SFOMEX From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 3310 times:
This Sunday July 2, Mexicans will vote to elect their new president for the next six years. The winner will succeed President Fox who can't run for reelection.
Needless to say, this election is important for Mexico and its inhabitants but it has also an undeniable impact in the rest of the continent. Two main issues among many others:
-The winner will have to deal with the illegal immigration crisis in the USA. A friendly prez to the USA in Los Pinos (Mexican WH) would help to find a partner to stop the traffic of human beings and drugs along our common border.
- If the left wins, the Chavez-Castro-Morales axis of populism will get a new and powerful ally, just at the south of the USA.
Three candidates are running, but only two have a real shot of winning this Sunday:
Felipe Calderon Hinojosa of the conservative PAN. This young, Harvard educated lawyer supports the current economic model: free markets and a business-friendly government. Nonetheless, he wants to go further with the social programs that are helping the poor and the uneducated. He's a social conservative (Catholic), but he has expressed support for sex education at school, reproductive rights (excluding abortion) and the end of any kind of discrimination toward gays and other minorities.
Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador of the leftist PRD. This former mayor of Mexico City is hugely popular in this city and most of the poorest parts of the country (south). He wants to put the poor first, thus changing the economic model. He supports social programs that give monthly stipends to the elders, single mothers and so on. He is famous for the upper levels built in the most important freeways across the city (los segundos pisos). He has a liberal position in social issues, but he has not been clear enough about his position in topics such as abortion and legal gay unions (sociedades de convivencia).
JoseMEX From Mexico, joined Oct 1999, 1539 posts, RR: 29 Reply 2, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 3300 times:
Those of us old enough to remember the Echeverria and Lopez Portillo years have a very clear idea of who we're going to vote for. It's a shame many of the younger voters have no idea what it was like during those years, and the long way we have come since then.
AM744 From Mexico, joined Jun 2001, 1688 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 3297 times:
Quoting SFOMEX (Thread starter): - If the left wins, the Chavez-Castro-Morales ax of populism will get a new and powerful ally, just at the south of the USA.
Morales is NOT in the same league as Chavez and Castro and López Obrador certainly isn't either. Morales nor López are nor were militars. Morales is not a dictator and López Obrador won't be one, should he win. I wonder why people keep comparing them ??? Is Lula also part of that perceived axis? lol
More political power to the same people that hold economic power (look at the US) doesn't sound good. There must be some kind of balance.
AM744 From Mexico, joined Jun 2001, 1688 posts, RR: 0 Reply 6, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 3285 times:
Quoting JoseMEX (Reply 2): Those of us old enough to remember the Echeverria and Lopez Portillo years have a very clear idea of who we're going to vote for.
De la Madrid(biggest inflation EVER, different economic model that López Portillo) and specially Salinas were no better. (Except if you are their buddy and can sell you a huge state enterprise or bank for peanuts in a completely corrupt fashion). Under those two governmets the peso lost 1000 times!!! it's value as all of you know. Admitedly Lopez Portillo started all, but good ol' Salinas left Zedillo with a huge package that took the then "new" peso from $3 per dollar to $8 or $9. Aviation enthusiast that we are, know that that crisis put a halt to our airlines from which only today, 10 years later, they seem to be recovering of, along with the rest of the country. Also, the huge narco problems we are deling with today, were not tackled, to say the least, since Salinas.
All this are just historical observations unrelated to the thread. I don't believe any of the runners (save for one) is as low as some of the presidents previously mentioned.
It's not the system. It's HONESTY and ETHICS that matters. Any corrupt system will fail, even capitalism.
SR117 From Mexico, joined Jun 2000, 745 posts, RR: 1 Reply 10, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 3249 times:
Quoting AM744 (Reply 6):
It's not the system. It's HONESTY and ETHICS that matters. Any corrupt system will fail, even capitalism.
While corruption can of course be a corrosive influence in any system, the system itself matters a lot. Running a country is a complicated matter and as such is it not just a matter of good intentions and pure feelings(If it was so, running a developed country with little corruption would be a walk in the park). The cause of the crisis of 94 was not that Salinas was a corrupt sleazeball, but because of mistakes in policy.
