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America - Cannot Win For Losing!  
User currently offlineVANGUARD737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 683 posts, RR: 4
Posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1926 times:

I understand all of the problems with America...I hear about them every day in our own wonderful media, the European media, and all of our international friends on airliners.net

My question is why do we never hear of the problems with other countries? Do they not exist? Could it actually be that the rest of the world is just perfect and somehow the US is a renegade creating each and every problem today?

I hardly think that is the case.

Many people LOVE to stereotype Americans as being fat, lazy, uninformed, gun-toters, criminal killers, etc. Yet amazingly, most of these same people have never spent any time in America, except maybe on vacation.

So, what makes it perfectly alright for everyone else to tell us how terrible we are, but if Americans dare point fingers at anyone else we are all of a sudden the bad guy? Many of you have never even been here! It's all stereotypes!

I consider myself an informed person. I follow global events, I speak fluent German, I know alot about European history - probably more than most Europeans! But, I always know, that if I dare criticize anyone from Europe and to a lesser-extent people from other nations -- I will within 10 minutes be labeled an arrogant American. WHY???!!! Just tell me WHY!!!

It just gets to me because I feel most Americans are good people and are misunderstood and it sucks when people always spew stereotypes about us. I don't think the US is any better than any other country - but I don't think we are any worse either!

Pfeww...had to just get that off my chest!

 Smile


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73 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1908 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
So, what makes it perfectly alright for everyone else to tell us how terrible we are, but if Americans dare point fingers at anyone else we are all of a sudden the bad guy?

Because we start fights we have no business in and more importantly don't have a clue how to stop.


User currently offlineVANGUARD737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 683 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1908 times:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 1):
Because we start fights we have no business in and more importantly don't have a clue how to stop.

Nothing like generalizations...the true sign of intelligence.



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User currently offlineBanco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 53
Reply 3, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1891 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Reply 2):
Nothing like generalizations...the true sign of intelligence.

Ahem:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
Many people LOVE to stereotype Americans as being fat, lazy, uninformed, gun-toters, criminal killers, etc.



She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
User currently offlineAirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1889 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
My question is why do we never hear of the problems with other countries?

Just go to the internet and pull up media from other countries and your question is answered about problems in other countries. Apparently the bean counters that run our media system would rather feed us fluff instead of real news. I can remember when the major networks had reporters all over the world..

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
but I don't think we are any worse either!

I can imagine that every country has its own set of concerns..i.e much rather be here than in Hugo land!


User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1883 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Reply 2):
Nothing like generalizations...the true sign of intelligence.

Nothing like insulting people who respond to your threads to make yourself feel better about how un-important you are huh?


User currently offlineVANGUARD737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 683 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1883 times:

Quoting Banco (Reply 3):
Ahem:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
Many people LOVE to stereotype Americans as being fat, lazy, uninformed, gun-toters, criminal killers, etc.

And your point is? I was stating and recognizing stereotypes about Americans which are stupid and untrue - not agreeing with them.



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User currently offlineConfuscius From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 3863 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1877 times:

I don't think the US is any better than any other country..."

You just insulted the majority of Bush's supporters.



Ain't I a stinker?
User currently offlineMDorBust From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1877 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
Pfeww...had to just get that off my chest!

You do realize that instead of owning up to their ridiculous behavior, the very same people that you just ranted about are going to come in here and defend the very behavior you pointed out?

For example:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 1):
Because we start fights we have no business in and more importantly don't have a clue how to stop.

I'm sure the European colonial powers could tell us a thing or two about that.

Dear France, how are Indochina and Algeria going these days?
Spain, did you have a problem with Mexico?
Ah England, your list is too long to start.


User currently offlineVANGUARD737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 683 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1868 times:

Quoting Confuscius (Reply 7):
You just insulted the majority of Bush's supporters.

