WildcatYXU From Canada, joined May 2006, 2634 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 4596 times:
It's tough to say. Diesel cars are now better at fuel mileage (although the TDi Jetta I once rented wasn't all that impressive) and deliver a quite respectable amount of torque. OTOH they are very complex, lot of expensive technology employed, deliver less hp and despite of all efforts, are still bad on environment and use much heavier fuel (a part of better mileage comes from here).
Diesels are the european choice because of heavily taxed fuels and very often much lower tax on diesel.
Gasoline cars are usually simpler, environment friendlier, deliver more hp. With higher displacements and more cylinders they usually run quieter. This is why gasoline's are preferred in North America.
With some hi-tech gadgets we can have gasoline engines delivering some really respectable results. One of them would be a super-turbocharged VW engine, delivering 170 bhp from 1.4 l of displacement. The 2.0 l GM engine used in SKY Red Line delivers 260 bhp and 260 lbf of torque.
CPDC10-30 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2000, 4791 posts, RR: 23
Reply 3, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 4585 times:
When you have cheap fuel like you do in Canada, you will see few benefits to a Diesel. However try beating this rental car I had a few weeks ago:
-Vauxhall Vectra (about the same size as a Chevy Malibu)
-1.9L Turbo diesel (150PS)
-6 speed automatic transmission
-Carrying driver and three passengers + bags
Average mileage over the span of three weeks and 2400 miles (in hills, towns, major cities and motorways): 55 MPG imperial, 45 MPG US . Holding 75mph using cruise control on the motorway the car would get about 61mpg. Show me a petrol that can do that in the same size class.
That brings me to the next question. How do you start a cold diesel engine? do you still have to electrically heat the engine for a minute before starting in the mornings?
Also, another thing about diesel, i never fully understood about the gear shifts(manual). ie,
Upshifting is done at higher speeds compared to a petrol and hence it takes longer to reach the top gear. Is it really required although i followed this way with diesels?
Cosec59 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 4566 times:
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 6): That brings me to the next question. How do you start a cold diesel engine?
Turn the key like a petrol car.
The diesel has glow plugs fitted. In older models you had to wait until the glow plug light had gone out. These days it's much different. The only time you need to wait is if it's REALLY cold.
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 6): Also, another thing about diesel, i never fully understood about the gear shifts(manual).
Same as a petrol car.
Quoting TRVYYZ (Reply 6): Upshifting is done at higher speeds compared to a petrol and hence it takes longer to reach the top gear. Is it really required although i followed this way with diesels?
Diesels rev much slower than petrol engines. I would say that changeing gear is done at roughly the same time as petrol. I tend to change gear at around 2000rpm in order to maintain the turbo boost.
WildcatYXU From Canada, joined May 2006, 2634 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4546 times:
Quoting CPDC10-30 (Reply 3): Average mileage over the span of three weeks and 2400 miles (in hills, towns, major cities and motorways): 55 MPG imperial, 45 MPG US . Holding 75mph using cruise control on the motorway the car would get about 61mpg. Show me a petrol that can do that in the same size class.
Apparently GM has much better diesel engines now that some 6 years ago. I used to drive an Opel Astra B 2.0DLi. Wasn't the most powerful ever and the gas mileage was quite poor. I Compared to my own Suzuki Baleno, which is approx. a same size and had a slightly more powerful engine. The Suzuki's mileage was way better.
Your results are impressive. I drove my G6 to Space Coast and back this August. 4 passengers (including me), our bags. Average mileage 30 mpg. Even realizing that the car was basically brand new when we took off , the G6 is larger and heavier than the Vectra and the diesel is a heavier fuel, this difference in mileage is astonishing.
But still, this is Canada here. The only non-luxury cars with diesels around here are VW's. VW's are quite pricey around here. A diesel in the same size as the G6 (that would be the Passat) would cost almost 50% more than the G
6. There is no way on Earth to get this price difference back on fuel savings during the car's lifespan. Another problem is that our climate is colder around here. With weeks of temperatures around -25 deg Celsius you may get into some problems.
Superfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39905 posts, RR: 75
Reply 13, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4532 times:
Quoting Kay (Reply 11): I must say this is surprising for someone who usually praises classic american V8 cars..
Well petrol/gas engine econoboxes over here don't get milage that is significantly greater than a powerful V8. The diesels on the other hand does.
A petrol/gas powered econobox is a half-ass attempt at making a fuel efficient engine.
The only import I've ever owned was a 1980 Volkswagon Dasher diesel stationwagon. That car had excellent fuel economy.
If I were to ever buy a German car or a fuel efficient car, it would only be a diesel.
Now for fun cars to drive; meaning powerful, luxurious and stylish, I would only buy American!
Andz From South Africa, joined Feb 2004, 8455 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4531 times:
I am now 6 months into my first diesel car and I don't think I could go back to petrol. I have a BMW320d, 6 speed manual, and it really is "sheer driving pleasure".
My previous car was a 320i 2.2 litre 6 cylinder 5 speed manual and it was a good drive until you tried to tow something. The diesel is a joy at this task, it will run all day in 6th at 140km/h and deliver fuel economy that most petrol cars can only dream of. The only time you know this is a diesel car is when stopped at a light or when you go to the filling station.