The re-election matter is ridiculous at this point, it is the same case with the re-election members of congress and legislature, we should be able to re-elect somebody if we think they are doing a good job, it would make some congresspeople actually care about their job. Of course it is also a sad truth that in many rural places where the winds of change have not yet blown, this could breed de-facto mini dictatorships at the hands of certain people, but that would be solely the responsibility of the people living under such a dictatorship to change things, and modern institutions do give that chance I think.
There's a lot of changes that need to be made in order to make things run better in this country and whoever wins is gonna need to be a very good negotiator to make things happen, given the fragmented legislature and tight budget he will receive.
Personally, the thought of 6 years of Peje makes me want to vomit, while Calderon is not perfect, I think he has the right idea, and most important for me, he seems to be capable of bringing people together to bring about much needed reform, and is not as a divisive figure as Peje(his religious like following is quite scary, they see no fault in their god), or an unscrupulous backstabbing weasel like Madrazo.
This would be the ideal situation if the majority of the Mexican populace had had good access to education and were able to analyze things from an educated level. Most, if not all of you, were sent to good schools by your parents, and therefore have somewhat of a regular stability and the capacity to analyze what is the best path for the country to take. Yet the sad truth is that this is not the case with the majority of the population and the reason why Lopez Obrador can easily be the winner because he is directly speaking to all of those people who have been left out by the system. Since everyone else brags about doing it, but conveniently forgets to do anything when it comes down to getting their hands dirty!
I don't think he's as bad as he has been made out to be. In my point of view he has many good ideas, but, unfortunately he has a lot of bad ones too, yet he has the backing of his people, something that I have not noticed as much from the rest of the candidates. The guy has POWER!, but what I just don't see him capable of doing is being able to speak in good terms with congress, which is going to leave the country in a never ending standstill. If Fox, wasn't able to do it, there's no way in hell that Obrador will able to do either. He's just way too confrontational (in bad way) and the senators are just too politically oriented to their own benefit to find common ground to make the right decision that are needed to move the country forward.
Quoting SR117 (Reply 10): While Calderon is not perfect, I think he has the right idea, and most important for me, he seems to be capable of bringing people together to bring about much needed reform, and is not as a divisive figure as Peje(his religious like following is quite scary, they see no fault in their god), or an unscrupulous backstabbing weasel like Madrazo
I couldn't have said it better! Come on people, sometimes we are our worst enemies! I just don't understand how a country as rich as Mexico can sometimes get into a destructive mindset that isn't letting the country move forward! You need to work together folks!
I also like you good comparison about Madrazo and an animal figure. In fact, there's a lot of animals in that party. Starting with this fat elephant:
I don't know what it is about her, but I can't stand her. She annoys the hell out of me when she gives her speeches. She talks so much, but in the end she doesn't say anything useful. She's typical material of the old Mexican political system which likes to say A LOT and do NOTHING! "Cantinflones" AND THEN...she puts on these typical Mexican outfits sometimes just to make a point that she's so proud of her "Mexican" heritage! It's so tacky! Who the hell does she think she is, the Mexican Queen Amidala?
Wishing that everything goes well, and that the best choice is made
LTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 12328 posts, RR: 12 Reply 15, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 3187 times:
Quoting SFOMEX (Thread starter): Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador of the leftist PRD. This former mayor of Mexico City is hugely popular in this city and most of the poorest parts of the country (south). He wants to put the poor first, thus changing the economic model
This man was re-elected with 80% of the vote for Mayor of Mexico City. He continued to live in his modest apartment instead of living with the rich in gated neighborhood. He apparently made major efforts against corruption in his term as Mayor. Something has to be done to help the poorest in Mexico, so they can be employed with decent pay so that can reduce their needs to going to the USA. That may be the best way to deal with the immigration problem in the USA. If he wins, I hope he can deliver, although he may have a lot of problems getting past the business leaders that really rule the country.
Theredbaron From Mexico, joined Mar 2005, 1697 posts, RR: 4 Reply 16, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 3182 times:
Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 15): This man was re-elected with 80% of the vote for Mayor of Mexico City. He continued to live in his modest apartment instead of living with the rich in gated neighborhood. He apparently made major efforts against corruption in his term as Mayor. Something has to be done to help the poorest in Mexico, so they can be employed with decent pay so that can reduce their needs to going to the USA. That may be the best way to deal with the immigration problem in the USA. If he wins, I hope he can deliver, although he may have a lot of problems getting past the business leaders that really rule the country.
