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Bush Says He Would Send Troops To Pakistan For OBL  
User currently offlineBushpilot From South Africa, joined Jul 2007, 0 posts, RR: 1
Posted (8 years 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2751 times:

Well this is an interesting turn of events if you ask me. Despite Pakistan saying that would/will not allow US troops to operate within thier borders, Bush said if there was solid intelligence on OBLs location in Pakistan, Bush Said: "we would take the action necessary to bring him to justice."

But Pakistan's president, Gen. Pervez Musharraf, told reporters Wednesday at the United Nations that his government would oppose any U.S. action in its territory.
"We wouldn't like to allow that at all. We will do it ourselves," he said

I have long bashed Bush for his lack of getting OBL, I wonder if this will help, and what would be the possible backlash from A. the international community, and more importantly..B. the Pakistani people. Your thoughts?


http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/09/20/bush.intv/index.html

39 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 1, posted (8 years 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2751 times:

We shouldn't send troops in without permission, but this quote:

Quoting Bushpilot (Thread starter):
We will do it ourselves

is hysterical at best, lying at worst.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined exactly 13 years ago today! , 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (8 years 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2726 times:

Quoting Bushpilot (Thread starter):
Despite Pakistan saying that would/will not allow US troops to operate within thier borders,

Yeah right  Yeah sure
When the puppet master demands something the puppet gives it to him. Until that changes there will be no 'need for democracy' in Pakistan. Unless Busharraf is ousted somehow and then... I hope things turn out fine. Unless the US pushes it too much, my understanding (though I haven't been to Pakistan in about 4 years) is that Pakistanis have had enough, if pushed too much, remember what happened to the Shah in Iran.

BTW Pakistan has (especially now) a huge (both print and tv) media which is very independent and its a joke when they say US has no presence in Pakistan, other than the military there are dozens of cases of CIA operative in some cases operating independently doing just about all they want. I wouldn't be surprised of secret prisons in Pakistan operated by the US with no constraints put by Pakistan.


User currently offlineGilligan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2716 times:

An earlier article also stated that Pakistan has made peace with the taliban type tribals in the region where OBL is thought to be hiding. Supposdedly, according to the Pakistani President, this does not include immunity for OBL but given that the Pakistani army no longer patrols the region it is immunity by any other name. I agree with the President, if solid, incontrivertible evidence surfaced as to his whereabouts, a snatch an grab would be on order for the day.

User currently offlineAirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (8 years 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2712 times:

Quoting Bushpilot (Thread starter):
"we would take the action necessary to bring him to justice."

Didn't Bush once say OBL doesn't matter anymore?


User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (8 years 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2712 times:

Quoting Bushpilot (Thread starter):
Bush said if there was solid intelligence on OBLs location in Pakistan, Bush Said: "we would take the action necessary to bring him to justice."

I'd be behind him 100%, but he damn well better make sure the intel isn't as "good" as it was for Iraq.


User currently offlineNeilYYZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2707 times:

I think it'd be worth it to get the man. And I doubt that Pakistan would really oppose if it really came down to it and the intel was shown to be reliable.

User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21641 posts, RR: 55
Reply 7, posted (8 years 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2685 times:

Quoting Bushpilot (Thread starter):
But Pakistan's president, Gen. Pervez Musharraf, told reporters Wednesday at the United Nations that his government would oppose any U.S. action in its territory.
"We wouldn't like to allow that at all. We will do it ourselves," he said

Ok, fine. We'll hold you to that. If we find out where he is, we'll tell you. And then you'll have to go and get him. You get one shot. If you don't act, or act and fail, then we'll do what we have to do.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29800 posts, RR: 58
Reply 8, posted (8 years 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2685 times:

If he was going to do it, he would have (should have?) done it already.

Tell the truth I do hope there are some deep ops type operating in Pakistan.



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined exactly 13 years ago today! , 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 2658 times:

Quoting L-188 (Reply 8):
Tell the truth I do hope there are some deep ops type operating in Pakistan.

If Busharraf falls, you'll hear about them with proof, until then, don't say it out so loud.

Quoting Mir (Reply 7):
We'll hold you to that.

Apparently you are holding his hands making him do all the stuff, why arn't you happy?? It can only get worse from here.

