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Israel On The Verge Of Entering Gaza  
User currently offlineRJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 2477 times:

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...ename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

IAF aircraft blew up a key strategic bridge in the northern Gaza Strip shortly before midnight on Tuesday. The army said that the operation was intended to keep Hamas from taking kidnapped soldier Cpl. Gilad Shalit out of the Gaza Strip.

In addition, IDF tanks were amassing around Gaza, and were awaiting orders to begin a ground incursion into the strip. However, the the army denied an Israel Radio report that the armored forces had actually begun a ground incursion into the strip.

Earlier, Defense Minister Amir Peretz said that "the clock is running out, and Israel is poised and ready for a military operation in the Gaza Strip."

I really hope Hamas comes to its senses and turns over the soldier before this escalates. And mark my words, the IDF will be in Gaza if Hamas doesn't return the kidnapped Israeli.


Israeli Defense Minister Amir Peretz meets with troops


An IDF soldier cleaning his weapon near the Gaza border on Monday.


IDF tanks amass around the Gaza Strip, poised for an incursion in response to the kidnapping of IDF soldier Cpl. Gilad Shalit.

45 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 2421 times:

Quoting RJpieces (Thread starter):
I really hope Hamas comes to its senses and turns over the soldier before this escalates.

Should Israel come to its senses it would release all women and children its holding against all international law.

Quoting RJpieces (Thread starter):
And mark my words, the IDF will be in Gaza if Hamas doesn't return the kidnapped Israeli.

I know the arrogant racist Israel way too well. No need for a reminder.

Quoting RJpieces (Thread starter):
Cpl. Gilad Shalit.

Can you also name just ONE of the thousands of innocent women and children Israel is holding?


User currently offlineLY7E7 From Israel, joined Jun 2004, 2256 posts, RR: 19
Reply 2, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2409 times:

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 1):
holding against all international law.

Not true. They underwent trials on terrorism charges.



2 things are endless: ignorance and space
User currently offlineLegoguy From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 3313 posts, RR: 39
Reply 3, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2408 times:

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 1):
Can you also name just ONE of the thousands of innocent women and children Israel is holding?

Im don't really know much about the how situation but is Israel really holding thousands of innocent people???



Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
User currently offlineLY7E7 From Israel, joined Jun 2004, 2256 posts, RR: 19
Reply 4, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2404 times:

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 3):
is Israel really holding thousands of innocent people???

Is a 15 years old explosives smuggler innocent?



2 things are endless: ignorance and space
User currently offlineLegoguy From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 3313 posts, RR: 39
Reply 5, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2398 times:

Quoting LY7E7 (Reply 4):
Is a 15 years old explosives smuggler innocent?

True, so they arn't holding any innocent people at all? I hope Cpl. Gilad Shalit is returned to Israel ALIVE before this escalates into war!



Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
User currently offlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5712 posts, RR: 18
Reply 6, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2398 times:

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 3):
Im don't really know much about the how situation but is Israel really holding thousands of innocent people???

Any credible source? Because if Bravo45 says "innocent women and children" then this term may as well include sheikh Yassin, Arafat and Bin Laden.


User currently offlineLY7E7 From Israel, joined Jun 2004, 2256 posts, RR: 19
Reply 7, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2396 times:

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 5):
True, so they arn't holding any innocent people at all?

Errors do occur. I wouldn't go as far as saying that all of 9000 palestinian prisoners (of whom more than a thousand are minors and women) are indeed guilty. Vast majority certinaly is guilty.



2 things are endless: ignorance and space
User currently offlineBofredrik From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2386 times:

Quoting LY7E7 (Reply 7):
Vast majority certinaly is guilty.

OK. But why keep the ones that are not guilty in prison?
That is a GOOD question.


User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2378 times:

Quoting LY7E7 (Reply 2):
Not true. They underwent trials on terrorism charges.

So far I had not searched anything specific regarding this, I know Israel had policies in place like beatings and breaking of bones for demonstrators etc so these are some of the things I knew had truth in them. A quick search reveled some facts not about the charges, the ages and the obvious conditions they were arrested in but a good beginning. I will definitely look further into the actual human rights reports.
This ones sums a lot of things up, a story in stark contrast to the one currently at hand. http://gnn.tv/headlines/9343/Portrait_of_a_woman_as_political_prisoner

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 5):
True, so they aren't holding any innocent people at all? I hope Cpl. Gilad Shalit is returned to Israel ALIVE before this escalates into war!

Other than the 'usual people' who participate when this topic is discussed, everyone knows they have fixed opinions and nothing can change their mind, especially some of the radical ones on this forum. I always like someone new stepping in from time to time. In fact that is the only one good thing that comes out of it, some others learn something new. I don't know you may have expressed yourself quite often. I am sure should there be only one and that being the true version of facts out there, the world will not have problems. So instead of fixating on any one comment by anyone or fixating on any one piece of news its more productive to keep asking questions and searching online (it is such a world out there on the web) and continue to follow up. That's how a learned opinion is formed that you can back up with wat you know.
I didn't want to lecture and thus offend you at all, your two posts made me feel you were assuming a lot and willing to change opinions at less than a stroke. There is a lot of stuff that goes on, usually not reported. Even those who spends decades on this still find surprising new facts.

