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Floyd Landis: Back From The Dead.  
User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (8 years 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1618 times:

Kicked some ass out on the time trials today...just about a sure thing to take the whole enchilada if nothing happens tomorrow.

This from a man who needs a hip replacement.

18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineQueso From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1612 times:

I'm happy to see another American win it, but let's face it- it certainly hasn't been a "dominating" performance. He's just lucky that today was the last (real) stage.

User currently offlineEmbqa From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (8 years 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1599 times:

Quoting Dougloid (Thread starter):
just about a sure thing to take the whole enchilada if nothing happens tomorrow

Tour tradition is to take an easy ride back into Paris on the last day and not challenge the leader. Unless the team bus breaks down, no one has a spare bike and he gets a flat every two miles and they run out of spare tires..... Floyd Landis has it won



"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1577 times:

Quoting Queso (Reply 1):
I'm happy to see another American win it, but let's face it- it certainly hasn't been a "dominating" performance. He's just lucky that today was the last (real) stage.

Oh, I don't know about that. Once he got his head screwed back on, dumped the special yellow bike they flew in for him, and the guys really started working together, he did quite well in the alps-I do not think another stage would have hurt him. It's quite clear they had a good idea of what the team was capable of, and the Phonak boys did a good job breaking the stage open yesterday. And don't forget it was Axel Mercx who dragged Floyd across the line when it looked like he was going to quit like Boonen did.

The lack of a dominating maestro is worth noting, but what would you rather see? A three week race in which you know who's likely to win on day 1, or some real competition from a bunch of guys who finally have a shot at all the marbles?

I'm pretty sure that the Euros are getting annoyed with all these pesky Americans beating them on their home turf. Just when they thought they were done with Lance....remains to be seen what will happen to Floyd when he has his hip joint redone.


User currently offlineQueso From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (8 years 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1570 times:

Quoting Dougloid (Reply 3):
The lack of a dominating maestro is worth noting, but what would you rather see? A three week race in which you know who's likely to win on day 1, or some real competition from a bunch of guys who finally have a shot at all the marbles?

A three week race in which you know who's likely to win on day 1. The only reason Landis won this one is because Lance was not in it this year. This race would have been a cakewalk for Armstrong and I'll bet he's kicking himself for not sticking out one more year.

Quoting Dougloid (Reply 3):
Just when they thought they were done with Lance....remains to be seen what will happen to Floyd when he has his hip joint redone.

I'll agree with you on that one. I'm just not sure if he really has "the fire in his belly" to win it with Basso, Vino, and some of the others presumably returning next year.

On another note, I figure Ullrich's career is finished. This year was his last, best chance to win Le Tour. He's getting older and T-Mobile has dumped him and Rudy Pevenage and I don't think any other teams would want to dump their #1's right now in favor of Ullrich. His best hope would be to get picked up by some team that wanted to use him as a decoy in the mountains to launch a false attack and wear down the other team's riders prematurely so that the real #1 on the team could go on the "real" attack.

Vino is a helluva rider and I think next years' Tour will belong to him. He's incredibly strong, but he's a maverick. If he can learn to be a team leader and work with his team under a Director Sportif that could use some good tactics, he'd be very difficult to beat. I wish Discovery could pick him up since they are without a team captain now! He'd be a good fit on the team talent-wise but I'm not sure how the rest of the team would get along with him.


User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (8 years 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 1552 times:

Quoting Queso (Reply 4):
Vino is a helluva rider and I think next years' Tour will belong to him. He's incredibly strong, but he's a maverick. If he can learn to be a team leader and work with his team under a Director Sportif that could use some good tactics, he'd be very difficult to beat. I wish Discovery could pick him up since they are without a team captain now! He'd be a good fit on the team talent-wise but I'm not sure how the rest of the team would get along with him.

He is one helluva loose cannon, isn't he?

I really like watching the courage of the guys like Kessler and Dessel who crash, drag themselves back onto the road and off they go...

I was really suprised that Boonen quit in the middle of a stage....what was that all about?

I haven't bothered to do a comparison timewise against last year's tour but this one was pretty fast I think.


