TRVYYZ From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 1365 posts, RR: 10 Reply 3, posted (7 years 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 6611 times:
If your are using two power supplies(PS), I imagine you would be connect two ac mains cable (that makes it parallel automatically). The output side (dc side) all the connectors are polarized (does not allow you to connect the wrong connectors to the internal devices), so you can connect to whatever devices in Computer from both PS. So, just select the loads in so that you distribute the loads coming to each PS evenly.
In short, you need not worry about series or parallel, just hook up the primary sides to the ac and keep connecting the dc(secondary) side as though they were from a single supply.
Lehpron From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 7028 posts, RR: 22 Reply 4, posted (7 years 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 6601 times:
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 3): In short, you need not worry about series or parallel, just hook up the primary sides to the ac and keep connecting the dc(secondary) side as though they were from a single supply.
Would I need to splice wires or an adapter?
The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
RichardPrice From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 5, posted (7 years 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 6599 times:
Watch out for different earths, even to the same wall socket, it can kill a computer (Ive done basically what you want to do here, and I lost parts due to a differential in the earths on the two supplies).
TedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 6, posted (7 years 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 6590 times:
Dude, unless you are an ET (which apparently you (as well as me) are not) this is stupidity.
If you don't have enough energy comming out of a power supply to power your stuff, butch up and buy a bigger power supply. If you want redundancy, buy a case/motherboard that is designed for dual power supplies. Sure your spending money but you'll be a lot happier when you watch the system power up properly instead of letting the smoke out of the caps.
TRVYYZ From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 1365 posts, RR: 10 Reply 9, posted (7 years 4 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 6565 times:
Quoting Lehpron (Reply 4): Would I need to splice wires or an adapter?
I don't think so, if do it the right way.
Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 5): Watch out for different earths, even to the same wall socket, it can kill a computer
Be sure to interconnect the two earths/grounds of the two PS on to the Chassis of the PC. I believe you are using two power supplies made specifically for use with PC's and not any ac adaptor lying around.
Also be sure to have a multimeter and you can check for any voltage between the the grounds of two the PS on the dc side before connecting(make sure it is zero V).
As everybody mentioned, margin for error is very small and all protection of PC is on the primary side of PS and not on dc.
TRVYYZ From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 1365 posts, RR: 10 Reply 13, posted (7 years 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6489 times:
Quoting Klaus (Reply 11): There is no "right way" to do this with off-the-shelf PSUs
I don't know about the background of the threadstarter or whether he can do it.
It is not easy but not impossible. I work in a lab and we like to experiment these kind of things, may be thats why I find it challenging. The fire hazards are minimal if an approved PS is used ie, UL or TUV mark. They have to be tested for almost all possible faults. In my lab we blowup PS almost every other day because some of our techs don't change the voltage setting and plug to 240V (Canada is 120V,60Hz)
I just need amps on the 12v line, specifically 3 more than what I have, so a small 120W or 180W supply was considered but how to hook up is not obvious to me yet.
Edit: (warning, crazy idea, I just came up with it now): how about hooking up a 12v battery, how much current is there?
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 13): I don't know about the background of the threadstarter or whether he can do it.
Might as well just spit out the whole thing:
My power supply is a Hiper 580W (620W peak) with a combined dual 12v rail maximum of 30 amps. It's pretty good, very quiet, had it for 4 months and I like it. As it stands, I am using approximately 23amps on the 12 volt line at around 290W.
Most of ya'll might know my plan with adding a TEC onto my computer's graphics card:
nVidia GeForce 7900GT KO 512meg version.
Stock speeds 560/1500MHz.
Currently, overclocked 685/1600 MHz.
My idle/load temps are 39*C/51*C (Rthdribl.exe for 10mins at full res).
Through empirical testing Qout idle/load is 44/70 watts
memory chips estimated at 4W each (x8), never measured their temps (I'll get some heasinks for them later).
I guess the recent idea (last night) was if I had 7 amps left, why not get a tiny TEC to experiment - but would it make a difference? Even an 80W TEC at 12v would cool no more than 32W worth. I'd need more cooling that the core put out at load to be effective, but those modules are power hungry. That would begin at the 169W, 172W and 226W versions -- that is only if I stop overclocking the core.
