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Article By Galloway On Chavez  
User currently offlineJoni From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 1205 times:

This is prety interesting, even if it doesn't really containy much that's new as such.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/story/0,,2023038,00.html

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5599 posts, RR: 20
Reply 1, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 1186 times:

What's so "interesting" about the article, Joni? George Galloway, who is Britain's Oswald Mosley of the 21st century, notorious for his admiration for any communist and/or ME dicator playing useful idiot for Chavez once again. Is that what impresses you?  Yeah sure

User currently offlineJAL777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 1186 times:

One blowhard raving about another blowhard. Good grief!  

I hate HATE politicians.  

[Edited 2007-02-28 11:04:19]

User currently offlineMdsh00 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4124 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 1129 times:

Having gone to PMV for the weekend, after visiting a year and a half ago, Venezuela is still the poor, run down, dangerous, and crooked place that it was 18 months ago. Hell, things definitely cost more. The only redeeming quality being that the people are very nice there.

Those who think Chavez is doing wonderful things for his people are either socialists themselves, or they just buy into his "Imperialist America" rhetoric (which I think many Venezuelans don't fall for as I came across many who said they love the US).



"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8876 posts, RR: 40
Reply 4, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 1116 times:

Having read just the first two paragraphs thus far, interesting how this guy brings in the whole world into the discussion. From Lat. Am., to the USA, to London, to the Mid East. Even something about Cheney.

Oh and the "new" Mirages  sarcastic 



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 1112 times:

Mr. Galloway should come down to Venezuela and see what Chávez has done with the country. And also, why doesn't he also ask the opinions of people down in Latin America, as this region tends to be directly influenced by Chávez's foreign policies? As long as he hasn't seen what is going on, he'll still be just another Chávez apologist and his article doesn't change anything.  Yeah sure

Nice try, Joni, but you haven't convinced those of us who live in Latin America and actually have to put up with Chávez's hate speeches and see what he's doing to Venezuela. And I strongly suggest you put your flame suit on, for when Luis sees your thread.


User currently offlineCarmenlu15 From Guatemala, joined Dec 2004, 4748 posts, RR: 32
Reply 6, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 1105 times:

The so-called "dictator" Chávez is nothing of the kind. He has won election after election, validating his radical course.

Funny, I can think of several other "dictators" who were also freely elected...

Guy should try living in Venezuela for a while before spouting off his  redflag , methinks.

- Carmen



Being a pioneer in any field is not by itself a guarantee of continued success - Pan Am, anyone?
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8876 posts, RR: 40
Reply 7, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 1104 times:

Yeah right all of Latin America except Mexico, Peru, and Colombia are allies to Chavez. Chaves has three allies: Bolivia, Ecuador, and Nicaragua.

Quote from the first reply to his article:

Now, moving on to the thrust of the article on Chavez. I know we shouldn't always form a judgement on someone based on the people they associate with, but I can't help feeling suspicious of national leaders who have a personal relationship with George Galloway.

For all your talk of human right rights and democracy in Venezuela in this article, we know you're a huge fan of the human rights abuser Fidel Castro - someone who doesn't know what an election is and puts political opponents in prison - and have written a handy guide book about him for fellow followers. We also know that you famously had your political campaigns funded by that other great democrat, Saddam Hussein, according to the Guardian, (CiF better not remove this post; Galloway has never disputed the article and it is very relevent to the topic)

/quote

edit: Mr. Ortega is president of Nicaragua. . .

[Edited 2007-02-28 22:23:38]


"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineBanco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 54
Reply 8, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 1099 times:

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 5):
And also, why doesn't he also ask the opinions of people down in Latin America,

He doesn't even bother asking the views of his constituents in Bethnal Green, so that might just be a hope too far...



She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 9, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1086 times:

EDIT: The error made by PPVRA to wrongfully label Costa Rica as Chávez supporter has been fixed.

[Edited 2007-02-28 22:29:16]

User currently offlineCarmenlu15 From Guatemala, joined Dec 2004, 4748 posts, RR: 32
Reply 10, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1080 times:

Err... never mind  Silly

[Edited 2007-02-28 22:30:49]


Being a pioneer in any field is not by itself a guarantee of continued success - Pan Am, anyone?
User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 11, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1080 times:

Quoting Carmenlu15 (Reply 10):
Maybe he meant Nicaragua instead of Costa Rica?

See my above reply, I just noticed that he corrected himself.


User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8876 posts, RR: 40
Reply 12, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1074 times:

My bad guys. .  silly 


"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineAndesSMF From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1058 times:

So, Chavez is spending money in the miliary instead of using it for his people.

What a waste.


