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Christian Foes Of 'Da Vinci Code' Debate How To Fi  
User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3027 times:

.... Christian Foes of 'Da Vinci Code' Debate How to Fight It

" Many Christian leaders across the country are girding themselves for battle with "The Da Vinci Code," the movie based on the blockbuster novel by Dan Brown that opens on May 19. Whether Roman Catholic or Protestant, Orthodox or evangelical, they agree that the book attacks the pillars of Christianity by raising doubts about the divinity of Jesus and the origins of the Bible.... "


http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/11/us...ci.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin

200 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8615 posts, RR: 43
Reply 1, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3020 times:

Quoting TACAA320 (Thread starter):
Orthodox or evangelical, they agree that the book attacks the pillars of Christianity by raising doubts about the divinity of Jesus and the origins of the Bible.

Lol... yet the same Christian leaders would probably not hesitate to insult the Prophet of Islam by calling him a "camel ******" or other good, "conservative" nicknames. It all seems like a bunch of kids arguing in their kindergarten...

"My God kicks your God's ass!"
"No, my God kicks your God's ass twice!"
"HA! MY God kicks YOUR God's ass infinitely!"
"And MY God kicks YOUR God's ass to infinity plus one!"

Can't people just believe in whatever they want to believe in and let others do the same?!



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3010 times:

" Famed symbologist Professor Robert Langdon (Tom Hanks) is called to the Louvre museum one night where a curator has been murdered, leaving behind a mysterious trail of symbols and clues. With his own survival at stake, Langdon, aided by the police cryptologist Sophie Neveu (Audrey Tautou), unveils a series of stunning secrets hidden in the works of Leonardo Da Vinci, all leading to a covert society dedicated to guarding an ancient secret that has remained hidden for 2000 years.... "

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/da_vinci_code/


User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12028 posts, RR: 47
Reply 3, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3005 times:
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Any film with Audrey Tautou in is worth watching.

As to the Da Vinci Code itself, some people need to remember it's found in the bookshops filed under FICTION.  banghead 



Hey AA, the 1960s called. They want their planes back!
User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 3002 times:

Quoting Scbriml (Reply 3):
some people need to remember it's found in the bookshops filed under FICTION.

Because it is FICTION !


User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 5940 posts, RR: 30
Reply 5, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2994 times:
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Quoting TACAA320 (Thread starter):
" Many Christian leaders across the country are girding themselves for battle with "The Da Vinci Code," the movie based on the blockbuster novel by Dan Brown that opens on May 19.

Hi TACAA320, long time no see,

Here in Monterrey, the Opus Dei is particularly powerful. They are planning boycotts of malls that have multiplexes if they show the movie. They are also planning human chains around entrances to cinema's and I have received calls from a few friends belonging to the Opus Dei and the Christian Legionnaires warning me that I should not go see the movie, because it was "dangerous".

I'm glad we had Benito Juarez in the 19th century

Whatever anybody's faith, I believe freedom of expression should raise above it, and in any case, the book and the movie are works of fiction.

Some of these people are the same ones who were wondering about why part of the muslim world was shocked with the cartoons published in Western Europe.

"God save us from those who believe they are doing God's work"

"Salvame, oh Señor de aquellos que creen que continuan tu obra"



MGGS
User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2987 times:

Quoting AR385 (Reply 5):

Hi TACAA320, long time no see,

Nice to hear from you again !

Quoting AR385 (Reply 5):
They are also planning human chains around entrances to cinema's and I have received calls from a few friends belonging to the Opus Dei and the Christian Legionnaires warning me that I should not go see the movie, because it was "dangerous".

As Christian Catholic, and after a long conversation with the priest of my Parrish, I decided to see the "movie". If I want to criticize it, I must attend the theater first.


At least I hope that the money that I will spend really worth it [ but I really don't hope that much ].


User currently offlineAirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2985 times:

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 4):

Because it is FICTION !

I'm one who is sick and tired of Christian leaders who feel that they are being persecuted, whenever a movie or book comes out that is not in accordance with their beliefs.

Quoting AR385 (Reply 5):
Some of these people are the same ones who were wondering about why part of the muslim world was shocked with the cartoons published in Western Europe.

 checkmark  Hypocrites!