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 6):
Because if Bravo45 says "innocent women and children" then this term may as well include sheikh Yassin, Arafat and Bin Laden.

Looks like what I meant was what I posted and doesn't that prove you right. Congrats on your another great guess.  Yeah sure

P.S I hope the rest of the world may one pay pay half the attention one SOLDIER is recieving to the thousands like the one whose story is posted above. But then they are Palestinians, the cheaper blood...


User currently offlineLegoguy From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 3313 posts, RR: 39
Reply 10, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2372 times:

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 9):
your two posts made me feel you were assuming a lot and willing to change opinions at less than a stroke.

I honestly have no idea what is happening between Israel and those within the Gaza strip so therefore im pretty much learning from every post in this thread



Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 11, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2370 times:

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 10):
I honestly have no idea what is happening between Israel and those within the Gaza strip so therefore im pretty much learning from every post in this thread

That was my impression too I just didn't want to be so blunt. Hope you find the truth. I would only appreciate should you participate and contribute because you will obviously learn in the process. Regarding the topic at hand, do at least scan the link I posted to get an idea what my point was.
Best Regards,
Jawad Usman.


User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2368 times:

Quoting Bofredrik (Reply 8):
But why keep the ones that are not guilty in prison?

They are finally let go of as the story I posted proves. Just never mind the eleven years spend in torture. And that is one story of a NOT GUILTY one.


User currently offlineLegoguy From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2006, 3313 posts, RR: 39
Reply 13, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2362 times:

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 11):

Thanks for the link...It has really opened my eyes. I find it disturbing all these people are tortured and held without a trial.

Having read the article....I can understand why they are holding Cpl. Gilad Shalit. However each sides reactions just add to the havoc being caused!

Why has NATO not steped in to stop the torture?? Surely they could do something?



Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2359 times:

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 13):
Why has NATO not steped in to stop the torture?? Surely they could do something?

We have the USA to Veto any resolution against Israel of just about any sort.

[Edited 2006-06-29 11:41:19]

User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2352 times:

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 13):
However each sides reactions just add to the havoc being caused!

Exactly, the cycle of violence is working perfectly despite the huge imbalance of power and military might.


User currently offlineRyanb741 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2002, 3221 posts, RR: 15
Reply 16, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2344 times:

This is great news indeed!

Signed, Hamas, Al Qaeda, Iran



I used to think the brain is the most fascinating part of my body. But, hey, who is telling me that?
User currently offlineWindshear From Denmark, joined Mar 2000, 2330 posts, RR: 11
Reply 17, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2328 times:

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 1):

I know the arrogant racist Israel way too well. No need for a reminder.

Eh what? Would you care to explain to us what you mean?
Just imagine what I now could call you, as a response to that...

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 1):

Can you also name just ONE of the thousands of innocent women and children Israel is holding?

No, I cannot!
Unlike the Palestinian terretories, Israel has a well functioning judicial system, not unlike the rest of the free world, contrary to what you might think, the Palestinians are still ruled under the law of the automatic rifle.

You made some quite apalling, insulting and very serious accusations of Israel, guess you might know Israel better than me  Yeah sure

Boaz.



"If you believe breaking is possible, believe in fixing also"-Rebbe Nachman
User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 18, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2325 times:

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 6):
if Bravo45 says "innocent women and children" then this term may as well include sheikh Yassin, Arafat and Bin Laden.

-
no, it canNOT, as the three persons were (are) neither women nor children !  wave 


User currently offlineWindshear From Denmark, joined Mar 2000, 2330 posts, RR: 11
Reply 19, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2317 times:

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 18):
no, it canNOT, as the three persons were (are) neither women nor children !

Both the Hizbollah and the Palestinian terror groups have used children as combatants!

Suicide bombers down to age 14 and armed infiltrators down to age 12!
This is sick sick sick!

Just as a side note, why the hell can't women be jailed?? Are they less guilty because they are women? Do you know that women blow them selves up as well??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_suicide_bomber
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3154341,00.html
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3109102,00.html
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3099440,00.html
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3071736,00.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1446003.stm

Boaz.



"If you believe breaking is possible, believe in fixing also"-Rebbe Nachman
User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 20, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2311 times:

Quoting Windshear (Reply 19):
Both the Hizbollah and the Palestinian terror groups have used children as combatants!
Suicide bombers down to age 14 and armed infiltrators down to age 12!

I am opposed to both the use of children in any kind of warfare AND the so-called self-sacrifice-attacks which make the activists into "one-way-soldiers"

Quoting Windshear (Reply 19):
why the hell can't women be jailed?? Are they less guilty because they are women?

women of course can be as guilty as men.


