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Pierre Gemayel Murdered.  
User currently offlineAlessandro From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (8 years 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 1991 times:

Seem like Pierre Gemayel, industrialminister of Lebanon and leader of the Falangiste been shot dead today, more here http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...ename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

[Edited 2006-11-21 16:07:39]

76 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBeaucaire From Syria, joined Sep 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 25
Reply 1, posted (8 years 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 1979 times:

Very bad news - let's hope this will not spark off another ralley of civil conflicts.....
Syria should absolutely manage to control their secret service rambos- just yesterday there were slim signs of hope,with the anouncement of diplomatic ties being re-established between Baghdad and damascu.



Please respect animals - don't eat them...
User currently offlineKay From France, joined Mar 2002, 1884 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (8 years 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 1967 times:

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 1):
with the anouncement of diplomatic ties being re-established between Baghdad and damascu

Beaucaire this is exactly why this happened today (in my opinion of course). Syria is now in a fresh new effort of cooperation with the US regarding Iraq so that pressure is lifted from its operations in Lebanon and it can maneuver to take back Lebanon's government.

6 ministers resigned last week, but that is not enough since 8 must go down to topple the government. 1 was murdered today. 1 to go and the old governemnt is old news.

Those who are doing this (Syria using Hizbullah's resources and palestinian camps) couldn't do this if it didn't have some assurance that world powers were turning a temporary blind eye.


My opinion of course,
Kay


User currently offlineAlessandro From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 1961 times:

Well, too early to point at any direction, but anyway, the Syrians are always on the list of presumed assassins in Lebanon, together with the Israelis.

User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 4, posted (8 years 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 1955 times:

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 1):
Very bad news

most shocking ! the Syrian Mukhaberat ? Hizbullah ? or President Lahoud ?
whatever, here another link :
http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article....n_id=1&categ_id=2&article_id=77064
plus: http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exer...48-E1F9-42B7-829B-CDCCC25A335E.htm
-
if I remember correctly, already his father, President Amin Gemayel was assassinated
-


User currently offlineBeaucaire From Syria, joined Sep 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 25
Reply 5, posted (8 years 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 1950 times:

I tend to agree with your assessment ,Kay- the evil spirits have woken up again.
It's such a pity Syria can't manage to jump over it's shadow and become a constructive element in the region.Most Syrian's completely disagree with their government's politics but have to keep their mouth shut...



Please respect animals - don't eat them...
User currently offlineMattRB From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1624 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (8 years 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 1939 times:

Quoting Kay (Reply 2):
6 ministers resigned last week, but that is not enough since 8 must go down to topple the government. 1 was murdered today. 1 to go and the old governemnt is old news.

Presumably anonymous phonecalls and letters are being sent out, threatening anti-Syrian members of government with the same fate as Gemayel unless they resign.

Any bets that the with their new Syrian friends that the US (and, by extension, the world) is going to turn a blind eye to the goings on in Lebanon?



Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible.
User currently offlineKay From France, joined Mar 2002, 1884 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (8 years 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1930 times:

I don't really blame the US, though. One only invests where one has interests. Lebanon is a very small country and very unimportant when it comes to the worries that the US has today.

Therefore, if you count the US out, and Europe's support "theoretical" as usual, you can see why Lebanon's current government is a minority: it is the majority in Lebanon itself but is the minority when you count the truckloads of people from Syria and Iran that are going to "democratically" topple the government Thursday.

Kay


User currently offlineBeaucaire From Syria, joined Sep 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 25
Reply 8, posted (8 years 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1914 times:

I'm very much afraid that this spells tough weeks ahead ( again...!!!) for Lebanon !
When will this country find normality and peace ????
The US couldn' worry less about Lebanon than any other place on this globe without petrol or strategic economical interests to them.
Europe will -as usual- pay lip-service and hide behind diplomatic bullshit phrases.The ones that will pay are the Lebanese population -as usual.



Please respect animals - don't eat them...
User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 9, posted (8 years 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1892 times:

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 8):
tough weeks ahead ( again...!!!) for Lebanon !

