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Large Minority Of Americans Want Muslims ID'd  
User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2297 times:

Inside this story about a radio talk show host who, to spur debate, said Muslims should be tatooed to identify them, are results of polls done earlier in the year, that clearly shows that many American want Muslims identified much in a way Jews were in Nazi Germany in the 1930's, which just chills me to the bone.

http://articles.news.aol.com/news/_a...lim-sentiment/20061203153809990001

If anyone on here really, truely wants such a form if identification for those who practice Islam, then they're welcome to leave our borders for good-immediately-as far as I'm concerned.

I think this government owes it to those Americans who peacefuly practice the Islamic faith to start an education program to inform the American people that not everyone who is Muslim is a terrorists. But then again, it was the fear-mongering and paranoia of this administration, in my view, that has exacerbated this "Kristallnacht" mentality among many Americans.

58 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDaleaholic From UK - England, joined Oct 2005, 3204 posts, RR: 13
Reply 1, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2280 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Thread starter):
Large Minority Of Americans Want Muslims ID'd

Large Minority? I smell contradiction  Silly



Religion is an illusion of childhood... Outgrown under proper education.
User currently offlineMDorBust From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2275 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Thread starter):
I think this government owes it to those Americans who peacefuly practice the Islamic faith to start an education program to inform the American people that not everyone who is Muslim is a terrorists.

Of course it would be left up to the government to do such a thing... as those of the muslim faith appear completely unwilling to do so.


User currently offlineCosec59 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2269 times:

Quoting Daleaholic (Reply 1):
Large Minority? I smell contradiction

49% is a large minority!


User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 5845 posts, RR: 15
Reply 4, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2266 times:

Should we all start sewing emblems of our relevant faiths onto our outermost garments as well?


Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineTransIsland From Bahamas, joined Mar 2004, 2038 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2265 times:

Quoting Daleaholic (Reply 1):
large Minority? I smell contradiction

You do? I suggest either reading the linked article or getting your nose checked. 39% of the people polled supported the idea. While that is not a majority, it's certainly a "large minority," as opposed to a "small minority."

Example: Only a small minority of participants in Airbus vs. Boeing discussions on a.net actually know what they talking about.  Wink



I'm an aviation expert. I have Sky Juice for breakfast.
User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2260 times:

A poll carried out by the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), an advocacy group, found that for one in three Americans, the word Islam triggers negative connotations such as "war," "hatred" and "terrorist."

Rather than bitching and moaning about how racist and intolerant America is against the poor innocent Muslims, I would suggest that Muslims examine why their faith has become associated with these negatives. The incident last week with the 5 imams on the plane just proved once again how the Islamic world is terribly and tragically reluctant to self-examination.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21085 posts, RR: 56
Reply 7, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 2234 times:

The AOL poll, while admittedly not scientific, is interesting:

Do you think Muslims in the U.S. should carry special identification?
No 62%
Yes 38%
Total Votes: 114,014

Do you think most U.S. Muslims sympathize with al-Qaida?
No 54%
Yes 46%
Total Votes: 114,693

What kind of idiots would say yes to both those questions?

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 2):
Of course it would be left up to the government to do such a thing... as those of the muslim faith appear completely unwilling to do so.

Is it not the responsibility of the government to protect its citizens?

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineMDorBust From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 2228 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 7):
Is it not the responsibility of the government to protect its citizens?

Protect yes. Uphold their reputations and names? No.


User currently offlineHalls120 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 2178 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Thread starter):
I think this government owes it to those Americans who peacefuly practice the Islamic faith to start an education program to inform the American people that not everyone who is Muslim is a terrorists.

IIRC, immediately after the 9/11 attack President Bush made it a point to separate the minority of Islamic extremists from the vast majority of peaceful followers of Islam.

The suggestion put forth by the radio host is abhorrent. That said, as long as so many conflicts around the world continue to be fueled by religious hatred, it isn't surprising that an sizable audience for such nonsense exists.