User currently offlineCornish From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 8187 posts, RR: 54
Reply 8, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2979 times:

Quoting AirCop (Reply 7):
I'm one who is sick and tired of Christian leaders who feel that they are being persecuted, whenever a movie or book comes out that is not in accordance with their beliefs.

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 



Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
User currently offlineA332 From Canada, joined Feb 2005, 1644 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2976 times:

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 4):
Because it is FICTION !

So is the Bible... what the hell is your point?



Bad spellers of the world... UNTIE!
User currently offlineNkops From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2633 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2972 times:

For me it is simple.....

I am a Christian and don't agree with the book or movie, so guess what, I'm not going to see it.... that's it..... if you want to see it, be my guest, just don't talk to me about it.

And while the characters are fictional in the book... the ideas (Jesus being married to Mary Magdalene, had kids, etc) have been around for centuries and I believe Mr. Brown references that in the beginning of the book.



next flights ACY-TPA-ACY on NK, ACY-ORD-DEN-IAH-ACY on UA
User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2965 times:

Quoting A332 (Reply 9):
what the hell is your point?

Do you really believe in "hell"?
By the way, what's yours?

[Edited 2006-05-11 15:39:05]

User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2960 times:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 1):

Can't people just believe in whatever they want to believe in and let others do the same?!

NO!!! You must believe what I believe:
http://www.venganza.org/

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 4):
Because it is FICTION !

Based on a POSSIBLE fact  Wink

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 6):
As Christian Catholic, and after a long conversation with the priest of my Parrish, I decided to see the "movie". If I want to criticize it, I must attend the theater first.

Good for you  Smile I wish more people would come to understand first hand what it is they are critical of in the first place. People who make judgments about things they haven't experienced are simply one thing: prejudiced. I have no time for such people in my life.


User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2956 times:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 12):
Based on a POSSIBLE fact

Just "POSSIBLE" as anything else in life...

[Edited 2006-05-11 15:42:50]

User currently offlineNkops From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2633 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2952 times:

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 11):
Do you really believe in "hell"?

Yes... I go there 5 days a week for a paycheck.  Big grin


For us in the U.S., if you want to see the movie, go ahead, if you don't then don't.... that's what we call freedom!!!!!!

I choose not too, but don't really care if anyone else does!!!

 twocents 



next flights ACY-TPA-ACY on NK, ACY-ORD-DEN-IAH-ACY on UA
User currently offlineYeahitsK From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2950 times:

I heard that they were trying to get a disclaimer run at the beginning of the movie to point out that it was fiction. IMO, this is rather insulting to the intelligence of the audience. It's just a story we are all aware of that. If anything, the book made me more interested in art and religion.

User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2938 times:

Quoting YeahitsK (Reply 15):
IMO, this is rather insulting to the intelligence of the audience

Maybe they know how ignorant their followers are?  duck 


User currently offlineMd80fanatic From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 2659 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 2921 times:

I haven't seen the movie or read the book (most likely never will also). I do, however, have an opinion about the idea of Jesus having a child. It seems pretty illogical to me, that the Man would choose to leave His child behind to go to the cross. Children were (and still are) the most important people on the planet...there is no need to list the numerous passages where His opinions on children were forcefully stated as they are well known to all.

I believe if there were a child, the crucifixion would have never happened. Jesus would have obviously known the danger His child would be in once He was gone, and that is absolute evidence (to me at least) that He did not have one. Jesus was not (is not) inconsistant and illogical.


User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2915 times:

Quoting Md80fanatic (Reply 17):
Jesus would have obviously known the danger His child would be in once He was gone

If it happened...Wouldn't the fear of re-precussion be the very reason for keeping the fact he had a child a secret? While I don't give a flying... about what some MAN did 2000 odd years ago....that seems VERY logical to me.


User currently offlineMaury From United States of America, joined May 2005, 532 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2910 times:

Fighting a movie...working to put a "fiction!!" disclaimer in a movie...getting their ruby slippers in an uproar...all sound like a good use of time for these zealots. Maybe it'll keep them occupied enough to let us reclaim some of our government...(see: McClain courts Falwell in bid for US Presidency, multiple sources.)

User currently offlineCOrocks From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 1211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2907 times:

Quoting AR385 (Reply 5):
Here in Monterrey, the Opus Dei is particularly powerful. They are planning boycotts of malls that have multiplexes if they show the movie. They are also planning human chains around entrances to cinema's and I have received calls from a few friends belonging to the Opus Dei and the Christian Legionnaires warning me that I should not go see the movie, because it was "dangerous".