I in spite of that very sad  crying  and embarrassing matter hope that things will keep calm and will in the end get under control. Mr Georges Gemayel will get replaced in his functions, and the successor will have to continue where Mr Gemayel left. As it is said in such situations "life has to go on" .  thumbsup  yes 


User currently offlineKay From France, joined Mar 2002, 1884 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (8 years 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1892 times:

And just now (10min ago) they shot at the second minister's office.
That's how you topple a government. You just shoot enough ministers until it is "constitutionally" void.

Kay


User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (8 years 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1891 times:

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 4):

most shocking ! the Syrian Mukhaberat ? Hizbullah ? or President Lahoud ?

Syria? Hezbollah? ME AVN FAN, how can you say such a thing about such a stalwart against terrorism like Syria? Or against those brave fighters who held those horrible Israeli's to a standstill?

Blasphemy coming from your fingers, sir.  Yeah sure


User currently offlineBeaucaire From Syria, joined Sep 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 25
Reply 12, posted (8 years 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1882 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 11):
Syria? Hezbollah? ME AVN FAN, how can you say such a thing about such a stalwart against terrorism like Syria? Or against those brave fighters who held those horrible Israeli's to a standstill?

There had to come some unqualified statements - a sad enough situation does not need stupid comments....
Most people here on this forum don't have any blue-eyed ideas on who's to blame . So please refrain from cheap comments that basically are meant to disrecdit ME AVN FAN.His opinion might not be your's -but that does not give any reasons to start a cheap polemic.



Please respect animals - don't eat them...
User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (8 years 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1856 times:

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 12):
a cheap polemic.

we of course could start a lousy polemic and flamebait by accusing Mossad, the CIA or whomever. But I on the basis of the situation do NOT feel like that at all. I am, as stated, optimistic, but the situation at present reminds me of spring 1975. I pray, that the future for Lebanon nevertheless and in spite of all odds, is and will be the way UP and appeal to all the Lebanese on this board NOT to give up hope.
-

[Edited 2006-11-21 19:29:03]

User currently offlineBeaucaire From Syria, joined Sep 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 25
Reply 14, posted (8 years 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1849 times:

Second attack



"In a separate incident, shots were fired on the office of a Lebanese minister of state, shortly after Gemayel's death.

"The office of the state minister for parliamentary affairs, Michel Pharaon, in the Ashrafieh neighbourhoodm was the target of gunshots today from gunmen in a white Suzuki car," Pharaon's office said.

"The security forces cordoned off the area and is carrying out the necessary measures to identify the culprits" who fled the scene.

Pharaon is a Greek-Catholic Christian MP from the majority anti-Syrian parliamentary bloc."
From : Al Jazeera..



Please respect animals - don't eat them...
User currently offlineMEA310 From Lebanon, joined Feb 2002, 660 posts, RR: 12
Reply 15, posted (8 years 4 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1826 times:

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 4):
if I remember correctly, already his father, President Amin Gemayel was assassinated

No, I guess you are referring to Bashir Gemayel, the brother of Amin.

Quoting Kay (Reply 10):
And just now (10min ago) they shot at the second minister's office.

False information, it was reported later on that the incident took place at 12:10 , some 3 hours before the assasination took place.


MEA310



M5 Fastest Sedan On Earth
User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (8 years 4 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1820 times:

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 12):
There had to come some unqualified statements - a sad enough situation does not need stupid comments....
Most people here on this forum don't have any blue-eyed ideas on who's to blame . So please refrain from cheap comments that basically are meant to disrecdit ME AVN FAN.His opinion might not be your's -but that does not give any reasons to start a cheap polemic.

Keep your opinion to yourself if all it is supposed to do is tell me to keep mine to myself, Beaucaire. ME AVN FAN cannot escape the fact that on this board he's been an unabashed apologist for Syria, and pointing that out is very legitimate.

So your request is brusquely denied.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 13):
we of course could start a lousy polemic and flamebait by accusing Mossad, the CIA or whomever.