True...but in classic airliners.net fashion no one has yet to answer any of my questions lol!  Smile



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User currently offlineVANGUARD737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 683 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1862 times:

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 8):
You do realize that instead of owning up to their ridiculous behavior, the very same people that you just ranted about are going to come in here and defend the very behavior you pointed out?



Absolutely! But luckily I am a tough cookie

[Edited 2007-02-28 22:46:50]


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User currently offlineMBMBOS From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2597 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1862 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Reply 2):
Nothing like generalizations...the true sign of intelligence.

1.

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
My question is why do we never hear of the problems with other countries?

2.

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
Yet amazingly, most of these same people have never spent any time in America, except maybe on vacation.

3.

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
So, what makes it perfectly alright for everyone else to tell us how terrible we are

I don't have any generalizations to spout, but here's a platitude: you reap what you sow. Congratulations!


User currently offlineVANGUARD737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 683 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1851 times:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 5):
Nothing like insulting people who respond to your threads to make yourself feel better about how un-important you are huh?

Ha! All I did is state a reality. if that offend you, maybe you need some self-reflection time?  Smile
BTW, did i call you unimportant? let's stop the childish name-calling before it starts.

Best regards



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User currently offlineBanco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 53
Reply 13, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1846 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Reply 6):
And your point is? I was stating and recognizing stereotypes about Americans which are stupid and untrue - not agreeing with them.

"Many people"?

Really?

Name them.

Otherwise you're generalising.

Now, it seems to me that what you really want it for a procession of people to come on here and profess how much they adore America. Well, a lot of people do as it happens, but I'm not going to sooth your wounded ego by doing it. I really don't care enough about America to do so anyway, and we have our own problems here. You're hyper-sensitive to any discussion on the US, and you don't notice when it's about someone else. That's not a criticism, we're all like that. How many threads on Denmark have there been? I haven't a clue. But we also have endless, ENDLESS repeat threads on some political nonentity that no-one gives a stuff about from lesser Iowa and then heaven help someone from outside the US who joins in because if they offer a word of criticism it's an example of anti-Americanism.

This constant navel-gazing is tiresome. There are plenty of threads on here where Britain gets a baashing, and I couldn't care less. Go for it, I wander away from here supremely indifferent, and I certainly don't start threads wondering why you're all being so beastly to us.

It's not a dig at you, you've just offered an expression of this constant approval seeking that we see on here a lot. Honestly, it's really boring!



She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
User currently offlineVANGUARD737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 683 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1837 times:

Ok, obviously intelligent conversations are a logistical impossibility on airliners.net

People get "offended" and cannot answer a simple question without being smart-asses.

So...I'm done even trying to read peoples responses - so no bother typing them.

Later!



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User currently offlineMt99 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 6594 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1823 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
Many people LOVE to stereotype Americans as being fat, lazy, uninformed, gun-toters, criminal killers, etc. Yet amazingly, most of these same people have never spent any time in America, except maybe on vacation.

But love McDonalds, Hollywood movies.. ect,.. Just a fact of life. Get over it

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
My question is why do we never hear of the problems with other countries? Do they not exist?

We never hear them beacuse we are never presented with them. How many times has your local ABC, CBS, NBC or FOX 10PM news have utter the words: "Norway" or "Scotland".

Sure international news are out there, you can catch the BBC world news on PBS.. but the average american will not go thru the trouble in finding looking for them



Step into my office, baby
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1811 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
Many people LOVE to stereotype Americans as being fat, lazy, uninformed, gun-toters, criminal killers, etc.

True...

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
So, what makes it perfectly alright for everyone else to tell us how terrible we are, but if Americans dare point fingers at anyone else we are all of a sudden the bad guy? Many of you have never even been here! It's all stereotypes!

...there's also the relatively common sentiment that non-Americans are somehow automatically more "aware" of geographical and historical events.

As per my own person experience with this:
I can run circles around 99.999% of anyone I run across in terms of geography, and I dare say that at 52 nations and counting; I've visited more foreign locales than the overwhelming majority of Western, Male, and/or Black 25yr-olds.... yet can't tell you how frustrating(ly common) it is for me to be asked the likes of "Yes back in [insert relatively major Euro/Asian/Australian/S.American city here], do you know where that is?" in general conversation with non-Americans.