By doing all of that, aren't they kind of playing into their characterization in the book? I read it right when it came out, but if I recall the Opus Dei were the ones pushing so hard that they would do anything to cover it up. Looks like they are doing the same thing now.


User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2907 times:

Quoting Maury (Reply 19):
McClain

Did you mean:

Or


User currently offlineMKEdude From South Korea, joined May 2005, 1010 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2906 times:

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 6):
As Christian Catholic, and after a long conversation with the priest of my Parrish, I decided to see the "movie". If I want to criticize it, I must attend the theater first.

Good for you, really. There are far to many people who decide to decide to lob hate on something simply because somebody has told them to. Whatever your oninion will be at least it will be an informed one.

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 12):
NO!!! You must believe what I believe:
http://www.venganza.org/

I too have been touched by his noodly appendage  pray 



"You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline." Frank Zappa
User currently offlineMaury From United States of America, joined May 2005, 532 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2901 times:

Ted:

Whichever one the straw-grasping Reeps choose to run, although I can't see Bruce Willis sitting down for a lemonade with Falwell.  Smile


User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 5940 posts, RR: 30
Reply 24, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2895 times:
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Quoting YeahitsK (Reply 15):
I heard that they were trying to get a disclaimer run at the beginning of the movie to point out that it was fiction.

Yes. The Opus Dei, with the support fron the Vatican asked Ron Howard sometime last year to add the disclaimer. He refused. They asked him again just last week, less sublty. He replied also less subtly that a movie is a work of fiction, and as such it did not need a disclaimer anymore than Independence Day did.

As for myself. I read the book when it came out. I will only say that I believe the movie will not be so good, because creating a script from that book is just very difficult and must have been titanical work. But the book was a work of fiction, no more better in my opinion than a good novel-thriller. A bit convoluted, to my taste.