I'm half surprised you didn't, or that someone else on here didn't accuse Mossad of that.

This has all the earmarks of Syria/Iran/Hezbollah, the usual culprits in trying to destabalize the region. And the U.S. should be sending a stern warning to both to leave Lebanon alone.

Syria/Iran/Hezbollah instigated the conflict with Israel this summer, and this is their continuing attempt to try to destabalize and eventually remove the government of Lebanon, and putting a terrorst group in charge of that nation.


User currently offlineMarco From United Arab Emirates, joined Jul 2000, 4169 posts, RR: 11
Reply 17, posted (8 years 4 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 1782 times:

RIP Pierre Gemayel. Go to hell Hezbollah, we all know your only allegiance is to your shia brothers in Iran. Thanks for ruining Lebanon!


Proud to be an Assyrian!
User currently offlineSprout5199 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1855 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (8 years 4 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 1754 times:

Quoting Kay (Reply 7):
don't really blame the US, though. One only invests where one has interests. Lebanon is a very small country and very unimportant when it comes to the worries that the US has today.

I think it is more about having 248 Marines killed in 1983. Same reason why we will never go back to Mogadishu.

Dan in Jupiter


User currently offlineRJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (8 years 4 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 1738 times:

And people on this site mocked me when I said that Lebanon will only see more instability in the future?????

User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 20, posted (8 years 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 1706 times:

Quoting MEA310 (Reply 15):
referring to Bashir Gemayel

thanks for the information

Quoting Sprout5199 (Reply 18):
248 Marines killed in 1983

bad and sad, but isn't that history ?

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 19):
Lebanon will only see more instability

too easy to forecast, and it not only is Lebanon.


User currently offlineSprout5199 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1855 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (8 years 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 1672 times:

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 20):
bad and sad, but isn't that history ?

Yes it is, however I dont think the US wants to repeat that part of history. I would have much rather seen the US in Lebanon than Iraq, at least there we might have helped. But because there is no oil, and we do have a bad history there, we will not go back.

Dan in Jupiter


User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3602 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (8 years 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 1658 times:

This is what the Lebanese get for not disarming the Hezbollah terrorists. The same will continue until either the Hezbollah terrorists are disarmed and removed as a second government, or they depose the deomcratically elected government and impose islamic law across Lebanon.

In the mean time, certain apologists will continue to stall and insist that this is all a normal part of mid-east life, and that Lebanon will survive and rise again.

If you don't properly clean a wound, it will become infected, fester, and eventually become gangrenious.


User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 23, posted (8 years 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1646 times:

Quoting DLPMMM (Reply 22):
impose islamic law across Lebanon.

this will NOT happen. Not just because Hizbullah is a minority party of about 12% of the people, but because the army, not exactly a strategic asset otherwise, will NOT tolerate this, and also because Syria will NEVER tolerate an Islamic law Lebanon as this would be a threat to the Assad regime. What some in Damascus however dream about is a "reunification" of Syria and Lebanon, or at least to recapture more influence. What role Hizbullah and Syria and General Lahoud etc played in that assassination is not so easy to determine.
-
The following is on the WEBsite www.sana.org, the Syrian News Agency :
-******************************************************
Syrian Information Minister Dr. Mohsen Bilal said that Syria strongly condemned the assassination of the Lebanese Industry Minister Pierre Gemayel, expressing profound condolences to the family of the deceased.
-------
In a statement to al-Jazeera satellite TV channel on Tuesday, Dr. Bilal added that Syria considered the crime as targeting the Lebanese national dialogue and accord and at the same time against Syria as well.
--
The Minister described the accusations directed against Syria as totally lacking truth, reality and credibility. He depicted those who repeated baseless and false accusations against Syria as patients, questioning how could they accuse Syria from the very first moment while they covered up the true collaborators.
-
******************************************************
difficult to say whether reflecting truth or just a cover-up, but Syria at least is distancing itself from that assassination
-

[Edited 2006-11-22 18:45:53]

User currently offlineDLPMMM From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 3602 posts, RR: 10
Reply 24, posted (8 years 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 1629 times:

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 23):
this will NOT happen. Not just because Hizbullah is a minority party of about 12% of the people, but because the army, not exactly a strategic asset otherwise, will NOT tolerate this,

They are already tolerating it, and it will happen. Hezbollah does not need to win free elections to take control, they will do it by coercion. They just keep assassinating the opposition's political leaders one by one until no one dares to stand up to them. This is very similar to the Nazis in Germany. The Nazi's were never the majority party before they came to power. After they came to power, party membership was required to get anything done, thereby increasing the power of the Nazis.