User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1802 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Reply 12):
All I did is state a reality.

 redflag 

This is 'reality':
http://www.airliners.net/discussions/profile.main?username=VANGUARD737

Quote:
Gender: Male
Age: 21-25
Occupation: Student


User currently offlineLYRFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1787 times:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 5):
Nothing like insulting people who respond to your threads to make yourself feel better about how un-important you are huh?



Quoting TedTAce (Reply 17):
This is 'reality':
http://www.airliners.net/discussions/profile.main?username=VANGUARD737

Quote:
Gender: Male
Age: 21-25
Occupation: Student

... and now you feel better, yourself?  Smile


User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17501 posts, RR: 45
Reply 19, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 1774 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
So, what makes it perfectly alright for everyone else to tell us how terrible we are, but if Americans dare point fingers at anyone else we are all of a sudden the bad guy?

It's the curse/blessing of being number one, in any field. You always hear bad things about Walmart, Nike, Starbuck's, McDonald's, Microsoft--how often do you see the same about Target, Adidas, Seattle's Best, Burger King, or Apple?



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineOly720man From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 6729 posts, RR: 11
Reply 20, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 1736 times:

Quoting AirCop (Reply 4):
Just go to the internet and pull up media from other countries and your question is answered about problems in other countries. Apparently the bean counters that run our media system would rather feed us fluff instead of real news. I can remember when the major networks had reporters all over the world..

Yep, real news costs real money and having people where the news may happen. It's the same with investigative reporting.... worthy, but not really an earner especially when the investigations may wander into the territory of those who actually own, or are "friends" of those who own the media outlets. No-one's going to employ people who may tell the world how bad you are.

Why spend some hours (or minutes, or seconds) with some in-depth story (or even any story) that most of the country has little idea about when you can have the local exciting news (car chases, crashes, drugs, etc flashing past every 10 seconds) to keep you interested until the next advert break (which is what the news, and most other programs are really there for... to fill in the gaps between the adverts)

One book I read that covered this to some extent is

http://www.amazon.com/Into-Buzzsaw-L...g-Journalists-Expose/dp/1573929727

It is interesting, but written by journos who've been pulled off stories, or whose careers have suffered because they pursued stories. How much is truth and how much is being pi$$ed off I know not.



wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
User currently offlinePetertenthije From Netherlands, joined Jul 2001, 3369 posts, RR: 12
Reply 21, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 1730 times:

I suppose there are several reasons why the US is under closer scrutiy. But the most obvious and by far most important one is that you are just the biggest player. In the Netherlands there is a proverb "hoge bomen vangen veel wind" (high trees catch a lot of wind). Basically, if you stand out, you are noticed.

Let's face it. When you watch the news in Europe you will always hear about the USA. Sometimes in very good light (disaster relief, the economy), sometimes in bad light (Iraq mostly). Why is this the case? Simple, if something happens to the US we will notice. If the US economy goes down, the European economy will suffer likewise. If the US goes into a war, then more often then not parts of Europe will follow.

The same does not apply for the USA. They are perfectly capable of sorting things out on their own if they set their mind to it. Therefor international affairs is not as big a factor on your news programs. That was also the reason why for instance Bush managed to get away with his "your with us or against us" approach for such a long time. When's the last time the Netherlands was on CNN, Fox or ABC? How long ago for Belgium? Or even a larger nation as Germany? Only the things that directly affect the USA will make the news, Iraq, Afghanistan, a bit of news from the UK.... maybe France.

Besides, most of the news in the US seems to be regional/national and sports/showbizz anyway with little time for the dare I say it more serious news.



Attamottamotta!
User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 1683 times:

Quoting Banco (Reply 13):
But we also have endless, ENDLESS repeat threads on some political nonentity that no-one gives a stuff about from lesser Iowa and then heaven help someone from outside the US who joins in because if they offer a word of criticism it's an example of anti-Americanism.

