move something bigger, you find a friend with a pickup or SUV, right? In Europe that is generally not an option. A hatchback will seat 5 people AND will fit a piece of furniture from IKEA. A small sedan won't.

Remember that space is at a premium in Europe. Most families do not have more than one car, so it has to be versitile. A large car like an American SUV (and most american cars, for that matter) will simply not fit in the parking spaces. If you don't live in your own house, finding parking outside your apartment or office is a big pain, and you need a small car to be able to fit it somewhere close to where you want to go.


User currently offlineCPDC10-30 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2000, 4785 posts, RR: 23
Reply 18, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 10036 times:

I find the argument that Europeans need hatchbacks for versatility as believable as Americans needing their huge SUVs with 4wd for conquering the jungle

As someone who has lived in North America and Europe, I think the reasons are pretty obvious and have mostly been brought up already. It really is a matter of practicality and flexibility. I can fit furniture in a Nissan Micra hatchback that I wouldn't be able to fit in my Nissan Maxima (about 1.5 times larger). And there is no way the Maxima would be able to escape scrape and dent-free in most of the parking spaces here. You would not believe how small some of the parking spots are - and in some older residential areas there is not even proper street parking, cars have to park halfway on the sidewalks.

Many North Americans (excluding Quebecers it seems) have an image of hatchbacks as being "wimpy", "underpowered econoboxes". That perception was reinforced as that reflected most of the hatchbacks on the market in North America in the past - a car that your little sister might drive but definetley not for a self-respecting man  Smile But recently that has started to change, with more upscale imported hatches such as the Mercedes B Class and Audi A3 making their way on to the market.


User currently offlineViper911 From Russia, joined Oct 2005, 264 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 10028 times:

In Israel it obvious:

1. Fuel Efficiency, when fuel cost 1.2$ for 1/4Gal. (1 Litre) many Israelis have Hatchbacks. their small engines save money.but we still have many SUV, 4Door saloons and other little sport cars here... its all depend of each other earnings.

2.space. it's impossible to find free parking space in Tel-Aviv at 13:00, but if you'll find, you must pay for the place, yes you must pay on 80% of the streets of the Israelis major cities (even the people who lives on those streets, they buy and annually parking ticket).

[Edited 2006-04-25 19:35:20]

User currently offlineBlrsea From India, joined May 2005, 1423 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 10019 times:

Quoting Jamie757 (Reply 1):
(you can fit a bulkier load into a hatch minus parcel shelf than a saloon/sedan)

How can you fit a bulkier item in a hatch back that won't go into sedan? Doesnt the hatch back have very little space behind the rear seat to keep stuff?


User currently offlineFanoftristars From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1608 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 9997 times:

Quoting Viper911 (Reply 19):
1. Fuel Efficiency

So you're saying that a hatchback is more fuel efficient than a sedan that is the same size? I know the Mazda6 hatchback weighs more than the Mazda6 sedan here in the US, and there is a slight fuel economy difference between the two, since the hatchback's engine has to pull more weight around. I don't buy it. The Honda Civic hatchback is no more fuel efficent than the Honda Civic Sedan using the same engine/trim levels.

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 17):
But when you want to move something bigger, you find a friend with a pickup or SUV, right? In Europe that is generally not an option. A hatchback will seat 5 people AND will fit a piece of furniture from IKEA. A small sedan won't.

Ok, so if I can borrow a vehicle that is more efficient for moving furniture from Ikea, then why can't europeans borrow their uncles hatchback? Why is borrowing so much easier in the US but unavailable in Europe? Why does everone need this versatility in Europe, but in North America we have to resort to borrowing a friend/neighbor's SUV? I'm not convinced that it's a utility issue. I think it has more to do with what's considered fashionable by North American buyers vs European buyers.



"FLY DELTA JETS"
User currently offlineRabenschlag From Germany, joined Oct 2000, 1007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 9974 times:

Quoting Fanoftristars (Reply 16):
I find the argument that Europeans need hatchbacks for versatility as believable as Americans needing their huge SUVs with 4wd for conquering the jungle. Americans drive SUVs because of the image they think it portrays or because they need the space and wouldn't want to be caught dean in a mini-van. Is there any negative stigma about driving a sedan in Europe? I just find it hard to swallow that everyone is so practical in Europe that even the shape of their autos is all about practicality, when there are so many impractical things about Europe (Fashion was mentioned above as an example.)

