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More Vista Security Woes  
User currently offlineIFEMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1993 times:

Just any FYI for anyone currently running or considering running Windows Vista, it's not as secure as Microsoft make it out to be:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/6331959.stm

Fair use excerpt:

Quote:
The security testing group found that Live OneCare missed far more active viruses than any other program tested.



Quote:
When Vista was launched on 30 January, Microsoft chairman Bill Gates claimed that it was "dramatically more secure" than other operating systems.

Reading the results at Virus Bulletin, the following products achieved the VB100 award on the Vista platform:

Avast, CA, Quick Heal, NOD32, Fortinet, AVG, Kaspersky, Sophos, and F-Secure. Each of these detected and prevented 100% of all known viruses and variants.

The following products did not achieve VB100 as they did not detect all known viruses and variants:

Live OneCare, G-Data AntiVirusKit, McAfee VirusScan Enterprise 8.51 and Norman Virus Control 5.90

Live OneCare was the lowest scorer, with 99.91%

135 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAirbusA346 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2004, 7437 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1979 times:

Klaus will soon be saying - "buy a Mac"  Wink

Tom.



Tom Walker '086' First Officer of a A318/A319 for Air Lambert - Hours Flown: 17 hour 05 minutes (last updated 24/12/05).
User currently offlineIFEMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1975 times:

Quoting AirbusA346 (Reply 1):
Klaus will soon be saying - "buy a Mac"

In that case, I'll go there before him.

Considering the fact that we're just seeing the same old Microsoft skeletons coming out of a closet that might look nice and shiny but isn't what Microsoft are saying it is, I think now is the time switch to a Mac.

Honestly, I can see Vista being the biggest mistake Microsoft ever made, and it's becoming more and more obvious that MS are several years behind Apple on several levels with their technology.

My god, I can't believe I'm saying this. A year ago, I would have sworn away from Macs. Now, with the way Microsoft have botched this product, if I want things to 'just work', I don't have a choice. I'm happy to pay a few hundred bucks more for something I can rely on.


User currently offlineRammstein From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1972 times:

Quoting IFEMaster (Thread starter):
it's not as secure as Microsoft make it out to be:

Do you remember Microsoft's commercials, when Windows 95 was published?  Big grin


User currently offlineAirbusA346 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2004, 7437 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1968 times:

Quoting Rammstein (Reply 3):

Nope, can you show us some.

Tom.



Tom Walker '086' First Officer of a A318/A319 for Air Lambert - Hours Flown: 17 hour 05 minutes (last updated 24/12/05).
User currently offlineIFEMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1965 times:

Quoting Rammstein (Reply 3):
Do you remember Microsoft's commercials, when Windows 95 was published?

Was that the series with 'Start Me Up' as the music, and they all revolved around the Start button?

Even better is when Windows 98 crashed during a live public demo...



"Moving right along..."  laughing 


User currently offlineRammstein From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1956 times:

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 5):

Was that the series with 'Start Me Up' as the music, and they all revolved around the Start button?

Exactly. And

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 5):
Even better is when Windows 98 crashed during a live public demo...

you were faster than me, I was posting it  Wink


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21418 posts, RR: 54
Reply 7, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1954 times:

Quoting AirbusA346 (Reply 1):
Klaus will soon be saying - "buy a Mac"

I've never stopped saying that!  mischievous 


User currently offlineIFEMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1950 times:

Quoting Rammstein (Reply 6):
Exactly. And

And don't remember exactly the content...remind me.


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21418 posts, RR: 54
Reply 9, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1930 times:

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 5):
Was that the series with 'Start Me Up' as the music, and they all revolved around the Start button?

Ironically, the lyrics of the Rolling Stones song they licensed for that campaign also say "You make a grown man cry"...  mischievous 


User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1915 times:

Quoting IFEMaster (Thread starter):
Reading the results at Virus Bulletin, the following products achieved the VB100 award on the Vista platform:

Avast, CA, Quick Heal, NOD32, Fortinet, AVG, Kaspersky, Sophos, and F-Secure. Each of these detected and prevented 100% of all known viruses and variants.

The following products did not achieve VB100 as they did not detect all known viruses and variants:

Live OneCare, G-Data AntiVirusKit, McAfee VirusScan Enterprise 8.51 and Norman Virus Control 5.90

Live OneCare was the lowest scorer, with 99.91%

And how many of these will RUN or affect a vista computer?