User currently offlineHalls120 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 6 hours ago) and read 1524 times:

Quoting Queso (Reply 4):
A three week race in which you know who's likely to win on day 1. The only reason Landis won this one is because Lance was not in it this year. This race would have been a cakewalk for Armstrong and I'll bet he's kicking himself for not sticking out one more year.

I'm not so sure. Did you see Lance host the ESPY awards a few weeks ago? I think he's pretty da*n tired of all the accusations in the French media.


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 7, posted (8 years 6 hours ago) and read 1520 times:
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Quoting Queso (Reply 1):
He's just lucky

Absolute crap. Although luck plays a part in a tour victory, it is far overshadowed by skill and tactics.

Quoting Dougloid (Reply 3):
remains to be seen what will happen to Floyd when he has his hip joint redone.

Think it'll be carbon or ti?  Wink

Quoting Queso (Reply 4):
The only reason Landis won this one is because Lance was not in it this year.

Oh, I see. Clearly, then, he isn't deserving of any respect for his achievement.  sarcastic 




2H4





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User currently offlineQueso From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (8 years 5 hours ago) and read 1511 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 7):
Quoting Queso (Reply 1):
He's just lucky

Absolute crap. Although luck plays a part in a tour victory, it is far overshadowed by skill and tactics.

It didn't take much still and tactics to beat Der Kaiser, Vino, Basso, or Tyler Hamilton this year.



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 7):
Oh, I see. Clearly, then, he isn't deserving of any respect for his achievement.

I never said that, did I?


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 9, posted (8 years 5 hours ago) and read 1503 times:
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Quoting Queso (Reply 8):
It didn't take much still and tactics to beat Der Kaiser, Vino, Basso, or Tyler Hamilton this year.

So what's your point? So far, you've only discounted his achievement. Are you of the opinion that he is deserving of less respect or recognition than he's currently receiving? Because that's how you're coming across.




2H4





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User currently offlineQueso From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (8 years 5 hours ago) and read 1497 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 9):
So what's your point? So far, you've only discounted his achievement. Are you of the opinion that he is deserving of less respect or recognition than he's currently receiving?

My point is that this year's field of contenders was "watered down" and Landis didn't have to face some of the strong contenders that he might otherwise would have.

Look, I've really got nothing against Landis, he's a damned fine rider and should be commended for his accomplishment. The Tour is, in my own opinion, one of the greatest athletic challenges and to win it is something special. But I think the jury's still out on whether he is the man when it comes to two-wheeled human powered machines.


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 11, posted (8 years 4 hours ago) and read 1492 times:
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Quoting Queso (Reply 10):
But I think the jury's still out on whether he is the man when it comes to two-wheeled human powered machines.

Well, and that's just it....that claim isn't even being made.




2H4





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User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 4 hours ago) and read 1484 times:

Quoting Queso (Reply 10):
My point is that this year's field of contenders was "watered down" and Landis didn't have to face some of the strong contenders that he might otherwise would have.

Well, that's because some of those top contenders 'tipped the can' as they say in AA fuel drag racing, when someone's gone deep into the nitromethane, which leads one to wonder whether they could compete runing on regular gasoline in a field of ordinary mortals. Give him credit for running a clean race with Phonak, not one of the greatest teams around and pulling it off against tall odds. And give credit to Axel Mercx for dragging him across the finish line in stage 16 when he cracked.

About the replacement? No doubt it'll be titanium. It's a wonder metal that seem perfectly happy inside the human body. It'll be something to see if he can come back off hip replacement. Let's see if he is in the Tour of California. Anyway, he could retire but I don't think he's through. Not Floyd.

Bo Jackson had the same thing and I do not think he played pro ball again, but pro cyclists of the caliber that get invited to the tour are in a class by themselves.


User currently offlineLemmy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 258 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 3 hours ago) and read 1464 times:

Quoting Queso (Reply 10):
My point is that this year's field of contenders was "watered down" and Landis didn't have to face some of the strong contenders that he might otherwise would have.