That is so interesting. My hunch is that in Europe, sedans have an image of being very conservative, somehow old people's cars like Buicks or so. For instance, in Germany I consider the Jetta as a Granpa's car, not so the Golf. If we move to the more expensive side of things, a sedan has the potential to look pimpy or pretentious, whereas wagons have the potential for admirable understatement.

Maybe this has to do with the specific subculture you are living in, but my social environment in Germany responds more favorably to wagons than sedans in terms of image. When I moved to the US I bought a wagon and people responded as if I was driving a Jetta in Germany  Wink

R.


User currently offlineVc10 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2001, 1411 posts, RR: 16
Reply 23, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 9964 times:

Until recently I ran a SAAB 9000 hatchback with a turbo 2.0 litre engine which gave about 26 MPG around town. Why did I have the hatch back version well versatility otherwise it was the same as the sedan version, but would not have thought it was any more fuel efficient than the sedan version, and as you can see it was not the most fuel mean thing on the road

Why did I need the versatility, well so I could go to the DIY store and within limits take home all I needed, and when the dog came with us the parcel shelf was removed and the dog went in the back so saving the seats.

Great car I should have kept it

little vc10


User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (8 years 5 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 9958 times:

Quoting Fanoftristars (Reply 21):
Ok, so if I can borrow a vehicle that is more efficient for moving furniture from Ikea, then why can't europeans borrow their uncles hatchback?

Because, unlike an SUV or pickup, you don't sacrifice anything by buying a hatchback in the first place rather than a classic sedan. It does not cost anything more to buy, insure or run. It is thus a versitile, do-everything design, and when people are looking for a car which will be the only one in the family, they will go for the one that is the most capable of suiting various needs, from going to work, taking the kids to school, going on holiday or moving furniture, and still costs little to run and can park in tight european city streets..


25 PHLBOS : Actually, for many years, most notchback sedans sold in the U.S. offer either as standard equipment or an option rear seats that fold down; thereby al
26 Post contains images Petertenthije : Don't know about other countries, but in the Netherlands a lot the small and midsize cars are not even offered as a sedan. Only the larger cars are av
27 Halls120 : I believe the reason hatchbacks fell out of favor in the US is because most of them were just plain underpowered junk. Ford Pinto, Chevy Citation, Do
28 KaiGywer : Hatchbacks are more versatile than sedans because of more height. While many sedans let you fold down the back seat, you are still limited by the fra
29 PHLBOS : When was the last time you saw a new Toyota Corolla or a Nissan Sentra hatchback? Both have only been offered (in the States) as notchback sedans for
30 Halls120 : I agree that Toyota and Honda used to offer hatchbacks. But given how atrocious the GM/Ford/Chrysler products were, I'm sure that had an impact on th
31 Cfalk : I think you just nailed it right there, Halls. And to clarify why station wagons and hatchbacks are still popular in Europe, that can be explained by
32 PHLBOS : Kudos to both of you on the above-statements which are probably more accurate than lambasting particular car line(s); which (applies to Halls120's ea
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Manual (Stick)-Shift...Why So Popular In Europe? posted Mon Jan 31 2005 12:07:38 by Mdsh00
Why Are Americans So Uninterested In The World? posted Thu Jul 29 2004 07:57:00 by MD-90
Why Are Law Enforcement Dressed In Blue? posted Tue May 2 2006 16:21:45 by UTA_flyinghigh
Is Christmas Really Popular In Europe? posted Mon Dec 26 2005 00:20:35 by AerospaceFan
Why Are Women So Moody? posted Thu Dec 8 2005 20:03:53 by Dc10s4ever
Why Is Alcohol So Expensive In Scandinavia? posted Sun Nov 6 2005 21:11:33 by Sabena332
Why Is Fuel So Cheap In The USA? posted Thu Oct 6 2005 21:04:21 by TheSonntag
Why Are USA So Afraid Of Socialism? posted Tue Sep 13 2005 18:32:44 by Bofredrik
Why Is Mandela So Popular? posted Sat Jul 2 2005 22:01:10 by Bofredrik
Razor Blades... Why Are They So Bl**dy Expensive? posted Wed Jan 26 2005 14:29:52 by 707cmf