User currently offlineIFEMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1897 times:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 10):
And how many of these will RUN or affect a vista computer?

Moot point, Ted. Microsoft have been bragging about how secure Vista is, yet when it's put under the microscope and tested, it's yet another part of Vista that doesn't live up to the hype Microsoft have put through the loud hailer. The VB test isn't about running a computer, it's about protecting it from malice.


User currently offlineKaddyuk From Wallis and Futuna, joined Nov 2001, 4126 posts, RR: 26
Reply 12, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1882 times:

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 11):
Moot point, Ted. Microsoft have been bragging about how secure Vista is, yet when it's put under the microscope and tested, it's yet another part of Vista that doesn't live up to the hype Microsoft have put through the loud hailer. The VB test isn't about running a computer, it's about protecting it from malice.

You're talking about 3rd party software here, NO company will guarentee 3rd party software.

Virus' are designed to bypass OS Security otherwise they're not a virus. If you want a secure Vista computer, dont buy any of these Virus Scanners:

Quoting IFEMaster (Thread starter):
Live OneCare, G-Data AntiVirusKit, McAfee VirusScan Enterprise 8.51 and Norman Virus Control 5.90



Whoever said "laughter is the best medicine" never had Gonorrhea
User currently offlineDL787932ER From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 597 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1882 times:

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 2):
Honestly, I can see Vista being the biggest mistake Microsoft ever made

Heh...I can recall people saying the same thing about every OS Microsoft has ever released.

Here's how it'll play out: Microsoft will make inflated, exaggerated claims about their new OS. Microsoft-bashers will make inflated, exaggerated claims about how their new OS is the worst software ever. The truth is that it will have some improvements, which won't be world-changing, and some downfalls, which will be corrected...sooner or later.

And in two years, 95% of computers on the planet will be running the new OS, all but a few of them won't care about the "OS war" that exists in the minds of a few Mac and Linux fanatics, and the world will go on. Just like every other time.



F L Y D E L T A J E T S
User currently offlineIFEMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1873 times:

Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 12):
Virus' are designed to bypass OS Security otherwise they're not a virus.

Precisely, and Microsoft own protection, as an integral part of Vista or as a seperate product, however you want to look at it, isn't doing what other third parties are. You'd think that Microsoft of all people would know the intricacies of their own operating system well enough to produce a useful security product to protect it.


User currently offlineCba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4531 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1859 times:

Yet another reason I'm happy that I switched to a Mac... once you go Mac, you never go back!

To be honest though, every new version of Windows has these hitches, that's why you never upgrade immediately. Wait for the .1 version to come out, or the patch. In a year, these problems will have been hammered out to a large extent, and Vista will be a decent operating system. Won't hold a candle to the new MacOs, but it will be use able.


User currently offlineN231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1852 times:

Quoting IFEMaster (Thread starter):
Live OneCare was the lowest scorer, with 99.91%

Live OneCare sucks...I tried it, and it only lasted on my PC for a week. What a waste of USD$49.00.


User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 1799 times:

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 11):
Moot point, Ted.

Are you on crack??

That's like saying MS should detect software that is designed to run on Macs.. You deserve your fate buddy.


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21418 posts, RR: 54
Reply 18, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 1790 times:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 17):
That's like saying MS should detect software that is designed to run on Macs..

How so? As far as I understand the test, Microsoft's own "protection" could not counteract quite a number of attacks. That is very much relevant!

From the BBC article:

Quote:
Microsoft's Windows Live OneCare security tool was one of four products that failed independent tests carried out by the Virus Bulletin.

The security testing group found that Live OneCare missed far more active viruses than any other program tested.

To pass the tests anti-virus tools must spot and stop 100% of the malicious programs used to attack them.

Nothing alien about it, probably quite close to real-life scenarios many people happen to have.

The fact appears to be that Microsoft themselves are not capable of providing adequate security for their very own operating system.

If that doesn't instill a sense of trust...!  crazy 

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 17):
You deserve your fate buddy.

Everybody deserves a Macintosh...!  bigthumbsup 


User currently offlineMham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3575 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 1768 times:

You Mac guys are getting delerious. This has nothing to do with Vista, its an anti-virus program, not the operating system. sheesh.

User currently offlineItsjustme From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 2768 posts, RR: 10
Reply 20, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 1756 times:

Quoting Mham001 (Reply 19):
You Mac guys are getting delerious. This has nothing to do with Vista, its an anti-virus program, not the operating system. sheesh.