Quoting NeilYYZ (Reply 6):
and the intel was shown to be reliable.



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 5):
better make sure the intel isn't as "good" as it was for Iraq.

And may I remind of the forgotten incident where the US had solid intel about Al Qaeda # 2 being in a border village on the Pakistan side. At the time Pakistan had more than 80000 troops in the region and: What the puppet master decided to do?? It decided it doesn't need the puppet for this one, went ahead with missiles/bombs, blowing a few homes killing dozens of innocent people in the process. Al Qaeda # 2 wasn't there at the time, maybe a few of them were killed as well and Pakistan said it wasn't given any intel in the area where it could have even caught them alive.

Quoting Gilligan (Reply 3):
An earlier article also stated that Pakistan has made peace with the taliban type tribals in the region where OBL is thought to be hiding.

And what did the US do in Afghanistan to oust the Taliban?? Made deals with the terrorist, wanted war criminal warlords and handed the entire country to them Kabul excluded, to put another puppet while the rest of the entire country grows poppy. I heard some where this time the poppy only in that country is more than 30% of the world demand. If only oil could be grown!!
And now we are hearing many of those warlords are actually funding the Taliban with the drug money.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21641 posts, RR: 55
Reply 10, posted (8 years 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 2648 times:

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 9):
Apparently you are holding his hands making him do all the stuff, why arn't you happy??

I'll tell you why I'm not happy. It's been five years since 9/11. Osama bin Laden is still roaming the world free.

I have no problem with Pakistan grabbing him. But if they can't, or if they won't, then I have no problem going in and doing the job that needs to be done.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineBravo45 From United States of America, joined exactly 13 years ago today! , 2165 posts, RR: 11
Reply 11, posted (8 years 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 2638 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 10):
I'll tell you why I'm not happy. It's been five years since 9/11. Osama bin Laden is still roaming the world free.

Maybe its because he wasn't chased properly. Somebody had to get Saddam...
When I look back to the time the US invaded Afghanistan, I see a lost opportunity. An opportunity that could have changed the world, when the entire world was in one mind and speaking with one voice. Imagine what could have been accomplished had Afghanistan was handled properly FROM THE BEGINNING, and I mean the begining of this conflict. The Afghans have been played with for far too long. I truly feel bad for them.

Quoting Mir (Reply 10):
I have no problem with Pakistan grabbing him. But if they can't, or if they won't, then I have no problem going in and doing the job that needs to be done.

That is not the issue, you seem to have chosen to ignore the context of my earlier posts. While I'm sitting on the east coast like you, I understand and agree from where you are comming from, but the context simply cannot be ignored.... its been ignored for far too long already.

[Edited 2006-09-21 07:56:42]

User currently offlineOly720man From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 6741 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (8 years 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 2611 times:

Isn't he dead already?

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/07/17/attack/main515468.shtml

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/osama_dead.html

http://www.welfarestate.com/binladen/funeral/

http://www.theage.com.au/news/nation...unts/2006/01/16/1137259968627.html



wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
User currently offlineItsjustme From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 2768 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (8 years 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2604 times:

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 11):
Maybe its because he wasn't chased properly.

Wasn't chased properly? He wasn't chased at all. Our "pursuit" of OBL in Afghanistan was nothing more than a Bush smoke screen. He had one objective all along and that was to get Saddam. Afghanistan was merely used to give the impression we were actively pursuing bin Laden.


User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31684 posts, RR: 56
Reply 14, posted (8 years 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2602 times:

The Terrain & the local support in the Tribal Areas will make capture very very Difficult for any Army.
Mushy will not be able to allow the US Troops into the NWFP unless theres a very good excuse.
regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (8 years 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 2576 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 10):
But if they can't, or if they won't, then I have no problem going in and doing the job that needs to be done.

Yeah, right. Like that's going to happen.

And I'm sure that this time, the Pakistanis will be throwing rose petals at the foots of US soldiers - much like the Iraqis did.

Besides, Pakistan has no reason to want OBL to be captured. As long as he's somewhere, Pakistan remains a "US Ally in the War Against Terror" (or whatever rubbish they call it now). If OBL is caught, Pakistan once again turns into the pariah state it was pre 9-11.