MGGS
25 MD80fanatic : Well Ted, I doubt LYING about a child's existence would be a very logical thing to do from Jesus' perspective (that's the kind of stuff WE do, not Hi
26 Post contains images TedTAce : Oh I forgot; he's beyond reproach
27 TACAA320 : As long as I know nobody do it yet since the worldwide premier will be [if I am correct] on May 19th, 2006.
28 Post contains images TACAA320 : Is as "hot" as people usually say, or just "warm" ?
29 CastleIsland : Time to fire up the old chainsaw I guess. Freaking idiots. Go suck on some bread and cheap wine.
30 MD80fanatic : I agree entirely (except for the rolleyes). He was completely a man (a real man) and completely perfect...quite the opposite of what we see today. Si
31 YeahitsK : Nobody would question that Jesus was a real person, but how do you really know that he was completely perfect?
32 Post contains images TedTAce : Do you mean: SATAN!!!
33 JBirdAV8r : Not really. The book focuses on some ideas presented by the self-worshipping crock Pierre Plantard and found years ago to be complete fabrications. I
34 MD80fanatic : I cannot tell you that, it is personal and private. Let's just say I have faith. I really wish I could prove it to you....but then my faith would no
35 Scbriml : Is your faith that fragile that you're not even prepared to discuss possible alternatives that don't match your beliefs?
36 Post contains images Nkops : it's hot, but a dry heat!!!! You either accept it by faith or you don't.... end of story!!!
37 TACAA320 : That's great. Can't stop laughing...
38 LH477 : Many people do question if Jesus was real. I do. I am not Christian nor Muslim, nor Jewish. In my religion Jesus isn't in the scope of belief. Neithe
39 Yeahitsk : Because he was a person and no person is perfect. Nothing personal or private about it. I have no doubts he was an exemplary person, but perfect is a
40 MD80fanatic : Understood. I suppose it depends most on who (and what) one believes Jesus really was. If you believe He was -just- a man then of course you might qu
41 YeahitsK : I'm certainly not an authority on the subject, but I'm pretty sure his existence as a person that walked the earth is known to be fact. I learned tha
42 RobTrent : As Stated earlier this Film is based on a work of fiction. Faith is a very different and personal matter. R
43 Ctbarnes : There's very little doubt among scholars that Jesus was a real person; there are historical accounts about his death which do exist. The real question
44 Nkops : Let me restate this for you.... I do not wish to hear about this movie because it is supposedly "fiction" that goes against my beliefs. To me, this i
45 Post contains images TedTAce : Then why do you keep reading/posting to this thread
46 Scbriml : I'm not mocking you or your beliefs, but I do find your choice of words most intruiging. Does the fact that you refer to the film as supposedly ficti
47 MD80fanatic : I think it indicates that he is not sure of what the movie/book's contents are and would prefer to reserve a definate comment on them. Since he has no
48 Nkops : The original post of the thread was the reaction of the Christian community to the movie. I was just interested to see what it was, I didn't want to
49 AndesSMF : Um, Allah and God are the same person. Jesus is considered a prophet in the same vein as Mohamed. As to the book, it is fiction, but well written fict
50 Marco : So is the Bible... what the hell is your point? In YOUR opinion. To over a billion people in the world it is not. Perhaps you should consider that and
51 Post contains images Fumanchewd : I don't enjoy talking with people who believe that everything in the Bible or Koran is true, but from the bible... I have reflected on jesus's compas
52 RayChuang : In my humble opinion, Sony Pictures could have avoided this mess if they had just put in a disclaimer at the beginning of this movie saying the story-
53 TACAA320 : Agreed !
54 Post contains images TedTAce : I guess they should do this for every single movie that is released with the exception of documentaries like farenhype 9/11 huh? Here's a hint: Did y
55 Post contains images MD80fanatic : Interesting points Fumanchewd, There is an absolute truth in this world and I don't believe the Bible encompasses the absolute truth absolutely....if
56 Fumanchewd : I certainly agree. I feel the same way. It is in my opinion, however, many Christians are able to commit themselves to penetince through a figure tha
57 Post contains images MD80fanatic : Very nice. I think you have summed up (for me) the most important reason why He came here in the first place. We were all lost in this stuff and going
58 Post contains images TedTAce : A) Thanks for hijacking the thread B) Yeah right... ok.. Whatever.. The only thing that will save humans is their willingness to dedicate themselves
59 Post contains images L410Turbolet : To me it's also just an old story book. Same goes for Koran. I respect their faith in those stories so please respect my right not to bend backwards
60 Scbriml : As he indeed clarified himself. But his choice of words was open to misinterpretation. I really wasn't, and if he thought I was, I apologise.
61 Post contains images Scbriml : I'm very happy to show religious people respect as long as they're prepared to respect my rights to not share their beliefs. All too often it's a cas