I know how TEC's work, they require up to 2.5 times the power to run than to cool. I have thought of many combinations of doing this with 8 different TEC's including giving the thing its own power supply. I'm not using a water cooling loop as the cpu cooler that was modded onto the gfx card can remove up to 150watts of heat, double what the card is putting out now at 685MHz. I have noticed that whenever I turn on the AC (not usualy on), I can increase the speed with no change in idle/load temperatures!
I suppose theorhetically, if I moved the computer to the AC cranked it to supercold and began OC'ing some more, I may not need the TEC. Maybe I can use up all the 7 amps left over into the graphic card if I just turn on the AC, the cooler should take it all. I wonder if I could reach the 800's MHz on the core on air cooling? The maxiumum possible is 1120MHz and the highest I've seen online was on the 3Dmark06 benchmark all-time-highs at 1020MHz using custom phase change cooler (cheapest commercially available solution I've seen was $400).
Other people on other tech forums brag about their speeds and they have spend hundreds in liquid cooling but here I am, having spent $65 and my core is running faster. I want to see how much faster I can push it.
I wonder, is it absolutely neccesary to get it cold, if all the heat is removed, why not maintain ambient? I have considered PWM TEC controllers bu those things are expensive and I have $150 to play with as of now. I might try the AC idea first before the TEC thing.
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 10): Another problem I can see with this arrangement is that, if one PS fails, it could overload the other PS and damage it depending on the circuitry.
Hmm, for some reason I keep thinking in terms of t=0 on this, and not the idea that the second psu would fail so soon it would cause me problems.
[Edited 2006-11-13 02:24:26]
The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
Let me discuss with the hardware experts in my lab for a second opinion.
I am more of a power guy, I thought synchronising a 3 phase alternator to the power grid was challenging. I enjoy more of the 10kV surges we simulate and 5kV hipots we do.
Let me see if I can get the detail on the advantages and disadvantages of the arrangement.
Also, your computer enclosure will be heated more due to all the loads and many of the components many not be rated for this ambient, so the ventillation could be a problem or it will act as heating chamber or unless you are not using an enclosure which then is a safety issue. Most of the component temps should not exceed 90oC and 105oC is the limit for PCB for safe operation.
The rating of the battery is given in ampere-hours (Ah). If you divide the Ah by the current you draw, it will give you the number of hours it can supply that current.
Anyway not recommended.
I have tested li-ion batteries of 3.7V and it gave upto 34A on short circuit (only for a second or two) and then about 12-14A for about 10 minutes. Short circiut of a AAA baterry cangive upto 4 or 5A upto a few minutes.
Please note: We have a fire extinguisher handy when we do the crazy tests
RichPhitzwell From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 17, posted (7 years 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 6428 times:
you could do a wake on lan... but that usually requires a second MB and NIC. as for starting up two power supplies without all that hassle, Crestron makes a devise that starts and turns off computers with the press of a button. I should warn you, this is a hard boot. cost a couple of hundered dollars.... of course you could do the same thing with a standard switch and some bios settings... if thats all your after.
RichPhitzwell From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 19, posted (7 years 4 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6413 times:
ok, so im not as drunk as before...how are you able to get 23 amps out of anything...most single phase breakers commercial are only 20 amps. residential is either 15 or 20 amps.... most desktops including crt monitor on startup are around 5.2ish amps... now im really curious, please explain!
You don't want to know.... Instead of using a fan, liquid, liqud nitrogen, or anything else that normal people user to cool his system: Rocket boy wants to use what's called a Thermal Electric cooler. I fell in love with the technology when I saw it on a motorcycle helmet (in 1988) and that made some sense. Then I fell out of love when I read some of the earlier threads on this subject and read how much energy it takes, and how poor the efficiency is. The boy might as well use a catheter; with the right tubing and lighting it should look pretty cool.
RichPhitzwell From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 21, posted (7 years 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6405 times:
Quoting TedTAce (Reply 20): You don't want to know.... Instead of using a fan, liquid, liqud nitrogen, or anything else that normal people user to cool his system: Rocket boy wants to use what's called a Thermal Electric cooler. I fell in love with the technology when I saw it on a motorcycle helmet (in 1988) and that made some sense. Then I fell out of love when I read some of the earlier threads on this subject and read how much energy it takes, and how poor the efficiency is. The boy might as well use a catheter; with the right tubing and lighting it should look pretty cool.
Yes but he said he is drawing 23 amps now.. im curious how he is able to do this in the usa off of a 110v 20a circuit unless he is using a 220, 277, 440...circuit.