Hezbollah are just murdering facists of another stripe. If you cannot see it, you are blind.


25 ME AVN FAN : They do NOT tolerate it. Lebanon is NOT a fundamentalist country. And it will NOT happen. They canNOT do it that way. And they will NOT succeed to as
26 Bravo45 : This is a sad sad development. I get the feeling that someone doesnot want to see Lebanese unity. Its amazing how much Lebanon has taken in just the r
27 ME AVN FAN : No doubt, BUT when looking at the available reports I canNOT help to have the impression that Minister Gemayel acted in a careless way. Any prominent
28 Mika : I feel so bad for Lebanon lately, it seems like a such a beautiful and nice country with nice and open people if hezbollah could be eliminated from po
29 ME AVN FAN : Hizbullah is NOT in power.
30 DLPMMM : Despite your protestations to the contrary, Hezbollah are in power now. They have already usurped the power of the elected government by having their
31 Beaucaire : The only power that counts in the region are the USA and their allied friends in Israel. Wouldn't they have allowed the rise of Hamas and Hezbollah b
32 ME AVN FAN : # Hizbullah has NOT usurped the power of the government # they only run some municipal government functions in areas in the southern border regions #
33 ME AVN FAN : the Israelis for a very long time have been incredibly lenient about Hamas, regarding them as "useful idiots", until they moved up to become a REAL p
34 Post contains images Bravo45 : Yeah, I now think the Lebanese security forces, the police and the army should have stepped up security when the ministers resigned. I hope they do i
35 ME AVN FAN : I do NOT know exactly what the Lebanese laws prescribe, but in view of the position of the Gemayel family I am perfectly sure that another Gemayel, m
36 Mika : All the best to Lebanon and the lebanese people, that's all i can say and wish for..regardless of who is in power or not.
37 ME AVN FAN : it in spite of all negative b...sh... said is still the government, even if everybody can spit in the soup there.
38 DLPMMM : LOL I wondered how long until someone blamed this murder on the USA. All of those things you mentioned were more the fault of middle eastern arab gov
39 ME AVN FAN : do you really think that the disarming of Hizbullah would keep them off from bad actions ? beside the point that it is far far from proven that THEY
40 DLPMMM : Yes. If you take away their guns and rockets, they cannot attack other countries and they cannot intimidate their fellow Lebanese. But instead, peopl
41 ME AVN FAN : the topic here is not guns (of the kind you refer to) or rockets, we speak about an assassination. And everybody can carry through an assassination.
42 Rolfen : Exactly, they both benefit of a civil war in lebanon and what these assination do is polarize lebanon and increase the internal tensions. About the c
43 ME AVN FAN : judging from one of your posts I thought you lived in the Hamra region, but reports about this assassination spoke about "eastern suburb of Beirut" ?
44 Semsem : Hezbollah have said that they want the Jews in Israel to pack and leave. But they also want the Christians and secular Shia to also leave so that they
45 ME AVN FAN : They want ALL non-Shi'ites and all NON-fundamentalist Shi'ites to leave, that is obvious 40% of the Lebanese ARE Shi'ites, true, but that does NOT me
46 Rolfen : :D Where did you conclude that I live in Hamra ?? I live in the eastern suburbs.
47 Rolfen : I dont know! can a kia be armoured? I dont think so... it didnt look armoured to me... and if it was it must have been a very light armour because th
48 Post contains images MIAMIx707 : Instead of blaming the US and Israel as always without thinking, I would blame Europe first. Then blame the supposed Arab "friends" for not taking Pa
49 Beaucaire : You want to exterminate them all ? Or send them into exile -to where ? They are Lebanese in their country. Only way to deal with the issue of Hezboll
50 Rolfen : Dont put the muslims in one bag. Sunna muslims which make approx less then 20% of leb pop. are usually against hezbollah presence. Christians are div