User currently offlineSlider From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6818 posts, RR: 34
Reply 16, posted (8 years 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2560 times:

Quoting Itsjustme (Reply 13):
Wasn't chased properly? He wasn't chased at all. Our "pursuit" of OBL in Afghanistan was nothing more than a Bush smoke screen.

I got news for you bubba- we have some presence in Pakistan already, and they have very much been tracking him for a long time.

We need to cut the head off the snake AND continue every other simultaneous measure of anti-terrorism efforts without cessation.

But yeah, we've got operators out there--and they don't really seem too concerned about national borders and such.


User currently offlineB777-700 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (8 years 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2553 times:

Just last week at his press conference Bush said he wouldn't do this because Pakistan was a sovereign nation...

I laughed then, because, well...so was Iraq. The only difference is, Pakistan actually has weapons of mass destruction.

And now he changes his story...When are we going to learn?  Yeah sure

Quoting AirCop (Reply 4):
Didn't Bush once say OBL doesn't matter anymore?

No, he said he's 'not concerned' with him. But the elections ARE coming up.  Wink

Quoting Mir (Reply 7):
Ok, fine. We'll hold you to that. If we find out where he is, we'll tell you. And then you'll have to go and get him. You get one shot. If you don't act, or act and fail, then we'll do what we have to do.

Exactly, that's the way it should be.

But, as I hope we're all aware, save the ones w/ their heads still up Bush's ass...This is all just talk for the elections, and nothing will come of it.


User currently offlineLH477 From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 584 posts, RR: 5
Reply 18, posted (8 years 3 days ago) and read 2546 times:

Musharraf is standing on one leg right now, to take any sort of Military action inside of Pakistand would be utterly stupid. As much as I dislike Mushaffar, he is necessary. If he was ousted, and his replacement is an Islamic hardliners, it would be very bad of India, the US, and many others. Pakistan for the timebeing needs a moderate (in the sense of Islamic values) dictator, and Musharraf is it.


Come on you gunners......!!!!!
User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (8 years 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 2523 times:

Quoting Slider (Reply 16):
I got news for you bubba- we have some presence in Pakistan already, and they have very much been tracking him for a long time.

But they're not military.

In fact, there have been endless complaints by US forces in Afghanistan how they are prohibited from crossing the border into Pakistan, and how while pursuing Taliban fighters, they are mandated to stop at the border even though they have the enemy within sight.


User currently offlineGilligan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (8 years 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 2517 times:

Quoting Bravo45 (Reply 9):
And what did the US do in Afghanistan to oust the Taliban??

Do you actually read the news or just make it up as you go along. Do you remember that littel thing they had called an "election" a while ago? The one where Afghani's turned out in record numbers to vote? Have you read where Afghan girls can now go to school and no longer have to be dressed head to toe in a burlap sack? They grow opium poppies because people, in part, in this country can't contain their weaknesses. If there was no demand there would not be any reason for the supply.


User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 21, posted (8 years 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 2514 times:

Quoting Bushpilot (Thread starter):
Well this is an interesting turn of events if you ask me. Despite Pakistan saying that would/will not allow US troops to operate within thier borders, Bush said if there was solid intelligence on OBLs location in Pakistan, Bush Said: "we would take the action necessary to bring him to justice."

-
Haven't US troops "chased" for OBL in the past already ? Weren't there statements like "he is to be caught ...." ? Haven't there been news about US-troops "in close pursuit" of him in the past ?
-
"solid intelligence" ? haven't we heard that before ? Whatever solid intelligence, I am still convinced that OBL, in spite of all such reports, is NOT in that region but in Western Europe.


User currently offlineGilligan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (8 years 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 2501 times:

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 21):
is NOT in that region but in Western Europe.

Perhaps France? It would make sense.


User currently offlineBushpilot From South Africa, joined Jul 2007, 0 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (8 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 2496 times:

Quoting Gilligan (Reply 3):
I agree with the President, if solid, incontrivertible evidence surfaced as to his whereabouts, a snatch an grab would be on order for the day.

Yeah but we have been down this road before, and seen it fail miserably. I want OBL just as much as the next guy, if we catch him alive I think he should have to run the gauntlet through a Manhattan firehall, if he manages to climb the firepole while the firefighers hit him with pool balls in tube socks he is fre to walk. I think he deserves the worse sharia law has to offer.