Quoting TransIsland (Reply 5):

Example: Only a small minority of participants in Airbus vs. Boeing discussions on a.net actually know what they talking about. Ê

 rotfl 

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 6):
Rather than bitching and moaning about how racist and intolerant America is against the poor innocent Muslims, I would suggest that Muslims examine why their faith has become associated with these negatives. The incident last week with the 5 imams on the plane just proved once again how the Islamic world is terribly and tragically reluctant to self-examination.

 checkmark 


User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 2151 times:

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 9):
The suggestion put forth by the radio host is abhorrent.

And he agrees with you, as you see later in the article when he said he can't believe anyone would take seriously what he suggested-and that he only did so to see what the response would be.

It does show a large dose of fear, paranoia and ignorance still reigns in this nation, a full 5 years after 9/11, which is shameful.


User currently offlineCairo From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 2150 times:

The Americans who want Muslims ID'd certainly have their priorities in order.

Americans killed by Muslims in America over the last 5 years: <50.
Americans killed by non-Islamic Americans on the streets of Amierca over the last 5 years: 100,000+.

Yes, some crazy Muslims were responsible for 9/11, But at some point a rational, unemotional review of the real killers in American society is in order and a reasonable priority of resource re-allocation deserved.

Cairo


User currently offlineMDorBust From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 2139 times:

Quoting Cairo (Reply 11):
Americans killed by Muslims in America over the last 5 years: <50.
Americans killed by non-Islamic Americans on the streets of Amierca over the last 5 years: 100,000+.

Okay. If we are going to talk criminal demographics Cairo, why don't you give us a religious breakdown of the people who committed the murders in line two?


User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 2094 times:

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 12):
why don't you give us a religious breakdown of the people who committed the murders in line two?

I do NOT know whether your country has statistics in this regard, but I would expect it to be 95%-PLUS to be culprits of Christian denominations. But before you investigate into this, please be aware that "Catholic" does NOT mean Mexican, as people of Irish, Italian or Polish origins tend to be Catholics also !
-


User currently onlineD L X From United States of America, joined May 1999, 10989 posts, RR: 52
Reply 14, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 2089 times:

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 6):
Rather than bitching and moaning about how racist and intolerant America is against the poor innocent Muslims, I would suggest that Muslims examine why their faith has become associated with these negatives. The incident last week with the 5 imams on the plane just proved once again how the Islamic world is terribly and tragically reluctant to self-examination.

Come on man. 1) Is it your responsibility to cheerlead for people that look like you? No, it's not. It's a shame that you require it of others. 2) Despite the fact that they shouldn't be required to cheerlead for their ethinicity, they do it anyway. The problem is, few people pay attention.

There was a poster in my church that said that if you do something good, 1 person will remember, but if you do something bad, 10 people will remember. How true these words ring: you'll remember the "bad" Muslims that do something wrong, but you won't even notice the "good" Muslims that denounce the bad ones.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 9):
IIRC, immediately after the 9/11 attack President Bush made it a point to separate the minority of Islamic extremists from the vast majority of peaceful followers of Islam.

Yeah... right before he declared that we were going on a "crusade."  Yeah sure  Yeah sure  Yeah sure

NOT how you want to start a relationship with the Muslim world.



Send me a PM at http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/sendmessage.main?from_username=NULL
User currently offlineEWRCabincrew From United States of America, joined May 2006, 5523 posts, RR: 56
Reply 15, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2080 times:

Terrorists should be IDed.

Problem? Who are they?

There in lies the problem. They come in all shades and backgrounds.



You can't cure stupid
User currently offlineNWA742 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2069 times:

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 6):
Rather than bitching and moaning about how racist and intolerant America is against the poor innocent Muslims, I would suggest that Muslims examine why their faith has become associated with these negatives.

 checkmark 

Quoting Falcon84 (Thread starter):
I think this government owes it to those Americans who peacefully practice the Islamic faith to start an education program to inform the American people that not everyone who is Muslim is a terrorists.

Ridiculous, Falcon. If Muslims want a better image than the one that they've painted, it is entirely up to them to make the effort. The US government owes squat when it comes to that responsibility.

