Heavymetal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (12 years 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1092 times:
DUBAI (Reuters) - Washington's allies were quick to judge the latest videotape of Osama bin Laden to be final proof of his guilt on Thursday, but in the Arab world many dismissed the footage as false propaganda.
While some senior Arab officials declared themselves convinced, it was harder to find ordinary citizens who did and most governments in the region maintained silence on the issue.
``I think this recording is forged ... I don't believe this tape is authentic,'' said Sheikh Mohammad Saleh, a Saudi cleric.
Ali, a Saudi civil servant, concurred. ``The picture is real but the voice is not. It could be a voice over,'' he said. He had to watch the videotape on a regional satellite station as Saudi state television failed to broadcast it.
``Do the Americans really think the world is that stupid to think that they would believe that this tape is evidence?'' asked Abdul Latif Arabiat, head of Jordan's mainstream Islamist party the Islamic Action Front.
``In my view this tape has been fabricated by Washington to condemn bin Laden and conceal America's ugly crimes in Afghanistan,'' said Yousef Abdul Hamid, an Amman taxi driver.
A less skeptical Bahraini man said: ``If the recording was real, it only adds that bin Laden was aware of the incident but not necessarily that he had planned it.''
``It is possible that another group was behind it but had informed bin Laden about their plan,'' he concluded from the muffled tape, which was accompanied by an official U.S. translation which some Arabs described as inaccurate.
Many in the Islamic world choose to believe theories that the September 11 attacks were a plot by Israeli secret services to discredit Muslims.
To be fair, the Emirates made it officially clear that the UAE's position is the tape proves bin Laden's guilt... and I'm certain there are a great number of Arabs who know the guy's hands are filthy with this murder.
Still, sad to see that in a large part of the Middle East a truly abomnidable scumbag (who as we've seen kills Muslims with apparent ease, and orders his legions to their death as he cowers alive & well in caves) is still viewed as some heroic Pied Piper taking Islam mightily into the future. That notion is simply a pile of powdered camel s**t.
I Like To Fly From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 1188 posts, RR: 2 Reply 1, posted (12 years 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1027 times:
To be honest, I don't care what those people believe. They can think what they want, we know the tape is authentic and that Bin Laden is a worthless piece of garbage that will be rotting in hell soon. I mean really... who cares? They can go chant in their streets that America sucks all day long, I know my street is a lot better than there's anyway. If they decide to get violent and blow up parts of our country then they can expect to see our wonderful military up close. Just my $.02.
KROC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 2, posted (12 years 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1024 times:
I feel somewhere along the lines of ILikeToFly. With the delay of showing the tape, I personally thought about the fact the tape could be doctored, but I also understand the tape had to be deciphered as well. I believe in the tape, and as for the "Arab World" that disagrees, I will do something different for a change, and not say anything, because I don't think I could comment, and remain civil.
Mcringring From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 3, posted (12 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1000 times:
There really was no point in releasing the tape. Those who know he is guilty will continue to believe so and those who still think this was some kind of hoax by the US so we could have a reason to bomb Afghanistan will say the tape was fake. The tape did nothing for me. I knew Osama was a dirtbag before I saw him laughing about the thousands of people who were killed.
Isn't it odd that Mohammed Atta's father still claims his son had no part in this. I guess his son is just on "vacation." Funny almost...
Hepkat From Austria, joined Aug 2000, 2341 posts, RR: 2 Reply 5, posted (12 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 992 times:
Ok, I have to admit, when I first heard about this tape, I was very skeptical. CNN just showed it, in most of its entirety, and I have to say, I am 90% convinced it is real.
Let me explain. I spent three years living with my aunt, who is a detective, and I guess during that time I learned a lot from her. Things just don't happen coincidentally like this. Trust me. It sounds just too good to be true. What are the possibilties that we would find a tape which has Osama confessing to every single charge we have against him, and so freely? I've watched it over and over again, and although I believe it's most likely genuine, a part of me cannot believe the coincidental nature of it. And, why is the voice out of sync with the video? It looks like it was recorded using modern equipment, but I've never heard of a camcorder recording the voice out of sync with the picture, maybe one from the seventies, but surely not a modern piece of equipment. And I guess the most burning question of all is, why would Osama allow himself to videotaped, knowing the enormous bounty on his head? Ego perhaps? It just doesn't add up. I know I'll probably get flamed for this post, but I'm simply trying to think objectively while remaining detached from the outcome. Although I have to say, if it is a fake, it's a damn good one!
I would be interested in seeing a voice spectrum analysis of this, as well as having the shadows on the video analyzed.
