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Foreign Medics Sentenced To Die In Libya HIV Case  
User currently offlineKay From France, joined Mar 2002, 1884 posts, RR: 3
Posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2076 times:

A Libyan court sentenced five Bulgarian nurses and a Palestinian doctor to death on Tuesday for deliberately infecting hundreds of children with the HIV virus that causes AIDS.

The verdict and sentences were announced by judge Mahmoud Haouissa. The six are accused of infecting 426 Libyan children with HIV at a hospital in Benghazi in the late 1990s. The prosecution had demanded the death penalty.

Relatives of the children attending the hearing broke down in tears of joy and shouted "God is greatest."

Source: http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061219/ts_nm/libya_trial_dc_1

Deliberately infecting hundreds of children or negligently are two different things, but it's a serious thing either way..


Kay

12 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5597 posts, RR: 19
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2052 times:

Three words: Khaddaffi's kangaroo court

User currently offlineMainMAN From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 2086 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2043 times:

I don't understand this. There's only one way that 5 people can infect 426 children with HIV, and surely that's by using needles that haven't been steralized more than once...(??).

In which case, the crap Libyan health system is to blame, and not the nurses.


User currently offlineMDorBust From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2029 times:

An absolute crock of justice.

The court didn't even bother to consider the apparent discovery that the children were infected with AIDS before the accused even entered Libya.

Loser quote of the year:

Quote:
Idriss Lagha, the president of a group representing the victims, rejected the Nature article, telling a press conference in London on Monday that the nurses had infected the children with a "genetically engineered" virus. He accused them as doing so for research on behalf of foreign intelligence agencies.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/africa/12/19/libya.aids.ap/index.html


User currently offlineBaroque From Australia, joined Apr 2006, 15380 posts, RR: 59
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2018 times:

Quoting MainMAN (Reply 2):
In which case, the crap Libyan health system is to blame, and not the nurses.

This is true. The whole case is just awful. They have been here before and international protests brought them back from the brink. As certain as anything can be that they had nothing to do with the infections.


User currently offline53Sqdn From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 2016 times:

Now I may be wrong here, but I have a feeling that a certain Colonel may step in to this case. He could surely use this as an excuse to recieve brib (sorry, political 'clout') and look good in the eyes of the world. But there again.

I personally think he will intervene. At a price. Can you put a price on a humans life? In certain areas of the world in the past, it seems so. Plus, if these executions take place, who the heck is going to go out there and help them?

Lastly, why is the figure of 426 used? Most Countries would say; "Somewhere between 400-500 children have been infected." Maybe it's mathematical. 4+2=6. Whooaaa! Isn't that the number of people condemned to death for infecting the children? Thinking out loud...  scratchchin 


User currently offlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5597 posts, RR: 19
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 1944 times:

Quoting 53Sqdn (Reply 5):
Plus, if these executions take place, who the heck is going to go out there and help them?

Executions or not I think everyone with common sense will now think twice before going there because of this case. Don't forget that they have been held in custody for over 7 years already.


User currently onlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 8737 posts, RR: 28
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1935 times:

Quoting 53Sqdn (Reply 5):
Now I may be wrong here, but I have a feeling that a certain Colonel may step in to this case. He could surely use this as an excuse to recieve brib (sorry, political 'clout') and look good in the eyes of the world. But there a

The price quotation is out already. This is a combination of several things, first - a tit for tat on Lockerbie, the nurses and the doctor are kept hostage and Ghaddafi wants to reverse the payment he has made for the Lockerbie victims.

Second -admitting the truth - namely that the infections are due to extremely bad hygenic conditions in that hospital (and assumingly in other hospitalis in Libya as well) it would fall back on him and his regime. Dictatorship or not, if people are getting the real story, there will be an uproar in that country which will affect his dynasty.

Third, Ghaddafi has manouvered himself in such a bad position, that he cannot even pardon the nurses and the doctor and send them out of the country. The only way to get out of this without loss of face is that payments are made to the victims and their parents.

The EU should stand firm on this and not pay a single cent, as bad as it is for the hostages. The best they can do is to "launder" the money Ghaddafi has paid and pretend it comes from the EU. That should be considered only as a humanitarian gesture to get the hostages out of Libya.



I'm not fishing for compliments
User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3675 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 1932 times:

It has been proven that they are innocent.
I personnaly believe this is nearly an act of war from Lybia, and the EU should threaten Lybia and if they happen to kill the nurses, the EU should react VERY violently.


User currently offlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5597 posts, RR: 19
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1926 times:

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 8):
I personnaly believe this is nearly an act of war from Lybia, and the EU should threaten Lybia and if they happen to kill the nurses, the EU should react VERY violently.

The EU certainly should employ all available civilized leverages against Libya to change their mind and should they actually carry out those executions then something in the form of cutting off diplomatic relationships en block with Libya, freezing all their assets, etc. would be more than adequate.
It's not adoption of some 500 pages of eurospeak as constitution or directives for shape of bananas what makes the EU meaningful but it's cases like this when the whole EU should stand up for its people and act with resolve. So far the track record has not been very good in this regard imho.

[Edited 2006-12-20 11:57:46]

User currently offlineBHXFAOTIPYYC From Portugal, joined Jun 2005, 1644 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 1899 times:

The case is being appealed - they have one more change to overturn the verdict, or at least the sentence.

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 8):

I personnaly believe this is nearly an act of war from Lybia, and the EU should threaten Lybia and if they happen to kill the nurses, the EU should react VERY violently.



Quoting Sebolino (Reply 8):
when the whole EU should stand up for its people and act with resolve.

Bulgaria technically isn't in the E.U. yet. This is a Bulgarian matter anyway, apart from the doctor in question, who is Palestinian.

OK, lets get a few things straight here. Gaddafi is everybody's best friend now, since Tony and George have him the stamp of approval. He's an ally in the war on terror. Libya has oil. Lots of it, and good quality too. Hundreds of thousands of Europeans work in Libya, including French and Czechs, and Libya buys lots of military hardware too (eg. Mirages, etc). Libyan Arab Airlines are looking at fleet renewal too (eg Airbus), Afriqiyah have an all Airbus fleet and will be expanding.

Unfortunately these people are pawns in a bigger game. I could see Gaddafi stepping in and playing the hero in due corse. I do not think that the Bulgarians will be executed, although I'm not sure who will be sticking up for the Palestinian. I could see them doing time in prison and being quietly released later. Libya has plenty of money for hospitals; the problem is overall lack of care and hygene. It is the hospital director who should be in trouble. Whether or not any money ultimately changes hands remains to be seen.



Breakfast in BHX, lunch in FAO, dinner in TIP, baggage in YYC.
User currently offlineAvt007 From Canada, joined Jul 2000, 2132 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 1871 times:

Part of the problem is people on the street in Libya believe that they are guilty. I worked there in the oil industry and found that there is a real mistrust and paranoia regarding foreign governments. They have been told over and over again how the world is against them, and they believe it. One guy I worked with told me how he was watching the stars with his son, and was amazed at the number of satellites they saw. He was convinced that all of these were US satellites, spying on Libya. This from a pilot who uses GPS, you'd think he'd realize that not all sats are spy sats. But it illustrates the underlying mistrust.

User currently offlineSpringbok747 From Australia, joined Nov 2004, 4387 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 1858 times:

This whole case is a farce.

It has been proven that those kids had HIV long before the medics arrived.

http://www.voanews.com/english/2006-12-06-voa50.cfm
http://www.nature.com/news/2006/060918/full/443254b.html



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