Yep. Just the usual anti-Microsoft crowd attempting to spin a story. You guys need to try a little harder. It isn't about Vista, it's about certain anti-virus programs, "Live OneCare" included, failing to be 100% effective in detecting viruses.

Here is another version of the report. This paragraph sums up the real story: "With the number of delays that we've seen in Vista's release, there's no excuse for security vendors not to have got their products right by now," said John Hawes, technical consultant at Virus Bulletin. "In these days of hourly updates, it's always a surprise and a disappointment to see major products missing them (viruses). Vista cannot fend off today's malware without help from security products. It certainly looks like people upgrading to the new platform are going to need additional security solutions". It's not the supposed lack of security of Vista, it's the failure of the makers of anti-virus software to design their products to be more effective.


User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8700 posts, RR: 43
Reply 21, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 1744 times:

Quoting Itsjustme (Reply 20):
It's not the supposed lack of security of Vista

Huh?

Quoting Itsjustme (Reply 20):
Vista cannot fend off today's malware without help from security products. It certainly looks like people upgrading to the new platform are going to need additional security solutions"

 wink 

The point is that M$'s "most secure ever" OS still isn't capable of fending off attacks without additional software. That's exactly what people tire of: having to install, run and update anti-virus, anti-trojan and anti-spyware software plus firewalls, monthly "critical updates" and so on. If it weren't for that, no one would be complaining about the insecurity of Windows.



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineItsjustme From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 2768 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 1737 times:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 21):

The point is that M$'s "most secure ever" OS still isn't capable of fending off attacks without additional software.

I'm not disputing that. All I am saying is the articles that have been quoted are addressing the fact that some name brand anti-virus programs, McAfee, Microsoft, etc... failed miserably when their virus detection capabilities were put to the test on attacks against Vista.


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21418 posts, RR: 54
Reply 23, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 1726 times:

Quoting Itsjustme (Reply 22):
I'm not disputing that. All I am saying is the articles that have been quoted are addressing the fact that some name brand anti-virus programs, McAfee, Microsoft, etc... failed miserably when their virus detection capabilities were put to the test on attacks against Vista.

In light of Microsoft's earlier attempts to keep competing "security" software manufacturers away from Vista at far as possible it's certainly not a good omen for "the most secure Windows yet"...!


User currently offlineWSOY From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1722 times:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 23):
In light of Microsoft's earlier attempts to keep competing "security" software manufacturers away from Vista at far as possible

What might that mean in reality? Why do you put "security" in quotation marks?