62 Windshear : I don't want to be flamed... But isn't much of the Catholic faith, based on the Roman empire and its traditions? There seems to be a big diference bet
63 Fumanchewd : You have slected a small tidbit of his reply in our conversation on the fallibilty of jesus. This is relevant because the Da Vinci Code is based on u
64 AR385 : I am a Roman Catholic. I believe in The Father, The Son and the Holy Spirit. I also believe in the Virgin Mary. The above is not a belief. It is my fa
65 Fumanchewd : Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s Again, I don't like to be a bible "QUOTER" but christian
66 Fumanchewd : Amen brother! Hallelujah! Thank you for your post! I think that it was extremely intelligent and I respect everything that you had to say. However, f
67 AR385 : This is an insighful point you make, because it reflects what is happening in this, the 21st century. A lot of people still believe the rules of the
68 TedTAce : Faith in God is one thing, faith in men and the lousy stories they tell/books they write is another. Men/Man demonstrates time and again why they are
69 RobertNL070 : Let me see if I can explain myself here, because that is a valid point you make Ted. These scriptures were written many hundreds, thousands of years a
70 Fumanchewd : Yes. A good example is Boethius. He is a philospher whom I love who wrote The Consulation of Philosophy. He was an administrator in the Byzantium emp
71 Fumanchewd : No. I am sorry you feel this way.
72 Post contains images Flyingbabydoc : As windshear wrote in his post, I would say it was a likely fact. Jesus was a Rabbi, and it was mandatory for him to be wedded (also according to the
73 Post contains images Fumanchewd : Perhaps it was "women-fiend" but there were also pragmatic reasons for Catholics to believe that he was always single. The first priest was essential
74 AR385 : You are absolutely right. It's just that I phrased this: "Anyway though, in such a society, the ones who criticize and insult are the those with the
75 NumberTwelve : Tell me about facts in the bible - a virgin getting a child, a man dying and standing up again. Really fiction. Is that the same freedom when your pr
76 AR385 : I do not necessarily agree with you. Man is one of the few if not the only animal species who is willing to sacrifice its own life for a total strang
77 NumberTwelve : Turn it around: As for those who criticize cartoons against Christians, I hope you also criticized the cartoons against the Muslim.
78 Fumanchewd : Neither one is correct. We should be able to criticize both. Otherwise we would be living in the 12th century.
79 AR385 : The bible is not about facts. It is about faith. The adjective "Fiction" is really way off the mark for the bible, or the other holy books for that m
80 Fumanchewd : Absolutely! It helped the catholic church to become the humanitarian and relevant institution that it is today. I know that quite a few will be cynic
81 NumberTwelve : To criticize is ok, but this has to be done in a fair way. As soon as you insult people, it's not ok. So the "freedom of speech" can be abused. Do we
82 Fumanchewd : I understand your position, but please do not compare the moderators on this fourm to the "freedom of press" in America. The moderators will delete 8
83 Flyingbabydoc : One more reason why discussion and evolution is so urgently required for the progress of mankind. While some religions keep on considering women sub-
84 Post contains images Windshear : I know I meant the Catholic faith. Gnostics and Copts are very different because of that. I mean how come Armeic is not the devine language, but Lati
85 Post contains images L410Turbolet : I mean, do you really have drag your obsession into EVERY thread you post?
86 Windshear : He can in Denmark! Maybe because of Germanys acknowledgement of the atrocities, and their emense sense of responsibility is this not allowed, quit ma
87 NumberTwelve : So what's your point, L410? Everybody was crying about the "bad" Muslim people who don't accept freedom of free speech and as soon as the "good" Chri
88 Post contains images Nkops : That is correct... there is a verse in Psalms that says "Be angry, and sin not" I agree... IMO, you are completely entitled to believe what you belie
89 NumberTwelve : This is why i wrote "freedom", not "freedom of speech".
90 Windshear : Have you heard of troll rhetoric? Boaz.
91 MD80fanatic : For the record, I never said the movie should be stopped. I did say that I believed it had no basis in fact and was illogical and inconsistant. If the
92 TACAA320 : Fiction ? As somebody said somewhere in this thread is just "your opinion". A respectable one but definitely not the one of millions of Christians.
93 Post contains links TACAA320 : "BUT IT'S ONLY FICTION!" -- Why Christians should respond to The Da Vinci Code: 1. There are many on-the-record statements from Dan Brown and his publ
94 Flyingbabydoc : Maybe they would also make this audience think a bit more about their faith or the faith of others and draw some new conclusions. I see no harm being
95 Post contains images Nordair : THANK YOU ALEX!!
96 TACAA320 : That's part of an article non written by me. It was quoted from the link shown there. I prefer to make a personal statement about the movie [since th