Overall, I found the contents most disgusting. Anyone who would commission such a massacre, and delight in the results deserves to pay extraordinary retribution.
Mcringring From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 6, posted (12 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 965 times:
I think the sound is bad for 2 reasons.
1. The equipment is shit: bad camera, bad audio, bad tape.
2. The microphones on such camcorders are AWFUL. Microphones on most cameras are bad, even the highest end ones. The guy with the camera was sitting in a medium sized room and he wasn't very close to bin Laden, et al. There were also other people in the room who were not on camera and the noise from them further distorted the sound.
I really don't think bin Laden cared about being taped. He was guilty and he knew it. He knew that we knew it. This videotape would make no difference no matter who found it.
Who knows, maybe I'm wrong. I don't think this tape changes anything.
I Like To Fly From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 1188 posts, RR: 2 Reply 7, posted (12 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 959 times:
Hepkat, if I wasn't so lazy & busy I would argue most of your post... but I am both lazy & busy so I will just point out something I found amusing:
It looks like it was recorded using modern equipment...
Gee, that makes sense! You go on & on about the poor quality but it still "looks" like it was on modern equipment. Where do you get "looks"??? I don't recall a shot pointed in a mirror where you could see the camera. My guess is it was shitty equipment that has been sitting around a desert for years on equal quality tape... what do you expect? And it is also a well known fact Bin Laden likes to be video taped. I do agree the timing is almost too good, but you can't convince me it's a fake.
CPDC10-30 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2000, 4761 posts, RR: 25 Reply 11, posted (12 years 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 918 times:
The CBC has just interviewed some of the translators, and there is no way it was modified. They said there was no disagreement between them on the content of the tape. Case in point is how it was broadcast in its exact form, without being edited to skip past irrelevant parts.
LY744 From Canada, joined Feb 2001, 5536 posts, RR: 10 Reply 17, posted (12 years 22 hours ago) and read 834 times:
Glad to hear that you and your aunt (I thought it was your grandma, for some reason) are finally satisfied. It's about time you realized what the rest of the world knew three months ago. "Thinking objectively"....
Heavymetal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 18, posted (12 years 21 hours ago) and read 825 times:
If I indicated that I came to that conclusion from just this article (which I don't think I did but alas), I erred. One need only to visit even "moderate" Middle Eastern news websites to see what kid gloves are being used on bin Laden, and to understand why. Because the statement I made is correct.
I'll also add, in case you go there which I think you might, that I'm not defending the status quo in Middle Eastern countries. Does this region NEED a dynamic visionary to pull it out of repression and abuse? Sure. The fat cat shieks and princes with their fleets of casino-bound 747s are as much to blame for this imbicilic notion on the Arab Street as bin Laden is. But he is clearly insane, clearly homicidal and clearly a despot in the mold of no less than a certain starving artist from Vienna. A large chunk of the Muslim world mistakes his vision for the future as the right one....sadly, because at least he has a vision, unlike the contented ruling class too blind (or frightened) to offer one.
Alpha 1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 19, posted (12 years 21 hours ago) and read 820 times:
'Arab World' says it is a fake?
Nonsense - a couple of Arabs said it was a fake, that's all. Some French people, a few Canadians, a couple of Brits and half a dozen Russians also probably think its forged!
Please stop using every opportunity to demonise the Islamic world.
More than just " a couple of Arabs...", Ryan. You know that and I know that. I watched interviews yesterday with dozens upon dozens of people living in the Middle East, and, with few exceptions, everyone of them didn't think the tape was real, or was somehow doctored. Does that represent ALL people in the Middle East? Of course not. But you'll find, no doubt, that the majority of Arabs/Muslims around the world will not believe the tape is legitimate. Some because they adore this mutt bin Laden, some simply because of a lifetime of distrust of the American goverment.
Please stop using every opportunity to apologize for the Islamic world.
Sebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3672 posts, RR: 5 Reply 24, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 703 times:
I have no idea if it's fake or not, but please give your reasons to be so sure it's not.
BinLaden dosen't look that stupid to "forget" a tape with him talking about the attacks, and in the same time hiding and denying his responsibility.
And Twa902fly, nearly the same question: How can you be so sure it's him (and only him) ?
25 L-188: All we know is that the tape was found in a house in Kandahar. It doesn't mean it was in Binnies posession. Besides if you had to leave someplace in a
26 Alpha 1: He's not stupid, Sebolino, you are correct in that assertion. I think he's got like a Master's Degree in Engineering. But you're talking also about a
27 Delta-flyer: Whether the tape is fake or not does not matter. To some, it is fake, regardless of any evidence that it is real. To others, the opposite is true. The