I will vote for Calderon for WAY TOO MANY REASONS but since ths previous post is so full of miss information I will address it and you will see why Ill vote for Calderon.
The man was not reelected (reelection is forbidden in Mexico)
Lopez Obrador won the 2000 election by mere 3.9% of the vote, and a lot of the PRD party campaign was financed with illegal funds.
He liven in his moddest appartment and then he changed to another appartment in a nearby building where he had 2 appartments in adjacent floors so... modest does not apply. His sons are in foreign Universities and he pecieves a salary of just over $10700 USD$ a month
He said we would reduce the expenses of big salaries but he did not reduce his salary not his closest workers and frinds, by way of example Nicolas Mollinedo his Driver "chaffeur" earns US 6600 USD$ a Month !!! and just last week bought a spanking new Mustang Cobra for USD 44000...not bad for a driver dont ya think?
Corruption in Mexico city is even worse than before, thousands of illegal (pirate) taxis roam the city without any control, his 2 closest aides rene Bejarano was coaugh on tape and aired nationally recieving a payment of over 100 K Dollars for bribes and campaign "money" , his treasury secretary was taped at the Bellagio in LAS playing in the VIP "whale" area also aired nationally.....
Millions of pesos have disappeared in his public contracts and also a lot of contracts have been awarded to friends, allies and ghost companies.
If this thief wins, Mexico will suffer YET another economic collapse and believe me if you think Migration is a problem now, you aint seen nothin´ yet
FLY2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 17, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3165 times:
One thing that really bothers me is that a lot of people in the US support Peje. And some news agencies, specially AP, glorify Peje. Why the f**k is this I dunno. Somehow Peje's "darkside" doesn't seem to show itself overseas, or to uneducated people.
Quoting Theredbaron (Reply 16): If this thief wins, Mexico will suffer YET another economic collapse and believe me if you think Migration is a problem now, you aint seen nothin´ yet
AM744 From Mexico, joined Jun 2001, 1688 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3161 times:
You know what I'd like to see? The only thing that really matters:
El tan cacareado "Estado de Derecho". (Respect for the law)
Problem with our economy is that breaking the law ranges from extremely profitable (if you're in the upper percentile of the social scale and have ties with the government or big groups) to cheap (if you're an ambulante, taxista pirata or taquero pastorero). Being an honest citizen that actually produces something is extremely expensive.
Here's one for you clasemedieros:
We provided 52% of the whole ISR income. Enterprises, whether big or small accounted for the rest. That's completely abnormal. Yet another example of the crushing of the middle class. The one that really matters, those that actually produce. Bottom line is, in Mexico, if you do your homework you only get more. You are actually penalized for doing your job!!! No problem if you're El Divino, Lankenau or Jefe Diego nor if you're narco, kindnapper or illegal taxi driver. Extremely unfair and disheatening for the hard working citizen.
Well, there's my wishlist.
P.D. Only 12% of the PEA (Economically active population) pays taxes. (Me being one of them, and I'm sure most of you too). I'd like high bureacrats, ambulantes, etc.. payed as well... That would be it.
P.D.2. During Fox, high bureacracy (>$50,000 MXP per month, a slap in the face to most Mexicans, even professionals ) grew 62%, as if the government did a great job and we needed more administrators, that in fact, produce nothing. Do we really need a "Director de Contenidos de Internet" (Webmaster that is) in Comision Nacional del Agua? NOT.
Luisde8cd From Venezuela, joined Aug 2004, 2516 posts, RR: 34 Reply 19, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3157 times:
Quoting AM744 (Reply 3):
Morales is NOT in the same league as Chavez and Castro and Lï¿½pez Obrador certainly isn't either. Morales nor Lï¿½pez are nor were militars. Morales is not a dictator and Lï¿½pez Obrador won't be one, should he win. I wonder why people keep comparing them ??? Is Lula also part of that perceived axis? lol
LOL at you for being so naive. When Chavez first ran for election in 1998, everyone here was tired of the same politicians that had ruled the country since 1959, so they saw Chavez as someone who could bring hope in a country plaged with corruption and poverty. Chavez won because he got strong support from the middle class who were tired of living under constant devaluation, inflation, corruption, crime and bureocracy. He never mentioned that he wanted to establish Socialism in the country. But 7 years later after he was consolidated in power, overtook control of every branch of goverment (Supreme Court, Electoral Council, Congress, Attourney's Office), he said he was going to follow Cuba's model and put Venezuela in the path toward the "21st century socialism". So my advice to you and others who are going to vote for AMLO is: "Mejor malo conocido que bueno por conocer".