97 DeltaDC9 : Ironically, Islam, Judaism, and Christianity all worship the exact same God, the God of Abraham. The Torah, Christian Bible, and Koran all relay many
98 YeahitsK : Wow- Source please? That is a tremendous claim to make. Did you really mean to say most of the Bible has proven to be factual by science, or some of
99 AR385 : I started a thread in this forum about maybe 2 months ago. I think I called it "Creationism vs Intelligent design." I think that if you do a search y
100 Post contains images Flyingbabydoc : I think that the whole point is not whether or not he is right or wrong. The whole question is why would such a claim, IF TRUE, be so damaging for th
101 A332 : Anyone with a half a brain would conclude that Biblical tales are just that... tales... then again, common sense can't be taught.
102 LTBEWR : Remember the conterversy when the movie "The Passion of Christ" came out (Mel Gibson's film)? Many Christians praised that film despite what some desc
103 TACAA320 : I was referring to the movie not to the Holy Bible. Really? Did you study or even read it once ?
104 DeltaDC9 : Pretty sure of yourself huh? Then why is there so much evidence that much of it is, on the surface, true? I know its easier to deny, but back it up d
105 Nkops : I've been so careful in this thread not to disrespect anyone, but obviously it doesn't work both ways. I believe that the Bible is truth, that I acce
106 Maury : SO: if there were to be a movie made on the life of Karol Wojtyla, and that movie portrayed some of the "miracles" that the Catholic church now attrib
107 Post contains images DeltaDC9 : Sorry! if there was an emoticon for egg on face I would use it. This will have to do... This subject must be affecting my comprehension skills, that
108 TACAA320 : That´s what I call a "pathetic assumption".
109 Flyingbabydoc : Interesting point. I have read quite a bit about the messages implied in the dead sea scrolls. Some scholars do believe that Jesus "turned" into an e
110 Marco : To me it's also just an old story book. Same goes for Koran. I respect their faith in those stories so please respect my right not to bend backwards b
111 Carmenlu15 : And it seems that only someone with a complete brain would be able to keep a discussion civil, respecting other points of view and not resorting to f
112 LTU932 : When is that film on in Costa Rica? I saw lots of adverts for it when I was going to and returning from the airport this afternoon. As for me, I'm pe
113 TACAA320 : As long as I know, May 19th. I will confirm that.
114 Windshear : Ameen to that! I think this touches an element of which I have been debating in a Danish forum. It is as if, here in Northern Europe at least, people
115 TedTAce : Care to show me where besides the Bible it is said that Moses existed? Can you prove (outside of biblical reference) that the 1,000's of Jews that we
116 Windshear : Excuse me but the Jewish faith is very highly based upon the history of my people. The Torah and Talmud are the bones of the Jewish people, if you wi
117 Post contains links TACAA320 : Just an aside commentary... "Satellite pictures taken last summer of Mount Ararat in Turkey may reveal the final resting place of Noah's ark, accordi
118 Windshear : I am not sure all in the Torah or bible should be taken litterally. It would be almost meaningless as a script, if everything was to be taken for face
119 Post contains links TACAA320 : This site [among many others] may help people to a better understanding of the Bible http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/bible.shtml
120 TACAA320 : Very well said Carmen. As always.
121 Ctbarnes : Which half? Seriously though, the Gospels cannot be relied upon to give us a biographical account of Jesus' life, death and resurrection in the sense
122 YeahitsK : Rather than search for the ark, why not search for evidence of a worldwide flood? Even if a fixed and finite amount of water on the planet is overloo
123 FSPilot747 : So is Christianity. And any other religion, for that matter. Get a grip, don't Christians have bigger fish to fry?
124 TACAA320 : It's YOUR opinion, against millions of Christians one. If you want to think that ALL religions are fiction, why don't you give us a "serious and deta
125 SA7700 : Thank you very much Carmen, you made my day! In your mindset, if Christianity and other religions are fiction for that matter, where did the earth, o
126 Marco : Anyway it seems that religion has become a non-issue in the west and this has correlated with: materialism, mental diseases (I remember reading that b
127 SATX : Very true. We let our President believe that 'God' was on his side and that the world was his playground. Just look where that got us. Are you so bli
128 YeahitsK : I have a hard time believing that. I would guess that obesity related illnesses will have that dubious honor, unless of course we find a cure for hea
129 FSPilot747 : Just like an everliving God...just happened to be there? You guys were raised and brainwashed with all this religious bunk, have you ever tried to co
130 Post contains images SA7700 : To make assumptions, without the real facts in front of you, is also a dangerous game of Russian roulette. I never stated that I was a religious pers
131 TACAA320 : What do you mean by that ?