Quoting Falcon84 (Thread starter):
But then again, it was the fear-mongering and paranoia of this administration, in my view, that has exacerbated this "Kristallnacht" mentality among many Americans.

Right, if all else fails, blame it on Bush. Muslims are not totally responsible for what other people think of them. Got it.

Hell even if that nonsense were true, would it be all that surprising, considering how shortsighted most Americans prove themselves to be over time? Look at the war in Iraq - how many people were for it, who ignored those who said that we were in for the long run and that people will die, and are now against it for those very reasons.

It's embarrassing to anyone with half a brain.




-NWA742


User currently onlineD L X From United States of America, joined May 1999, 10989 posts, RR: 52
Reply 17, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2058 times:

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 16):
Ridiculous, Falcon. If Muslims want a better image than the one that they've painted, it is entirely up to them to make the effort.

bullfuckingshit, NWA742. This is a country that does not judge on the basis of color or ethnicity, remember?

People who say this speak from the laziness of not wanting to expend the effort to determine friend from foe. (Yet they do it for their ingroup all the time.)



Send me a PM at http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/sendmessage.main?from_username=NULL
User currently offlineNWA742 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2052 times:

Quoting D L X (Reply 17):
bullfuckingshit, NWA742

 cry 

Quoting D L X (Reply 17):
This is a country that does not judge on the basis of color or ethnicity, remember?

Absolutely, as a politically correct and modern society, that must ring true.

However, no matter what any country claims regarding race, nothing changes the natural human instinct to judge things based on their senses - including sight sound. People tend to judge upon what they see and hear every day. The reasons that Muslims are often associated with terrorism is because they are responsible for the vast majority of it today. I'm not saying all of them are terrorists, most aren't. But that doesn't change the previously mentioned fact. It is their fault, it is the image that they have painted of themselves.

The US Government is not responsible, in any goddamn way, for that.



-NWA742


User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2034 times:

Quoting D L X (Reply 17):
This is a country that does not judge on the basis of color or ethnicity, remember?

How about behaviour?


User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 20, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2034 times:

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 16):
Ridiculous, Falcon. If Muslims want a better image than the one that they've painted, it is entirely up to them to make the effort. The US government owes squat when it comes to that responsibility.

-
You contradict yourselves. You say "than the one that they have painted". THE Muslims did NOT paint a bad image. And to improve the image damaged by some culprits is NOT done overnight. In Switzerland, in the past few years, many youngsters of "ex-Yugoslav" origin were caught as "speeders" and even involved in bad accidents. Now, ALL ex-Yugoslavs have the image to be speeders and careless drivers. What should the normal folks of that origin do now ? Drive with 23 kms per hour ? Or what exactly ? You can be a terrorist, but you canNOT be a NON-terrorist, you just can be somebody normal. And by being normal you canNOT cancel out the effect of the terrorists.
-
I remember that in mid 2001 I had the impression that the Arab World in the USA had gained in reputation, Arab countries and airlines were doing public relations for inbound tourism from the USA. All that was destroyed by one single stroke within a day by elQaeda. You can see now that things are slowly, very slowly in fact, moving back to normal. 5/FIVE years were lost. No, repairs in such things are not done overnight.
-

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 16):
Hell even if that nonsense were true, would it be all that surprising, considering how shortsighted most Americans prove themselves to be over time? Look at the war in Iraq - how many people were for it, who ignored those who said that we were in for the long run and that people will die, and are now against it for those very reasons.

-
What I detest is that kind of indirect self-flagellation. Persons and people make mistakes, partial ones and full ones. Happens. But what is needed are SOLUTIONS and the finding of way-outs. If GWB finds a more or less decent way-out in case of Iraq, I am, in spite of my dis-like for that gentleman, ready to praise him for whatever success he may have. The idea that 2/two full years should go lost, waiting for his successor, is abhorrent for me. To speak about "half-brains" just because some mistakes were made and a disaster occurred is a bad approach.
-

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 18):
The reasons that Muslims are often associated with terrorism is because they are responsible for the vast majority of it today.