Quoting AirCop (Reply 4):
Didn't Bush once say OBL doesn't matter anymore?

He did say that, it was shortly before the Iraq invasion, he said he really doesnt think about OBL that much and that he has been marginalized and is ineffective.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 5):
I'd be behind him 100%, but he damn well better make sure the intel isn't as "good" as it was for Iraq.

I agree Falcon, if we know 1000percent he is there, then lets do it, but my biggest problem with Bush is that I simply cannot trust him. There was a period in my life where I thought I could trust the PotUS(whoever it was) to make the right decision, but GWB has turned me into a cynic about our executive branch. I dont trust anything I listen to from him, and only half of the actions I see him take.

Quoting L-188 (Reply 8):
If he was going to do it, he would have (should have?) done it already.

I see this once again as an all talk no action sort of thing by GWB. If someone was going to turn him in, it would have been done already. There is a $50mUSD reward for him, whoever is close with him is very very loyal. Because most of us would turn in our mothers for that sort of cash, I wouldnt turn in mom, but all of my cousins except one.

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 14):
Mushy will not be able to allow the US Troops into the NWFP unless theres a very good excuse.
regds

Hawk, could you envision a scenario where this might actually happen?

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 21):
I am still convinced that OBL, in spite of all such reports, is NOT in that region but in Western Europe.

Hmmm intesting, any reasoning for this? I am quite curious as to this theory.


User currently offlineFDXMECH From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3251 posts, RR: 34
Reply 24, posted (8 years 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 2473 times:

This is an example of the media trying to generate its own news. I happened to catch that interview of Blitzer interviewing the president. Blitzer posed the question in such a way that either way, it'd generate a controversy. If he said "no" he go through Pakastani government channels: BUZZ Wrong answer. But he said he'd go directly after him: BUZZ Wrong answer. The question shouldn't have been asked or the president shouldn't have answered it.


You're only as good as your last departure.
25 ME AVN FAN : Paris, Marseille, Nice, Geneva, Zurich, Milan, London Reasoning yes, but admittedly ABSOLUTY NO proof or evidence or anything. It may be remembered t
26 Bushpilot : Thanks for the response, I admittedly had not thought of several of those tidbits of info. I was aware of the exsisting medical conditions etc, but d
27 ME AVN FAN : forget the false beard. If in Paddington/Bayswater/Queensway or GloucesterRoad/WestKensington in London, or in the Quartier Montmartre in Paris, he c
28 Gilligan : But this would not be going in with the intent of toppling a government. This would be a covert snatch and grab. Very few troops, no one staying behi
29 Bushpilot : I am not talking about toppling a government, that would be an unthinkable approach, the evidence of Pakistan actually having WMDs is definate, we do
30 Post contains images Bravo45 : NO need for ANYONE outside Pakistan to *decide* what kind of govt they need.
31 Gilligan : And I remember a day back in 1980 when another bunch of good men were lost. In my instance it was due to a 4 year neglect of the services. In your ca
32 Itsjustme : Really? We've been very much tracking him for a long time? Gee, what are we waiting for then to make the capture. Hmmmmmmm? Perhaps some significant
33 Post contains images Aaron747 : Q Mr. President, in your speeches now you rarely talk or mention Osama bin Laden. Why is that? Also, can you tell the American people if you have any
34 Scbriml : They're not doing much of a job then. Yes, but look at the state the country is in now. The Taliban are growing stronger by the day.
35 Slider : The US ARmy and the Rangers might not be crossing the border, but there are operators in country. Might not be engaging the enemy, but they're implan
36 Post contains images JGPH1A : So what are they waiting for - Christmas ? Or the elections...
37 Slider : I don't know. And I didn't say they had OBL, I said they were tracking him, trying to find him. But it would be a very interesting and profound thing
38 JGPH1A : That would be the optimal outcome, it's true. Good for both sides. It's got to be very dangerous - the tribal territories in Pakistan are not exactly
39 Post contains images HAWK21M : When Mushy can tell the People of Pakistan how the US Help is needed after the Taliban have attacked its Citizens..... Guess when. regds MEL
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