If a "watered down" field gets you the kind of Tour we got to watch this year, I hope it happens every year. What a race.

We could compare Floyd to Basso, Ullrich, Armstrong, etc. all day long. But the fact remains that not only did Floyd win this year, but he won after one of the gutsiest rides ever in Tour history. As a fan of the sport, that's just plain old good stuff.

After a while, all the "what if" arguments about who would have won if everyone were racing start to sound like dorky "Aquaman versus the Terminator" hypotheticals. The fact is that Landis won the race he showed up to, and he did it in style. You can't ask for much more than that.



I am a patient boy ...
User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 14, posted (8 years 2 hours ago) and read 1460 times:
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DATABASE EDITOR




Quoting Lemmy (Reply 13):
After a while, all the "what if" arguments about who would have won if everyone were racing start to sound like dorky "Aquaman versus the Terminator" hypotheticals.

Exactly. And every "what if" argument against Floyd can be countered by yet another "what if" argument against the ensuing hypothetical winner....putting Floyd back in yellow. It's a mindless cycle (no pun intended).

The fact is, Floyd won the 2006 Tour de France. Whether Lance, Jan, Ivan, Chuck Norris, Snoopy, or anyone else could or might have changed the outcome is absolutely, positively irrevelent.




2H4


I think we all know damn well what the Chuck Norris outcome would be, though...





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User currently offlineLemmy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 258 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 2 hours ago) and read 1456 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 14):

I think we all know damn well what the Chuck Norris outcome would be, though...

Totally goes without saying. Chuck Norris would have both hips replaced with rocks and barbed wire, and then roundhouse kick his way straight to Paris.



I am a patient boy ...
User currently offlineFumanchewd From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (8 years ago) and read 1448 times:

Quoting Lemmy (Reply 13):
If a "watered down" field gets you the kind of Tour we got to watch this year, I hope it happens every year. What a race.

Ding Ding!
 checkmark 

All that matters is that a day after falling apart everyone, including myself, thought that he was done. He had the courage and audacity to go all out for the finish. The other teams were blown away. Sure, they could have tried to chase him down, but they would never have gotten within 4 minutes of him. They pussied out and thought that noone could maintain his pace and not blow-up on the last climb. Well, he did. He won with his skills and courage. No matter what all of the cynics say about this year's drug scandal, it was a great tour.

Congrats Floyd!


User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (7 years 12 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 1427 times:

Quoting Fumanchewd (Reply 16):
All that matters is that a day after falling apart everyone, including myself, thought that he was done. He had the courage and audacity to go all out for the finish. The other teams were blown away. Sure, they could have tried to chase him down, but they would never have gotten within 4 minutes of him. They pussied out and thought that noone could maintain his pace and not blow-up on the last climb. Well, he did. He won with his skills and courage. No matter what all of the cynics say about this year's drug scandal, it was a great tour.

Absolutely....one of the most interesting things here seems to be the slow reactions of the other teams. Bob Roll said they had their foot planted on Landis' neck but they took it off. They all figured he was done for and was just trying to salvage a little dignity. By the time they figured out "Hey! These fuckers means business" it was too damned late.

You know.....you know....could it have all been an Ali-style 'rope a dope'? That's where a fighter lays on the ropes, makes it look like he's finished, lets the other dude wear himself out and then, *whammo*!

I mean, could the entire affair have been engineered by Landis, the team manager, and the Phonak boys, pulling off the cycling stroke job of all time? Make it look like he's crashing, let some chumps go out in front, think they're doing great, get well out of the spotlight and then cold cock the entire crew like Murph the Surf making off with the lady's jewelry?

Now THAT would be a story.

It is a little far fetched, but for you fans of conspiracy theories this'll keep you going on those cold winter nights around the kitchen table.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rope-a-dope


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 60
Reply 18, posted (7 years 12 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 1421 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
DATABASE EDITOR




Quoting Dougloid (Reply 17):
It is a little far fetched

Perhaps not that far-fetched, though. Lance pretend-bonked back in one of his earlier tours. At the same time, though, losing eight(!) minutes would be one hell of a gamble....




2H4





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