Now just a minute there buckaroo....read mah profile, suh! Mah honuh has been compo-mazzed. Hay bales at ten paces.

Quoting Petertenthije (Reply 21):
I suppose there are several reasons why the US is under closer scrutiy. But the most obvious and by far most important one is that you are just the biggest player. In the Netherlands there is a proverb "hoge bomen vangen veel wind" (high trees catch a lot of wind). Basically, if you stand out, you are noticed.

The japanese have a saying: The nail that sticks up gets hammered down.


User currently offlineSpeedbird747BA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 1671 times:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 1):
Because we start fights we have no business in and more importantly don't have a clue how to stop.

Just a bit like WW1 and WW2.

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 16):
I can run circles around 99.999% of anyone I run across in terms of geography,

HAHA, try me pal.

Cheers,
Kyle


User currently offlineAirWillie6475 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 2448 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (7 years 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 1671 times:

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
My question is why do we never hear of the problems with other countries? Do they not exist? Could it actually be that the rest of the world is just perfect and somehow the US is a renegade creating each and every problem today?

If you want to hear international news there's plenty of it it's called CNN, NBC, FOX News.

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Thread starter):
It just gets to me because I feel most Americans are good people and are misunderstood and it sucks when people always spew stereotypes about us. I don't think the US is any better than any other country - but I don't think we are any worse either!

I think people get the wrong impression because most Americans DO NOT care about what other countries think of them. Also a lot has to do with the resentment that how could these seemingly ignorant people have managed to have the most powerful country in the world with a lot of say in what the world can and can not do. I think it's very simple, we have a lot of hard workers.