25 Post contains images TedTAce : I'm not saying the protection is perfect, but when you are talking about vista ignoring software that CAN't attack it you are buying into the Microso
26 Klaus : I haven't bothered to dig deeper yet, but my impression from the article is that the malware that got through is very well capable of attacking Vista
27 Itsjustme : Exactly. The thrust of the articles was to bring to light the inadequacies of the anti-virus programs that were tested, not necessarily the OS that w
28 Aloges : That would be aggressive marketing. I've never heard of "dirty" sales tactics employed by Apple - could be though - and M$ on the other hand is known
29 Cba : Most people don't realize that there is a usable alternative to Windows out there that can run their every day programs, they simply just don't know.
30 TedTAce : Be My Guest. I might end up looking like the fool, but I would be surprised.
31 Klaus : Well, the programs can only fail to protect what open flanks the OS already has, so it is relevant to look at the OS... In my experience it's a colle
32 Post contains images TedTAce : While I'm pro Windows, I'm certainly NOT anti MAC.
33 StarAC17 : I think the Mac supporters are missing one big thing and that is that of all the computer systems they are a huge minority and are the most part ignor
34 IFEMaster : No. Are you? Not at all. The malware that Live OneCare failed to detect and prevent was designed to attack Vista. Microsoft, being the only company o
35 Post contains images TedTAce : Sucessfully?
36 IFEMaster : Yes, successfully. Like I said, subscribe and read the bulletin. We've got: 1. A flaw that allows user privileges to be adjusted (an issues that has
37 Post contains images David L : So, basically Vista is no less secure than XP and you can get protection software that deals with "100% of all known viruses and variants"? I won't lo
38 TedTAce : Grandpa Jims MAC users guide to windows?
39 IFEMaster : If that's what you need, be my guest, but I was referring to the Virus Bulletin referenced in the thread starter.
40 Post contains links and images TedTAce :    You are actually trusting the media? Who the Eff are they? They look like they have been around for a couple years trying to make a name for the
41 Post contains images David L : I was an Amiga nut for about 12 years after it was launched and when I started using Windows 3.0 and NT 3.5 at work I did nothing but moan about how
42 Post contains images IFEMaster : Ted, Ted, Ted...when you're done getting out of Bill Gates' bed, look in to VB further. The tests they perform are industry standard tests. The resul
43 TedTAce : I haven't paid for a Microsoft OS since '95 Seeing as you are a subscriber I wonder who's in bed with who? As to the wiki reference, sure, it's not a
44 David L : And several products achieved the VB100 award... "on the Vista. platform".
45 IFEMaster : Oh, so you're a software thief as well? Maybe F.A.S.T. can help you out. Or are you still using Windows 95? Indeed. I subscribe to Guitar Player, so
46 Post contains images TedTAce : Will they get me a faster computer? No, I have usually been fortunate to find a sponsor. Vista Might be the first OS I'll choose to buy once I feel I
47 IFEMaster : Well, when you fail to address any of the facts at hand, but instead attempt to divert your arguements to the fact that I subscribe to an industry le
48 Post contains links WSOY : Free signup for a Vista antivir package -- VB100 awarded, 32-bit only http://support.f-secure.com/avvista/[Edited 2007-02-07 22:51:43]
49 Post contains links and images TedTAce : It's a British thing I guess. Oh you mean like this?: http://www.cnn.com/2007/TECH/02/07/gates.security.ap/index.html Now THAT is a security issue wi
50 IFEMaster : Hahaha! Okay, Ted. If you say so. Although, you should really check the number of countries and organizations represented at the 2006 VB conference.
51 Post contains images TedTAce : What's Mac's answer? Did you read what the vulnerability is?
52 IFEMaster : Any enterprise organization isn't going be using a Mac as a server containing such comparable information. Yep, I read what the vulnerability is. We'
53 TedTAce : You'd be stunned.
54 IFEMaster : I'm sure I would, but I've never seen, and I've been around a lot enterprise level server farms.
55 Itsjustme : I agree with what you're saying but, again, you are misunderstanding the focus of the quoted articles. Look at these 2 opening sentences from the BBC
56 David L : Agreed. Not only that but... So, the story is that some 3rd party protection software works extremely well and some doesn't work quite as well. What'
57 Post contains links Mham001 : Thats very odd Klaus, yesterday's San Jose Mercury News has an long article reporting just the opposite. it says that Microsoft rented office space t
58 Post contains links and images Klaus : My, aren't we nice today! Symantec: Microsoft won't give us key Vista tech | CNET News.com And as bonus quote: Malware more compatible with Vista tha
59 WSOY : Klaus, if you have the source handy, it saves everybody's time to post it as you make your claim. I see you very rarely actually link to anything x-t
60 KaiGywer : Exactly. They use what works for them. And since Mac certainly isn't ten times better, they can remain a niche for anti-Microsoft fanatics. So does D
61 Itsjustme : Same here. We have a total of 7 PC's at home, 3 desktops and 4 laptops. All either running Win2K or XP, most of them 24/7, 7 days a week (with an occ