So far my best fuel consumption was 938km on 62.4 litres: just over 15km/litre or 6.6 litres/100km. This was mostly town driving with a long open stretch of about 300km.
After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
Sky0000547 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2004, 270 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (7 years 10 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 4521 times:
Diesel cars are quick, very quick but that is only when you got going and the turbo spinning. I can't say they are smooth to drive. You either have power or no power and there is nothing in between. They do give you more miles for your money and could be very quick. Diesel engines tend to be more robust.
Petrol car are more refined and quieter. You don't get so much miles for your money though. But performance wise is much better than a diesel for a like for like capacity.
That is not good for car that weights 1814 kilograms (4000 pounds)
I doubt the turbocharger adds much.
That's the thing about diesel engines, the power is less relevant than the torque. My 320d weighing 1415kg makes 115kW but 330Nm torque and this is what gives it the edge over the petrol equivalent (320i, 110kW, 200Nm).
Acceleration (0-100km/h) and top speed are similar for both, although the acceleration of the diesel from 80 to 120km/h is 2 seconds better than the petrol. Add the better fuel consumption and the reduced emissions of the diesel and there isn't much point in buying the petrol version.
After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
: I'm a petrol engine fan when considering "small" engines (less than 3 liters or so). What I really dislike is the diesel engine noise of smaller engin
: Andz: Very true but the gas version of the Continenetal was a 5.0 V8 that put out 170hp and eventualy 220hp a few years later. I guess the whole point
: I don't mean to rain on anyone's parade but I'm a skeptic. I don't like things that smell bad and are noisy, whether they get great mileage or not. Di
: I guess I am an odd-ball. I like the smell and knocking sound of a diesel engine.
: Well, we had two weeks of similar temperatures in Toronto in early 2004, my former boss was driving his wife's car for the whole 2 weeks, because his
: Diesel all the way for me. I've driven far more Diesel cars and kms than petrol cars in the four-and-a-bit years I've got my licence. Most importantly
: Compare to me the price of mogas to diesel fuel in your neck of the woods. Are they the same, or different? By how much?
: No it doesn't. A diesel is never as fast as a petrol car. You are comparing a TURBO diesel with a NON-TURBO petrol even though they both have a 2L en
: I knew living right next to a filling station might come in handy some day. The view out my window reveals: Benzin is standard, Super is premium, all
: I compared two similar cars in my price bracket and picked the one that would do the job better. The fact that one has a turbo is immaterial. Correct
: Holy cow! Two bucks (CDN) for a liter of gas? That's insane...
: That's cheap. Try buying fuel in the UK
: You were not comparing similar price bracket cars but against your 2L turbo diesel vs a 2L NASP petrol. But anyway with similar capacity a turbo dies
: I said "in my price bracket". In this country the 320d is $41,880 and the 320i is $38,010 which is pretty close anyway. Even the 323i is cheaper than
: You're not alone, Superfly. I'm also an odd-ball. From what I understand, the real obstacle holding back diesel sales in the U.S. is the fuel itself,
: How's this for a diesel? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfcP8HaFhYw&mode=related&search= Slow and unrefined eh?
: Right hand drive Diesel Grand Voyagers are the tits, Right 'birdie!
: Try driving on the German Autobahn 2 from Dortmund to Berlin, and you will see how big Diesel BMWs, Mercedes and Audi dominate the left lane. The aver
: I thought all diesel engines were direct injection even the old ones, I am not a mechanical engineer, so I'm not sure. From what I remember (studied
: Not quite. Until the 1990s, there were no injection pumps available which could produce a pressure high enough to inject directly into the cylinder.
: Thanks. I understand now, before it was fuel injection but not direct.
: In Russia they put some paraffin in diesel fuel because of this. That's not a big difference if you're driving an auto car, . However, if you want to
: Well, I pulled out my copy of "Diesel and Other Internal Combustion Engines" by Howard E. Degler which was published in 1938. Quite a number of the e
: According to BMW's specs, the Diesel versions are already more eco-friendly than the petrol engines. Some examples of CO2 emissions (g/km): 320i: 178
: Indeed, direct injection Diesels were not necessarily an invention of Audi, the technology was used for bigger Diesel engines much earlier already. T
50 Aer Lingus
: A comparison table between petrol and diesel (engine capacity, Co2, & Fuel consumption) with 120g/km Co2 or less. Notice the size of the petrol cars a
: Diesel is about 25 per cent higher than 89 octane E10 (ten per cent ethanol) which is about $2.14 per gallon today. Why that should be is beyond me b
: Hmmmm....I was at a machine and tool company in Chesaning Michigan about 24 years ago that was producing diesel injector nozzles by electro discharge
: Since short Im a proud owner of a A6 2.7 V6 TDI and I can assure you that the engine is very quiet and has not at all the sound of a Diesel! A friend
: I've just purchased a 2006 Fiesta Zetec-S TDCi, with the 1.6 Turbo Diesel Peugeot engine. I will never go back to a petrol car. I'm averaging 52 mpg (
: Actually, diesels are simpler than gasoline engines. There is no ignition system needed. On the other hand, nearly all modern diesels are turbocharge