User currently offlineWindshear From Denmark, joined Mar 2000, 2330 posts, RR: 11
Reply 21, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2310 times:

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 20):
I am opposed to both the use of children in any kind of warfare AND the so-called self-sacrifice-attacks which make the activists into "one-way-soldiers"

I was not thinking you felt any other way, just wanted to point out to you, the tactics and mentality of those who are in jail.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 20):
women of course can be as guilty as men.

Then why the women and children speach??

Boaz.



"If you believe breaking is possible, believe in fixing also"-Rebbe Nachman
User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 22, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2299 times:

Quoting Windshear (Reply 21):
Then why the women and children speach??

NOT launched by me here. It is however still "standard" among more old-fashioned people, to see the role of the women in the kitchen and with the children and maybe in the garden, all this .


User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 23, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2289 times:

Quoting Windshear (Reply 17):
Israel has a well functioning judicial system, not unlike the rest of the free world, contrary to what you might think, the Palestinians are still ruled under the law of the automatic rifle.

Did you read the link I posted?? The well functioning judicial system?  Yeah sure

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 18):
no, it canNOT, as the three persons were (are) neither women nor children !

I think like many others I have read the comments of I , he was implying (sarcastically) that there are no innocent women or children in Israeli jails.

Quoting Windshear (Reply 19):
Just as a side note, why the hell can't women be jailed??

What about the case I posted??? Its not a single one incident, there are thousands like, so stop trying to justify detention of those they have material against. I am NOT talking about those. READ THE LINK I POSTED ABOVE rather than posting the typical propaganda. Or here it is again:
http://gnn.tv/headlines/9343/Portrait_of_a_woman_as_political_prisoner

Quoting Windshear (Reply 21):
Then why the women and children speach??

READ THE LINK!


User currently offlineLY7E7 From Israel, joined Jun 2004, 2256 posts, RR: 19
Reply 24, posted (8 years 2 months 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 2277 times:

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 23):
Its not a single one incident, there are thousands like

Count them. And bring relevant sources for each ,not some gnn bs.



2 things are endless: ignorance and space
25 Bravo45 : Are you telling me this is incorrect and that I won't be able to find any such cases in the reports if human rights groups? If so, I think to the con
26 Bravo45 : By the same token I wouldn't be impressed by y.net or wikipedia bs either.
27 Windshear : Then what is the point Bravo? I mean you think your sources are credible, at the same time you claim that my independant news site is bs, and go on m
28 Slider : Time for everyone to just drop the gloves, have it out until final resolution. Enough is enough. This back and forth bullshit must stop for the sake o
29 Post contains images Windshear : And end up with another generation of freedom fighters, or avengers of the deaths of family members and so on and so forth? But I understand what you
30 LY7E7 : All i said (and do read all of my posts when talking to me ,for f*cks sake) that there is a very small number of innocents arrested. Errors do occur,
31 Post contains links LY7E7 : http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1809847,00.html
32 Windshear : As in any country! But because it is Israel, there must be a sinister scheme behind all arrests. Boaz.
33 ME AVN FAN : THIS works both ways, and is in evidence on both sides. To overcome this avenging-pattern is what needs to be done.
34 Post contains images Windshear : I agree, though what I wrote was meant as a joke, you know to laugh at a serious situation, when all other options are wasted. Boaz.
35 ME AVN FAN : I DID realize your joke quite well, but you put your finger on THE most important aspect of conflicts in many parts of the world. You NEVER will meet
36 DeltaDC9 : It is Israel that is at risk of extinction, no matter what, the Arabs will remain in the region. That is a big consideration. NATO? What the hell doe
37 Windshear : "No two historians ever agree on what happened, and the damn thing is they both think they're telling the truth." Harry S. Truman. You are right, but
38 Post contains images Legoguy : Israel is currently a Mediterranean Dialogue country and has been recently seeking to expand its relationship with NATO. The first visit by a head of
39 DeltaDC9 : NATO was impotent in their own back yard when genocide reared its ugly head in Kosovo, the UN too. Clinton sent troops in without UN or NATO approval
40 ME AVN FAN : but virtually upon British and German demand. NATO was split as countries like France were, quite traditionally, on the Serbian side. the UN was para
41 DeltaDC9 : This is an imprtant parallel, we will never know who in the middle east wanted Saddam to go and sided with us in private. To assume that no Arab coun
42 L410Turbolet : You're smoking some potent weed tonight aren't you. First that stuff about Arafat now this...
43 Post contains links L410Turbolet : Not really. Instead of obsessing youself with Clinton try to find some facts first a) about the Kosovo war b) how NATO works and adopts decisions. "O
44 ME AVN FAN : - A different matter. I would assume that virtually ALL Arab countries were in favour of having Saddam removed, while ALL hoped for a decent coup-d-e
45 Post contains links Bravo45 : Here is what i said: It will ONLY apply both ways. Like I mentioned I will look into the Human Rights reports and will get back here. Maybe exactly b
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