62 Post contains images TedTAce : By Proxy, and with a couple of real exceptions; so have I Last 'real' job was supporting BackupExec. One of my more infamous calls was a major corpor
63 Post contains images Klaus : Sure. The reason was they were pushed into corporate accounts by IBM (until they more or less kicked IBM out of the bed). After that they were buildi
64 Post contains images KaiGywer : Hi I'm Kai. Nice to meet you too Guess I'm a rarity as well
65 Post contains images Klaus : If you're buying Microsoft products for their quality, yes you are. I'm not telling you they're worse than they really are, but that there's actually
66 IFEMaster : I think Steve Jobs says it best:
67 Post contains links Dougloid : Gaacccck....W98 was a huge turd....the theme song should have been "96 Tears" by Question Mark and the Mysterians. Klaus, you seem to be a fan of pop
68 Post contains images TedTAce : Try ME: That was Turd to the 23rd power and pi$$ed on by a 1/2 dead goat.
69 IFEMaster : W98 was a huge turd in it's first release. It was pretty decent (decent being that it crashed less) by the time W98-SE rolled around, and in all incar
70 Post contains images Klaus : Not especially - I'm a fan of poignant quotes wherever they may come from! Sounds somewhat fitting relative to what many people want and expect from
71 Post contains images Dougloid : It seems as if my description of W98 has met with some approval...cue Question Mark and the Mysterians
72 WSOY : This hastily slapped piece of junk just happened to sport some of the very fundamentals of an open, extensible system. The freedom started with the P
73 IFEMaster : Which Microsoft has yet to do, I'll hasten to add.
74 Dan2002 : Have you used it yet?
75 Post contains images N231YE : [joking] I'm gonna get me that bling-bling turd bro! [/joking-mind the politically incorrectness]
76 Post contains images Klaus : To get out of the bowl, they would have had to make massive and fundamental changes all over the system relative to the earlier versions I know. Unfo
77 Itsjustme : Gee, Steve Jobs bad mouthing Microsoft. How original. Not to mention that, from his appearance in the video compared to his actual appearance, that c
78 IFEMaster : No need to do any better, because what he said then still stands true today. Microsoft make third rate products.
79 Theredbaron : My Windows Xp crashed badly last week (the infamuos blue screen of death), so I reinstalled Xp and put a new 250 Gb sta drive and proceeded to install
80 Post contains links Dougloid : Yes. http://www.96tears.net/band.html
81 DeskPilot : I assume you meant that XP died with a BSOD during startup and that you couldn't recover. So, did you remove your USB memory (key ?) and try installi
82 WSOY : That's spot on! BUT, MS has a certain customer base that has some valuable applications they want to keep. It's fine for Apple to change radically ev
83 WSOY : Sorry to interrupt you (again), but what do you mean? Have you ever actually activated a copy of Windows yourself? Klaus, are you aware that there ar
84 Itsjustme : Yet >90% of the hundreds of millions of people who use computers on a daily basis still continue to use these "third rate products" as you call them.
85 David L : That's what I was wondering. I've activated four copies of XP once each initially, plus a couple of times when I changed most of the hardware. I've e
86 KaiGywer : Exactly. Unless you have a pirated version, the activation is seemless and painless.
87 Post contains images Klaus : I think you're suffering from a mild delusion there. By far most of the Windows users I've met so far have grudgingly resigned to putting up with Win
88 KaiGywer : Why the hell would you "not reach Microsoft"? When you first install Windows, it'll ask you to activate it by clicking a button. You click, it activa
89 Klaus : Provided you happen to have online access, provided you haven't exceeded the imposed activation limits and provided nothing goes wrong... In effect y
90 IFEMaster : Two reasons: 1. Most people don't know they have a viable and certainly better alternative. 2. Microsoft's aggressive marketing (which I will give th
91 WSOY : It shows that Klaus has just activated one copy of Windows ever. If your internet connection is down, you call an automate at a toll-free number and
92 IFEMaster : There have been numerous (count, hundreds of thousands) of reported activation issues, especially since Microsoft launched their 'Genuine Advantage'
93 Post contains images Klaus : Why would anybody willingly forgo such a load of "fun" when they have the choice...? Especially since most people do have a choice!
94 KaiGywer : I've formatted my laptop probably three or four times, each time having to reactivate my Windows. Never had a problem. Also installed Win XP on Adopim
95 WSOY : If you're over the installation limits, you'll have to call. Unfortunately there's no way of telling if you're moving the OS illlegally, or installin
96 WSOY : For once it's useful to come from a small and confined linguistic area.
97 Dougloid : My experience with re-registering XP on Frankenstein (my standby IBM Aptiva) after a hard drive upgrade was pretty simple. Yes, I did have to call so
98 Klaus : Why? In over ten years of using Macs, I've only managed to need one single re-install when I carelessly damaged my boot disk (under "Classic" MacOS p