Quoting SFOMEX (Reply 11):
Lopez and Morales have the same ideas about the economy than Chavez. They want to "help" the poor even if their politics sink their countries. Just look at Venezuela my friend!
Exactly, look at my country. Thanks to Chavez's policy my family has had to emigrate and guess where to? Mexico! Yes... my family is living in Mexico. Living in Venezuela nowdays is a complete nightmare, you never know if you will return home at night after a day of work, because kidnappings, robberies and murders are growing at a rate faster than Colombia!. We have more dead each week here in Venezuela than the dead in Iraq! How can that be possible? It's simple... poverty levels are astronomical, something we had never seen and the people running the goverment (police forces) are thugs and criminals freed from jail thanks to almight Chavez.
Vamos Calderon! Por un Mexico prospero, estable y en constante crecimiento!
Saludos desde Caracas,
Viasa we miss you!. Good times will return after Chavez is gone!
LTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 51 Reply 20, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3156 times:
If I was Mexican and eligible to vote, I'd gladly choose Felipe Calderón over López Obrador. The last thing Mexico needs is a populist who can be seen as a potential supporter for Hugo Chávez. Mexico needs a leader who can keep stability and continue cooperation with other Latin American countries and the United States.
Let's hope this winning streak of common sense will continue. First, Alan García won over populist Ollanta Humala in Peru, and now Mexico needs to defeat their own populist candidate (and potential Chávez supporter).
AM744 From Mexico, joined Jun 2001, 1688 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 3147 times:
Quoting Luisde8cd (Reply 19): LOL at you for being so naive. When Chavez first ran for election in 1998, everyone here was tired of the same politicians that had ruled the country since 1959, so they saw Chavez as someone who could bring hope in a country plaged with corruption and poverty.
Last militar president in Mexico ruled in the 50's. Sorry, but we are not Venezuela and it shows. López Obrador is not a militar, no comparison point whatsoever. And I'm not a leftie. I just don't buy the s**t that is repeated over and over again by the media. PG is NOT Chavez... don't believe the BS you see in TV. With all due respect, read some history from credible sources.
Quoting LTU932 (Reply 20): Mexico needs a leader who can keep stability and continue cooperation with other Latin American countries and the United States.
You mean like the president that discredited our previously prestiged Diplomatic Service screwing our foreing relations with everyone in Latin America, including Nestor Kirchner?
Quoting LTU932 (Reply 20): If I was Mexican and eligible to vote, I'd gladly choose Felipe Calderón over López Obrador. The last thing Mexico needs is a populist who can be seen as a potential supporter for Hugo Chávez.
That is a far-fetched conspiration theory. If anything Hugo Chavez would support Lopez Obrador, not the other way around, should it be of any use to him. I personally don't like Chavez, and I also don't think López Obrador is like him, if you check their "resumes" there are fundamental differences. The man is a democrat, please don't compare him with the South American dictator. We have been through that, 100 years ago... We are well past that point.
I was born and raised in Mexico City. My family has lived here for generations (more than five that is) and I tell you, give me López Obrador over Oscar Espinoza Villareal anyday. You know who is him don't you? Thought so. Peje is no angel, nor Calderon, it's just that he's been demonized and intelligent and educated people are buying it, no questions asked. The media being the 4th power is a gross understatement in this case.
May the best win. Wheter Peje or Calderón win we will be fine... I'm convinced of that.
AM744 From Mexico, joined Jun 2001, 1688 posts, RR: 0 Reply 23, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 3141 times:
Quoting Theredbaron (Reply 16): He said we would reduce the expenses of big salaries but he did not reduce his salary not his closest workers and frinds, by way of example Nicolas Mollinedo his Driver "chaffeur" earns US 6600 USD$ a Month !!! and just last week bought a spanking new Mustang Cobra for USD 44000...not bad for a driver dont ya think?