-
And here you go again. It was NOT "they", even if Muslims WERE/ARE involved in lots of this shit-business. "THEY" canNOT do very much in the way of an instant-coffee. To correct such matters takes a long time.
-

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 18):
But that doesn't change the previously mentioned fact. It is their fault, it is the image that they have painted of themselves.

-
And again, it is NOT "their" fault, it quite to the contrary is something most Muslims had no influence upon. And "they" did NOT paint the image YOU paint. They painted an image of tolerant and open-minded peaceful and law-abiding people.
-
May I kindly remind you that Osama Bin Laden never won any elections anywhere ? Quite in contrast to the person you do NOT want to be blamed, apparently because you love that dull gentleman.
-


User currently offlineFSPilot747 From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 3599 posts, RR: 13
Reply 21, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2030 times:

AOL is not staffed by professional pollsters. Anyone stupid enough with enough time on their hands to pay for and use AOL is not representative of the U.S. population.

I wouldn't call this a large minority (is that an oxymoron?), though I must say, I'm not surprised 38% of those who participated in the poll agreed with ID badges.

History never taught us anything.

Actually, history never taught Republicans and American Conservatives anything.


User currently offlineNWA742 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2027 times:

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 20):
THE Muslims did NOT paint a bad image



Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 20):
And again, it is NOT "their" fault, it quite to the contrary is something most Muslims had no influence upon.

And this is one of the most common examples of flawed logic regarding this subject.

While most of them may not have any influence or participation in the actions of terrorists, they refuse to stand up as a people and denounce the epidemic of extremists who fight in their name and religion! They refuse to straighten up as a people, modernize, and get with the modern world. THAT IS THEIR FAULT! No more bullshit excuses.

If they actually, as a people, expressed the same outrage over terrorism as they do over a fucking cartoon, maybe they would have a better image, no?

And still, why should the US Government be paying for these mistakes?

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 20):
Persons and people make mistakes, partial ones and full ones.

That has shit to do with shortsightedness.




-NWA742


User currently offlineFSPilot747 From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 3599 posts, RR: 13
Reply 23, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2024 times:

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 22):
While most of them may not have any influence or participation in the actions of terrorists, they refuse to stand up as a people and denounce the epidemic of extremists who fight in their name and religion! They refuse to straighten up as a people, modernize, and get with the modern world. THAT IS THEIR FAULT! No more bullshit excuses.

What do you expect them to do? They don't even see the terrorists as one of them. Beyond that, they have stood up all over the world to denounce terrorism. They just haven't knocked on your door with flowers to do it.

Give me one example: what would you like to see from the muslim community for you to be satisfied? A blowjob?

Christ. I can't believe I live in a day and age when people are still as backwards as this.


User currently offlineEmirates773er From Pakistan, joined Jun 2005, 1448 posts, RR: 10
Reply 24, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2018 times:

Quoting FSPilot747 (Reply 23):
Christ. I can't believe I live in a day and age when people are still as backwards as this.

He is not backwards actually, just a ignorant guy who has probably not left the US in a very long time thus making it difficult for him to understand that the world does not run on his values. Poor guy.