User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1058 times:

Galloway is what I'm talking about when I mention "wide-eyed apologists". He's been suckered into thinking like Hugo and Fidel are just fun loving guys, who are just "progressive".

What they are are dictators, who take freedoms away from their people and call it "progress".

Yeah, real interesting, Joni.


User currently offlineLuisde8cd From Pitcairn Islands, joined Aug 2004, 2537 posts, RR: 31
Reply 15, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1058 times:

I quote the article:
"Much more is at stake than London mayor Ken Livingstone's welcome oil deal with Chávez, which will see London bus fares halved"

Interesting economics, please explain how a 20% discount on diesel will transform into a 50% reduction of bus fares. My math cannot help me understand that phrase.

"this month I watched with Chávez as thousands of soldiers, French and British tanks, Russian helicopters and brand new Mirage and Sukhoi fighter bombers passed by: the soldiers chanting "patria, socialismo o muerte"

We DO NOT have BRAND NEW Mirage fighters. They were actually bought during the late 70s. We DO NOT have british tanks, only French AMXs. This guy has no clue of what he's talking about. He also forgot to mention the squads of USA-Made F-16s and F-5s

"Chávez has been given enabling powers for 18 months to ensure he can pilot his reforms through entrenched opposition"

What opposition? HELLO, you just mentioned that Chavez controls 100% of Parliament after the 2006 elections boycotted by the opposition... he has ABSOLUTE NO POLITICAL OPPOSITION, I don't think he needed the power to rule-by-decree. The Attourney General was Chavez's first Vicepresident in 2000. All Supreme Court judges were elected by Chavez's deputies in Parliament about 2 years ago. The judges chanted "Uh Ah Chavez no se va" (Chavez will never leave!) at the beginning of the 2007 judicial year. What opposition does Chavez have? NONE.

"The $18bn fund for social welfare set up by Chávez is already bearing fruit. Education, food distribution and primary healthcare programmes now cover the majority for the first time."

Before Chavez the goverments used to have more social programs that what Chavez is doing right now, a couple come to mind: "School Backpack" (a backpack full of school supplies was handed out each year to all students in public schools), "School Daily Meal and Milk" (a daily lunch and a glass of milk in the morning given out for free to all public school students), etc etc... Another example: President Caldera built more houses for poor families in one single year than Chavez in five years. This is extraordinary considering that Pres. Caldera ruled when the oil barrel was priced at around USD 9.

Public education in Venezuela is a joke. Please tell me how many goverment officials currently have their kids attend a public school.

"The so-called "dictator" Chávez is nothing of the kind. He has won election after election, validating his radical course. Still the fear of a coup"

The guy won elections, ok. But where's the democracy in this country? Chavez controls all powers (Judiciary, Legislative and Executive) and you are treated as a second-class citizen if you signed the recall-vote petition against Chavez back in 2004, a perfect revival of South Africa's apartheid.


I'm sorry Joni but this article is a joke, come to Venezuela and learn the truth. I'm sure you are one of those Europeans who hate Bush and automatically fall in love with Chavez because he's insults Bush's mother everyday.I'm sorry but, How much more ignorant can you get?


Saludos desde Caracas,
Luis


User currently offlineDavid L From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 9484 posts, RR: 42
Reply 16, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1049 times:

Quoting Banco (Reply 8):
He doesn't even bother asking the views of his constituents in Bethnal Green, so that might just be a hope too far...

It was the same when he was my MP for a few years in Hillhead, Glasgow - far too busy galavanting round the world on his own agenda to bother with his constituents.


User currently offlineBanco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 54
Reply 17, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1032 times:

Quoting David L (Reply 16):
It was the same when he was my MP for a few years in Hillhead, Glasgow

Roy Jenkins to George Galloway. That's like getting Steps to replace the Beatles. Poor you.



She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
User currently offlineAndesSMF From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1032 times:

Quoting Luisde8cd (Reply 15):
He has won election after election

So did Stalin and many communist leaders during the cold war. And even Saddam won elections with 100% of the votes going to him.


User currently offlineDavid L From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 9484 posts, RR: 42
Reply 19, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1022 times:

Quoting Banco (Reply 17):
Roy Jenkins to George Galloway. That's like getting Steps to replace the Beatles. Poor you.

Actually, it started out Tory. Then the council houses and boundary changes came along.  Smile


User currently offlineTheCol From Canada, joined Jan 2007, 2032 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (7 years 1 month 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 964 times:

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 13):
So, Chavez is spending money in the miliary instead of using it for his people.

Where have we seen that before? Can you say "Guns or Butter"?

Quoting Joni (Thread starter):

I take it that you support Chavez?



No matter how random things may appear, there's always a plan.
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