Bad enough, but Calderon has inlaws doing big bucks via government contracts, he lend himself money while directing Banobras. Fox has a wife and step-sons who are now new millionaires. Nice FAMILY bussiness. A Mustang Cobra is peanuts compared to the properties handed over by Fobraproa to the Bibriescas, just to name an example. Yes, corruption is by no means exclusive of any political group. Let's apply the same measure to all, shall we? We need to get rid of that, ANY color it happens to be.
Don't take me wrong guys, I'm just playing devil's advocate here.
SFOMEX From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 24, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 3140 times:
An interesting fact about Lopez Obrador (el Peje). It seems that Mr. Obrador does not have a valid passport! In fact, many sources inform that he has never traveled outside Mexico, although other sources affirm that he went to Cuba for his honeymoon. In any case, he never left the country during the last six years he was Mayor of Mexico City.
Of course, plenty of Mexicans are in a similar situation and it's nothing wrong with never going outside your nation, not even for leisure. Yet, I find odd that somebody running for president has never been interested in knowing other places, cultures and people.
The closest case I could think of is in America, where it's been said that the most conservative Republican congressmen pride themselves in the fact they don't have a passport.
25 SFOMEX: Rather you are playing PEJE's advocate here... LOL. Cheers!
26 Ghost77: Another interesting fact is that his true name is Manuel Andrés López Obrador - MALO. He changed it. Another interesting fact.. he has killed two p
27 KLM685: First of all, great topic for Mexicans, a great way to know each other's opinions and respect everyone's choices for elections tomorrow. Tomorrow is n
28 LTU932: Is that why he changed his name, just because of the initials? Whom do you mean? The fact you went through a dictatorship 100 years ago (if that's wh
29 Fly727: What a very special day! I feel proud and happy for the great participation in the process... It's just past 10am, already voted (second in line) and
30 KLM685: I know, I totally feel the same! I was up at 7:50, walked half a block and got in line. I was as well one of the first 10 to vote! Whan an amazing an
31 Luisde8cd: With all due respect, I still think you are very naive. We can agree that right now we don't know if he will become EXACTLY a Chavez II, but is it wo
32 SFOMEX: Last results! Calderon:12 SFOMEX Captaink Josemex FLY2HMO Fly727 SR117 Latinplane Theredbaron Luisde8cd LTU932 Ghost77 KLM685 Peje:2 AM744 LTBEWR It l
33 Luisde8cd: Yeah, have him hit the middle class so that they will have to flee the country and close their businesses, thus poor mexicans losing jobs.... that wi
34 AM744: It is a highly respectful adjective. I am one. Most of us here in a.net are. We PRODUCE and pay taxes. I love capitalism, I just don't like family bu
35 FLY2HMO: Thats exactly what Fox said right before 2000 elections. That phrase always comes to mind when I hear people bitching about Fox's administration. Am
36 Ghost77: Nope! I also remember this, more over, Zedillo said it recently in its multiple conferences... you can't change Mexico in only 06 years... thus Fox w
37 Fly727: Any good, reliable on-line source of info? Please do not put El Norte or Reforma, as I don't have a subscription! RM
38 SFOMEX: www.eluniversal.com.mx www.cronica.com.mx Now, I'm trying to find sources with inside info about the exit polls. It's a fact that the tv networks wil
39 FLY2HMO: I don't think exit polls are to reliable. But the IFE website says they won't release anything until after 2300 Mex time. They are obviously the only
40 LTU932: You know Luis, that's exactly what my mother thought when here in Costa Rica, she voted for Oscar Arias instead of the populist Ottón Solís. Bottom
41 Halls120: Were those efforts successful? According to the following post, apparently not. Well, of course they do. The press can always be counted on to swoon
42 Latinplane: This is amazing folks! Everyone is reporting that all expectations of voter turnover will be greatly surpased. It is now for sure expected that more t
43 Latinplane: Geez, your mom must fully agree with my statements. LatinPlane
44 SFOMEX: Too close to call!!!!! TV network's exit polls can't define who wins this election. A long, long night ahead of us.
45 SFOMEX: A good link to follow the election: www.eluniversal.com.mx (Spanish) We'll have to wait three more hours to get an official result from the IFE.