132 Post contains images TedTAce : Even if you found the biggest pile of wood on the effing planet that could have been an ark; how do you explain Noah fitting billions of animals on i
133 Post contains links TACAA320 : Yes, so what? And the question is still unanswered. Can you prove the opposite. Even more... Is still a theory. Nothing proved yet about its veracity
134 Post contains images TedTAce : You really love demonstrating your ignorance don't you? Science is not about what you CAN'T prove it's about what you CAN prove. If you can't PROVE i
135 TACAA320 : I'm just now preocupied. I'm learning from you.
136 Post contains links TACAA320 : Among many others... http://www.mountainman.com.au/a_tyana0.html The mystery is solved.
137 Post contains links TACAA320 : A mystery ? A science mystery is the creation of the universe. The big bang is still a theory. But if you want to know about Noah's Ark, check http:/
138 TACAA320 : Who's the ignorant ?
139 AR385 : You are taking my writing out of context to serve your purposes. You should quote the whole post, or not quote it at all. Thanks.
140 Post contains images Stirling : TedT: I think Apollonius of Tyana was in Prince's band....she was the Puerto Rican girl! Real Good Looking.......I don't know how we got from the Bibl
141 JCS17 : I believe this is completely embarrassing. I'm a non-practising Catholic, and when I heard about the whole Vatican hub-bub about this, I almost went i
142 Post contains images Md80fanatic : Hey Ted, thanks for hijacking this thread (once again). If you had the tiniest amount of faith is anything besides B - Q, you would realise that you
143 AR385 : In any case, if it is not BLIND, then it is not faith.
144 Post contains images TedTAce : you for not recognizing A) it was a typo, and B) I was making a joke Ironic considering you used B, C or D, L, and maybe O (to pay for your computer)
145 Post contains images MD80fanatic : Since the internet is the "front lines" of today's war on evil....the few items you mentioned are temporary necessities of the fight. You always screa
146 Post contains images TedTAce : I think you missed it when I said: While I'll GLADLY BLAST the stuffing out of stuff that's OBVIOUS BS, I'll take a more reserved approach to that of
147 Ctbarnes : Not just your opinion; St. Paul, Thomas Aquinas, and Augustine have been saying this for centuries, just to mention a few. Charles, SJ
148 Post contains links TACAA320 : "As senior Conspirator Eugene Volokh has warned, one of the dangers of censoring "offensive" speech is "censorship envy." If one group is given the po
149 Ctbarnes : All of this begs a crucial question which I think Arinze and others in the Vatican do not entirely appreciate, namely the effects of the Catholic Chu
150 Post contains images TedTAce : Yet not fast enough for some. See this is the kind of thing that just makes me want to choke someone. An Obvious LITERAL interpretation of a book tha
151 Post contains images Nkops : To you, but to millions of Christians it is truth. Wait, we are running in circles now, aren't we??? Except Ricky Williams
152 Post contains images TedTAce : Yes, which to me is VERY sad. It's like saying I'm going to read and live by ONLY one book in my life. I'm not going to care about anything anyone el
153 Ctbarnes : The source of which, incidentally, comes from Matthew's Gospel (Mt 7: 12 to be exact). For the same reason that those who self-righteously accuse Chr
154 TedTAce : thanks for citing that, bottom line: No one does it. Yeap, you caught me. I am filled with hate, spite and intolerance.... of those who have the same
155 Ctbarnes : Do you think it might be possible in the process of telling us all how much better you are for admitting you are a hypocrite to give the rest of us t
156 Post contains images Fumanchewd : First off, I said... Second of all, I don't believe that you have the ability to tell someone that "the love of god" is not enough for them. What is
157 TedTAce : If your willing to make that admission that's great, unfortunately we are in a VERY small minority. Ok, I was under the mistaken impression that was
158 Fumanchewd : Errr, tithes are a red herring to my point that, for some, god is the only reason that they have to continue. Whether that is good or bad, it is the
159 Ctbarnes : Perhaps being a celebate I can shed some light on this. One of the things I frequently hear is that celebacy is unnatural and contrary to the "establ
160 Ctbarnes : There are a lot more of us than you give us credit for. But then, such a recognition would entail having to let go of some stereotypes. Charles, SJ
161 FSPilot747 : Jesus? God? News to me. All the *enlightened* Christians never say Jesus is in fact God. I ask them, "so JC...you believe he is god, right?" "well...
162 TACAA320 : Just because you say so? Have you ever heard about the Holy Trinity ?
163 Post contains images TACAA320 : You said "history", not "myth". Luke 16:31 "And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one
164 AR385 : See, the problem in this type of discussions is that airliner knowledge just doesn't cut it. You need to know more about the topic at hand, if you do
165 TACAA320 : I love quotes too: Faith is taking the first step even when you don't see the whole staircase. Martin Luther King, Jr. In faith there is enough light