The Truth is Out There ---- Face It!!!!!
25 NWA742 : Condemning, as a people (not group leaders), those who murder and kill in their name and religion. That hardly matters. I don't see myself as a liber
26 ME AVN FAN : - again, THEY actually DO stand up against the extremists and DO modernize and DO get with the modern world. Yes, to be with the modern world, to be
27 Lehpron : Would that be the foreign ones or those born here? How do they tell the difference without asking them? See I dont mind if foreigners get tags, I do
28 Post contains images Halls120 : Maybe because they number of "good" muslims denouncing the terrorists in their midst are and have been so small. Other muslims have pointed this out.
29 MDorBust : Nor do I. Personally I've never seen it. But, Cairo seems to know. Either that or he completely made up his numbers and also has no clue what number
30 ME AVN FAN : - A) the image got marred by the terrorists B) the terrorists WERE and ARE confronted in the Arab World C) it was the USA which gave political asylum
31 Falcon84 : Maybe what you say is true, NWA. But do you think they should be branded, as the Jews were by the Nazi's?
32 Post contains images Halls120 : Oh, really? By Syria?
33 Post contains images NWA742 : Certainly not, Falcon - it would only spark outrage and violence from Muslims, and increase racial tensions even further. Nothing good could come out
34 Superfly : This poll is disgusting and its scary that more than one third of America feels that way. Keep in mind, many Muslims already wear headgear that identi
35 ME AVN FAN : By countries like Morocco, ALGERIA, Tunisia, EGYPT, Syria and Jordan. Syria even used artillery and airforce to eliminate a terrorist stronghold near
36 Halls120 : too bad they aren't doing anything to rein in Hamas and Hezbollah. who are also terrorists, of course.
37 Post contains images Mandala499 : Well, I am told that it is forbidden for Muslims to be tattooed... Mandala499
38 PROSA : What does that incident show about Islamic self-examination? However suspicious their actions might've seemed at the time, the fact remains that the
39 ME AVN FAN : I explained it before. I admit that BOTH were, and in case of Hamas still are, involved in terrorist activities, BUT they at the same time are legal
40 Post contains links PROSA : It was all a hoax: http://www.gnxp.com/blog/2006/12/in-my-country-we-have-problem.php
41 FSPilot747 : Hamas an Hizbollah are not America's problem, which is why the Council on American Islamic Relations is not so eager to discuss it. Had Hamas and Hiz
42 Falcon84 : Yes, the Islmaic world would be rightly pissed at that. But is that THE ONLY reason you wouldn't do it? Is there no moral outrage at the very concept
43 Post contains images Solnabo : A question: How many of you americans have been outside your country? Come to Europe and have a holiday and discover this beautiful continent. When I
44 DrDeke : NWA, how would you even know whether muslims "as a people" condemn those who murder and kill in their name and religion? Do you go door to door in Mu
45 EWRCabincrew : The poll is just that. A poll. A very small (read: a few people) of participants responded to questions. It is not a reflection of America as a whole
46 Halls120 : You are correct, they aren't. But Al Queda isn't the only terrorist organization in operation that needs to be eliminated, and if CAIR really cared a
47 EWRCabincrew : Count me as one who has. All continents but Antarctica. 100+ countries and territories and counting (all 50 states and US territories as well). Lived
48 MDorBust : Does having been born in Germany count as being outside the US?
49 NWA742 : And this kind of nonsense was to be expected from you, FSpilot. There is no set standard when it comes to this, but there is perception. Look at the
50 FSPilot747 : I agree with your logic there, however is "they" all Muslims? American muslims? More than even 1 or 2% of the billion + population? I don't disgaree
51 Post contains images ME AVN FAN : - Hamas and Hizbullah are both also legal and democratic political parties. So that "elimination" is NOT on any agenda. What needs to be brought abou
52 Thomasphoto60 : I rarely agree with you on much Superfly, but were on the same page on this. Very frightening indeed. "Those that cannot remember the past are condem
53 Cfalk : Which have terrorist wings. Even the Democratic or Republican Parties never stooped so low. Too busy rebuilding from the fracas this summer, I assume
54 777236ER : There we have it. Post after post ranting about Muslims, and the first time he actually gives his opinions on the idea he's against it...but not for
55 ME AVN FAN : there indeed is no guarantee for anything - - majority-wise definitely YES ! exactly as stated - - Secularist Muslims, also religious secularists, do
56 Post contains images NWA742 : It is a political matter - but a political matter brought forward by means of religious extremism. The comparsion still stands. There we have it - 77
57 Post contains links Cairo : The interests of Israel come before even the best interests of the American people to many US politicians, for obvious reasons. Because they see the
58 Halls120 : Maybe if Muslims stopped trying to exterminate Israel, we wouldn't need to give Israel financial support. It cuts both ways.
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