46 FLY2HMO: I can't get into IFE's website, looks like its down at this moment. We will surely have a night full of suspense!!!
47 SFOMEX: Try one of the mirrors! www.eluniversal.com.mx www.reforma.com www.milenio.com Look for the links to the PREP.
48 Ghost77: Try THIS!!! http://elecciones.reforma.com/prep2006/default.htm So far so good... it's looking good!!! ghooost77 APM
49 MD11junkie: First of all, KLM685, great post. I salute you, and it's great to share chats with you. If I were Mexican, I'd surely vote for Calderón. But the only
50 KLM685: Great news mijo! Everyone in my house is so tense right now. No one actually knows what to think Reforma, gives it to Calderón Televisa, no comments
51 Edelag: My house is also like that. Let's just see whom is the best man the people of Mexico think is best for Mexico. If I could vote I would have voted for
52 Fly727: Reforma as all the other media authorized by IFE on its website through the Programa de Resultados Electorales Preliminares is only relaying the info
53 KLM685: Yes I agree, that's why I made the comment, sorry not for clarifying. What I meant was that Reforma's poll showing IFE's result is very different fro
54 SFOMEX: www.cronica.com.mx Very good news!!!! Check it out.
55 NWA742: Even though it's late, I'll put in a vote for Calderon, considering the above description. -NWA742[Edited 2006-07-03 05:15:53]
56 Ghost77: Fu*k!!! Check out Reforma... IT AIN'T LOOKING GOOD!!! ghooost77 APM
57 JoseMEX: Look at 4 different poll results here: http://www.eleconomista.com.mx/
58 LTU932: Oh no, Calderón's lead has been shrinking by almost 2 points. It does not look good at all!
59 Latinplane: I think they'll ask for two more hours. Although, initial IFE reports state that Calderon is winning by almost 3 percentage points, the race is too cl
60 FLY2HMO: The conteo rapido results will be out in a few minutes!!! Less than 20% of the ballots have been counted so far, so there still is hope!
61 SR117: It really hasn't shrunk, it's been around 3ish or so points the entire time. The positive thing I see in this is that there IS a lead at least and it
62 KLM685: Damn! I hate the music pre Luis Carlos Ugalde... It makes it look as it is all happy and without stress! I don't know why he's repeating the same thin
63 LTU932: It's official: Due to the very close gap between the two, it's too close to call.
64 FLY2HMO: Latest news: results are so close they are within the margin of error and therefore not reliable!
65 JoseMEX: Sh*t!!!!! Too close to call!!!!!! No results until next week!!!!! Wonder what the stock market's reaction will be.[Edited 2006-07-03 06:07:01]
66 FLY2HMO: OMG I can't wait till wednesday!!! I'm going to have to visit a shrink!!! I can't take so much suspense!!
67 SR117: Well we may not have an official result. But the preliminary booth by booth results should yield a clear result before that official result, at least
68 Latinplane: OMG! This is bad news. This was the least expected choice that analyst had expected. No official news until Wednesday. LatinPlane
69 Fly727: Thanks for the link. As long as the trend and lead on the official numbers doesn't change.... Sad day for us who voted for Dr. Simi though. RM
70 SFOMEX: My goodness, I saw this movie before!!!! USA 2000 presidential election anyone? We will have to wait until this Wednesday!!!!
71 Fly727: Where is Mario Aburto when you need him the most! Darn! RM
72 JoseMEX: So, folks, let's get ready for all the demonstrations, "plantones", etc. AMLO's buddies will very likely be organizing.
73 JoseMEX: THIS GUY'S AN *SSHOLE!!!!! WHAT WE WERE ALL EXPECTING!!!! HE'S SAYING HE WON!!!! THIS IS TERRIBLE!!!! HE'S ACTUALLY SAYING HE WON!!!!! OMG!!!!!!![Edit
74 FLY2HMO: They are already from what I've been told. I heard Peje is going to the Zocalo and he's saying he's 50000 votes in the lead. I hope it wont get ugly.
75 Latinplane: Why is AMLO stating that according to his numbers he is winning by almost 500,000 ahead, when clearly IFE is stating that only their numbers are offic
76 SR117: Well apparently it's not quite as difficult... While the official result shall be presented until Wednesday because it is when they will physically re