99 Klaus : So far. Unfortunately experiences like IFEMaster's above are not entirely uncommon, even with perfectly legal products. It's why required activation
100 IFEMaster : Well this is exactly my point. Most people are happy to accept the above hassle and just pass it off as normal. Things should be better. Why should I
101 Post contains images KaiGywer : Because I like to refresh my computer every so often Which are?
102 Theredbaron : Simply put the miriad of diferrent products/drivers/cards and such make any instalation of a OS by microsoft a Nightmare. Then add on top of that the
103 Klaus : I've never had a need or desire to spend my time with that kind of thing. Macs don't "rot" the way Windows does. They simply keep on going. Here you
104 WSOY : "Windows rot" is a myth. That's all there is to it.
105 KaiGywer : None of those things have happened to me. I did have a harddrive die in a desktop computer, but that was hardware failure (IBM Deathstar) and nothing
106 IFEMaster : Oooohhh...ho ho ho.... You couldn't be more wrong. Windows most certainly does rot. The term just needs clarifying. If I installed Windows and just l
107 WSOY : Because you were over your installation limit, once per machine. I myself have found no problem having my calls answered (minding the office hours) o
108 Klaus : Great. Many other legitimate users were less lucky. Usually. And even then it's a slap in the user's face which I'm not particularly fond of.
109 KaiGywer : Kinda like being fingerprinted?
110 LYRFlyer : When is it not a breeze except for when you try to install an illegal copy then? It's not a slap in ther user's face, at least not to me. I clearly u
111 WSOY : I see. If it's not a myth, my schooling says you must provide exact evidence on what was amiss with the Register, where, and by whom it was recorded,
112 IFEMaster : My point exactly! Microsoft aren't thinking like a consumer. They are cubicle people producing cubicle system with cubicle rules. Honestly...really..
113 IFEMaster : The fact that you're calling the Windows registry the "Register" is evidence enough that you don't really know what you're talking about when it come
114 LYRFlyer : Ha! That's funny! I switched to a MAC two years ago, didn't like it at all, now I use PC again. Vista is much better than OSX IMO. Things didn't "jus
115 IFEMaster : Try again. Vista has been modeled on OSX.
116 LYRFlyer : I'm not going to use OSX again. Sorry. Vista runs a lot more applications, and I've never had any security issues with XP service pack 2, and I've no
117 Post contains images IFEMaster : Two words for you: "Parallel's Coherence" Now, nobody will have an excuse
118 Post contains images LYRFlyer : I'm not going to pay for a mac with the same specs as a PC that costs a few 100 USD less, especially since I don't like using OSX
119 IFEMaster : This has been covered in other threads, but to recap: Exact spec for exact spec, Apple hardware is no more expensive than comparable PC hardware, plu
120 LYRFlyer : I know it has, and that is not what I learned by reading the threads. I learned that PCs are cheaper when it comes to hardware alone, but MACs come w
121 Post contains links IFEMaster : Well, I just saw your other thread, so I guess you're still in the honeymoon period. Lets talk again in a few months. And it's not 800 new features.
122 Post contains images Tmatt95 : I am sory it has been covered and you are wrong. It depends on how much you are willing to spend on the computer. Go into and PC shop and compare the
123 Mham001 : It may stop a person from just passing his disk around, but I can buy a working copy of Xp or Vista for $3 in Manila. Point is, the registration hoop
124 Post contains images LYRFlyer : And I just saw some of your previous posts.. I'm surprised you haven't been divorced yet after a year using OSX " target=_blank>http://www.microsoft.
125 Tmatt95 : Not as burdensome as being tied into buying your computer from Apple, as Apple program their OS not to run on any other platform bar their own.
126 IFEMaster : Why would I be? OSX is superior to Windows for everything that I do. And that's great. Different strokes for different folks. At least you tried OSX.
127 Post contains images LYRFlyer : Well that's good for you. It isn't for me, so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. True. You bet. Time to stop the Apple vs Microsoft debate and
128 Post contains images Tmatt95 : That is the best coment I have read in the whole thread!! Matt
129 Post contains images LYRFlyer : Thanks! Well what can I say, I am a genious
130 Klaus : That is all nice and well as far as people actually have a comparison. You yourself have never actually used a Mac from what you told in earlier thre
131 Tmatt95 : That would be great if this thread was a true comparison, which it is not. A comparison, involves comparing, which is not happening in this thread. A
132 Post contains images LYRFlyer : Please explain. Well said!! The best comment that I've read in this thread so far Some of the Mac users in here are the last people I would ask for a
133 Klaus : Well this thread is about Vista's problematic sides. There has been extensive discussion about that. And since one apparently increasingly popular re
134 LYRFlyer : I think you remember correctly, but I used the Mac for several months.. I think I gave it a fair chance.. It is not a bad OS at all, it is just that
135 Srbmod : Since the thread has strayed off-topic, it is now being locked.
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