25 Post contains images JpetekYXMD80 : Are you kidding me? Keyword: start. America clearly instigated WWI and II....
26 Speedbird747BA : Do I have to put the sarcasm sign there? Did you really miss that? Cheers, Kyle
27 Post contains images Zippyjet : There's only so much time in news blocks. And lets face it, many of us in the USA have the attention spans of a neutered cat. Also, if it bleeds it le
28 Post contains images Lazarus31 : LMAO          I dont usually get into silly threads like this but i will answer the question for you. ITS BECAUSE OF SELF RIGHTEOUS 'WELL INFOR
29 HAWK21M : Since The USA is considered the only remaining Superpower.The Pressure on it to be perfect is always under scrutiny. Hence Most Countries follow the
30 JpetekYXMD80 : Oh, so you were having the Great Wars history defend contemporary foreign policy and military invention. Yeah, because that makes sense. Thats like g
31 VonRichtofen : Of course every country has its own probelms. No country is perfect. I think the problem is that some very vocal Americans claim the US is the absolut
32 GuitrThree : And at the same time, you made a lot of Democrats nod their head up and down in agreement.... While the Bush Supporters think America is the greatest
33 Aloges : Thing is, with the notable exceütions of Blair, Aznar, Berlusconi and other George Bush suck-ups, we have learnt from that very past not to keep fuc
34 Post contains images TedTAce : I feel better now, but not because of this thread...something to do with the very pleasant manner in which the wife woke me up this morning Something
35 Post contains images Banco : Breakfast in bed. Aren't you lucky?
36 Post contains images TedTAce : That too
37 ORFflyer : Hey Junior, I got fifty bucks on Freddie.
38 Dougloid : Yep, we're learning it from the acknowledged and unchallenged masters of warmongery. Glass houses, people. I appreciate your optimism and your sang-f
39 Post contains links Pbottenb : I tend to agree with the basic premise of your rant. I am amazed at the outrage that the EU and the world hs consistently show over CIA activities du
40 TedTAce : Where have you been for the past 5 months? Let's just say up until recently the situation has been 'fluid' but things are getting a LOT better.
41 Dougloid : Not looking over your shoulder is where I've been for the last five months Ted. Shall we say, reading the posts was too much drama for me....I have e
42 TedTAce : I need it EVERY SINGLE day!! Thankfully I usually get enough to wake up the next morning so that's good enough for me for now.
43 Post contains images Pope : Why doesn't anyone call bullshit on this? Even if we accept the notion that Iraq meets this criteria, what other "fights [plural] did we start that w
44 Banco : Er...actually, yes you did.
45 Dougloid : We wouldn't have had to do that if you'd kept your dang hands off our sailors, not made common cause with our domestic enemies, and not strewed your
46 Banco : It's a bit of a myth that. The episode with the Leopard was five years before, the captain was reprimanded, and the British government apologised. As
47 Post contains images Checkraiser : We were provoked.
48 Pope : OK - let's assume that we started it and that we weren't provoked. It still fails the second leg of Ted's test - "we had no business" in it.
49 Post contains links Dougloid : Here's a pretty good summary. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_1812
50 Banco : It isn't really, you know. Wikipedia is utterly unreliable on things like this. Starting with "Britain had long been the world's pre-eminent naval po
51 Post contains links Confuscius : "It's a bit of a myth that." "Here's a pretty good summary.
52 Banco : It's ongoing because the US tried to turn it into a triumph through propoganda, when it was an unmitigated disaster for them. And the British have ne
53 Confuscius : It's ongoing because the US tried to turn it into a triumph through propoganda, when it was an unmitigated disaster for them. And the British have nev
54 Banco : The exception that proves the rule! In truth, the side that writes most about the war gets to write history. The War of 1812 was important to the US,
55 Post contains images Speedbird747BA : I have a feeling thats where my money should be too. Cheers, Kyle
56 Post contains images Confuscius : In truth, the side that writes most about the war gets to write history. So, at best, it was a draw for the United States? That makes the U.S. somethi
57 MaidensGator : Now there's a myth.... I guess since the war was a virtual stalemate, both sides get to write the history.... The Treaty of Ghent restored pre-war bo
58 VonRichtofen : Every country pollutes, the US just does it more than any other country (per capita) Afghanistan, yes. Iraq? No. If anything going into Iraq has only
59 TedTAce : Ok Someone else started it, but we got into it without thinking and we sure as hell didn't finish it save running like little bitches with our tail b
60 MaidensGator : Your first three paragraphs either admitted or rationalized misrepresentations... Where was the 'truth' you speak of ?
61 Speedbird747BA : Thats because China has over a billion people bub. Come on now. Cheers, Kyle
62 Post contains images MaidensGator : India too...... It's predicted to have more people than China by mid-century....
63 HAWK21M : Unfortunate in a Democracy.People can't be forced to slow down. regds MEL
64 Banco : Hardly a "myth". Most people in Britain know nothing whatever about the war. And it's well documented that the New England states were livid with Mad
65 Post contains images ORFflyer :
66 Dougloid : But it sure made a bunch of backwoodsmen feel a lot better. Anytime you make a smartypants sit up and take notice it's a good day's work. Now. You ha
67 TedTAce : I gladly admit it when I'm wrong. Do you MaidensGator?
68 MaidensGator : Yes, I should have thought that through a little. I was wrong. My first impression on reading that sentence was that you were claiming liberals only
69 Post contains images NASCARAirforce : The reason we don't hear about problems in other countries is that we don't care about other countries... not saying myself, but a lot of Americans.
70 Cairo : There are riots in Denmark right now shown on CNN. The French riots were broadcast around the world. The problems in Chechnya and the Balkans are sti
71 Post contains images Banco : Good stuff, glad to hear it! And actually, I specifically made sure that everything I wrote was verifiable and accurate, not some slanted nationalist
72 MaidensGator : Just so I get the whole story straight, did the US also lose the Battle of New Orleans? I've been told it might not be considered part of the War of
73 Banco : No, no, that's quite true. Irrespective of it occurring after the truce, it would seem to me a bit silly not to regard it as part of the war though.
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