166 Flyingbabydoc : With all due respect, but I beg to differ on my opinion. While I understand what you try to explain in your post, why would you consider the expressi
167 Ctbarnes : Sorry Alex, I didn't mean to construe that the emotional connection expressed in sex and marriage or is somehow immature or inappropriate, or that ce
168 Post contains images L410Turbolet : Then I guess cops, doctors, teachers and maybe even ATCs should also be banned from having families. There are many other, much more demanding profes
169 Post contains images AR385 : I could not have said it better. Obviously when you take the bows of celibacy you are doing so voluntarily.
170 DeltaDC9 : Funny how people can't grasp that. Even Einstien, who lived and died in search of proof of everything, admitted that some things cannot be explained.
171 TACAA320 : And he even said "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind".
172 Ctbarnes : That's just it though; faith isn't blind. It is an act of the heart and an act of reason together. If you separate them, as was done in the enlighten
173 Post contains images MDorBust : Dang those shinto hand choppers. They're bad, but you haven't seen anything until you cross a Buddhist... East doesn't just mean middle east you know
174 DeltaDC9 : That is definitly food for thought, thanks. I have always had a problem with the term blind faith though. Once faith becomes blind, to me, it is no l
175 Ctbarnes : I agree. It does seem like an oxymoron. I guess at the end of the day that is what faith and religion try to do: to try and put into words something
176 FSPilot747 : You're right. Not the assholes that ring my doorbell on Saturday. He left it to the Europeans who converted Africans to Christianity in a makeshift c
177 DeltaDC9 : No it does not, you just do not understand how. It makes perfect sense, you choose not to understand. It takes a lot of faith to make a claim like th
178 FSPilot747 : what
179 DeltaDC9 : You make a lot of assertions about things you have no knowledge or proof of, all you have is faith in yourself that you are correct. You have zero ev
180 AR385 : I still don't know what you mean with the assholes that ring your doorbell on Saturday, who are you talking about? Your example of the slaveship has
181 DeltaDC9 : While you seem to have a pretty good analytical grasp of this subject, you and the poster you are addressing both do not have a clue as to what a dia
182 AR385 : Delta, you are wrong, at least in my case, as it seems the post was addresed to both of us. I go to mass, etc. but my dialogue with God is pretty my
183 DeltaDC9 : And yet you say that MOST people who talk with God have a mental disease...surely you can see why I addressed you as I did. I question now whether yo
184 Windshear : I have a great interest in Kabbalah, Kabbalah derives from analasys of the 'Book Of Formation' which was written by Abraham over 4000 years ago.The b
185 DeltaDC9 : This is exactly how I see it. I have always believed that taking the Bible literally forces you to completely miss the true meaning. Thanks for that
186 Post contains images Nkops : I'm guessing Jehovah's Witnesses, thats the only thing I can figure from this statement.
187 FSPilot747 : Mormons. Whoever it is, they're selling their religion. Anyone who converts after a chit chat with one of those needs more guidance than religion can
188 Nkops : AAhhh... we don't get them around here... we get the Jehovah's witnesses knocking at my door!!! Drives me nuts. While I am a Bible believing Christia
189 FSPilot747 : Answer your door naked. Should work. Worked for someone I knew.
190 Post contains images Windshear : Exactly my point There is nothing science can do, but proove religion right, feeble minds have always tried to fit reality to their views, which mean
191 AR385 : I really don't understand this part of your post. I guess you may have misinterpreted me or maybe did not understand my post. I can further explain m
192 TACAA320 : Have you ever heard the Pope(the actual one, or any other) insulting others or acting as a child ? I´ll bet you don´t.
193 Post contains images TedTAce : Want to bet again??? Like it or not this numbnut (above) is a 'christian leader'
194 TACAA320 : Aloges reference is in general terms referred to Christian leaders, not to one in specific. My question is specifically about The Pope, who never ins
195 DeltaDC9 : In fact, a previous Pope granted land in Rome for a Islamic Mosque, because he recognises that Muslims pray to the same God as Catholics, the God of
196 Post contains links TACAA320 : Unfortunately another a.netter don't have the wisdom nor knowledge to understand that. I sincerely can't expect less from Vatican II, from H.H. John
197 DeltaDC9 : Thank you for that, I learned a lot I did not know, and it makes me wonder how little of this is known of this outside the Catholic Church.
198 Ctbarnes : More in his own mind than anything else. He definately gives Christianity a bad name. Charles, SJ
199 Post contains links TACAA320 : Let God judge him. I prefer to talk about so many people that gives Christianity a GOOD name like Helder Camara: "I [sometimes] wonder how there can
200 Post contains images TedTAce : I already have thank you
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