51 ME AVN FAN : from that video you brought to A-net in mid-July, where the journey started somewhere between the Versailles Hotel and the Hotel Mediterranee near th
52 Alessandro : Of course a KIA can be armored, but it´s not the most common car to used with armor. Armor isn´t a warranty to survive a group of US officials drove
53 Kay : news media said that he was driving a "rental". Maybe because of his age, and lack of real experience, he liked to avoid the arrogance attached to his
54 ME AVN FAN : unfortunately NOT, true, but it improves the chance of survival of the user - exactly the point with the 2 bodyguards is alarming. Where they not att
55 Rolfen : They killl the younger, fresh, politicians and they leave the former warlords.
56 Kay : I can imagine the scene very well: three or four gunmen popping out of a car and firing from three feets away, the bodyguards must have been terrifie
57 Rolfen : The laws prescribe that the president has to sign his agreement to any new minister nominated, which is the real problem here, the president actually
58 ME AVN FAN : well, possibly a cousin ? or even his father ? - what is the actual intention of the General ? to terminate the present government coalition ? and wh
59 Cedars747 : It was in July 1973 that a team of Mossad agents arrived in the town of Lillehammer in Norway, believing they had finally tracked down Ali Hassan Sala
60 DLPMMM : Bullsh*t! The disarming of Hezbollah should have nothing to do with these other matters. Hezbollah's armies in Lebanon is an internal Lebanese matter
61 MattRB : Ask yourself a question: What does Israel have to gain from destabilizing Lebanon? Answer: Nothing. Now Syria on the other hand? The puppet-masters?
62 ME AVN FAN : The education in the Arab World is NOT left to religious radicals. Compulsary education in the past 50 years has made tremendous progress in practica
63 Cedars747 : Olmert called on Seniora to begin direct peace talks with Israel He added that while Seniora faced difficulties at home and abroad, Israel could be a
64 MattRB : Except for putting the government one step closer to collapse (which they would've accomplished the same day - had the second assassination attempt g
65 Cedars747 : Israel and the US are fighting Syria and Iran in Lebanon.They realised that Seniora's government was collapsing giving more power to Hezbollah inside
66 Post contains images MIAMIx707 : BS, and you know it. Again, you guys will never have peace thinking like this. Makes one wonder if some of you really want peace.. You're right, not
67 Semsem : LOL Hezbollah are peace loving? My foot. That's a good joke.
68 ME AVN FAN : No turmoil is actually needed, as Syria to some extent already HAS retaken that control. With President General Lahoud being the man of Damascus, the
69 FOMEA : You got a source or link to back up that garbage you spewed? While i dont see them as peace loving either, Yet if there is any Joke left in this worl
70 Rolfen : As much peace loving as your army.
71 Rolfen : ok guys, how about we keep the middle east conflict in the middle east, and we try to stay on topic. I'm sorry for contributing in derailing the topic
72 ME AVN FAN : That aspect is what I was wondering about. In these times, ministers and other people of prominence ARE in permanent danger, not only in Lebanon. - d
73 Post contains images MIAMIx707 : If youre' going to quote me, quote the whole thing next time ALL = all walks of life, all beliefs Everyone = every single person Either you don't und
74 Post contains images MIAMIx707 : Still waiting for our friend BA to chip in, since he's very vocal. Could it be because he can't blame Israel and Germayel wasn't a muslim, so who care
75 ME AVN FAN : What IS done at present, by both the Lebanese army and the UN troops, is to keep Hizbullah off from doing mischief. The emphasis has to be on keeping
76 FOMEA : I don't recall anger that afternoon but i recall reading garbage in a certain post and that is what i quoted. That doesn't change the fact that the I
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