Dtwclipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 1474 times:
OK, we have the struggling FORD, GM and DCX, now another blow to Detroit and Michigan.....
Comerica moving HQ to Dallas
March 6, 2007
FREE PRESS STAFF and NEWS SERVICES
Comerica Inc. announced this morning it will move its headquarters from Detroit to Dallas in the third quarter of this year.
The bank said the move would give the company a more central location with greater accessibility to all of its markets. It plans to retain a "significant presence in Detroit."
Luv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 11957 posts, RR: 51 Reply 1, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 1428 times:
WOW I remember growing up in Michigan and all the Banking Companies we use to have there.
MaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 15721 posts, RR: 48 Reply 2, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1416 times:
It's my impression that the unions in MI would rather have no jobs than a non-union job. So that last person in MI will probably be union and charge $40 with full benefits just to turn off the light.
Luv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 11957 posts, RR: 51 Reply 3, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1408 times:
Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 2): It's my impression that the unions in MI would rather have no jobs than a non-union job. So that last person in MI will probably be union and charge $40 with full benefits just to turn off the light
God that is so right on the money, and I do not know if I should laugh or cry.
Falstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 5670 posts, RR: 29 Reply 5, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1364 times:
Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 3): Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 2):
It's my impression that the unions in MI would rather have no jobs than a non-union job. So that last person in MI will probably be union and charge $40 with full benefits just to turn off the light
God that is so right on the money, and I do not know if I should laugh or cry.
Exactly.
I am a non union teacher, most schools around here are union and you should hear the BS I have to put up with from some people around Detroit. When I am out and about and people ask where I work I have to be careful what I say and to whom. Our type of school is well known to be a non union school.
It does suck around here as far as the economy is concerned. I have been thinking about leaving too. I have been giving thought about returning to St. Louis. My job is safe and all but it is just so pitiful in Detroit and Wayne County. The only real thorn in the plan is my house. I got stuck with an ARM and now the economy is so crummy the house isn't worth what I owe on it. Two years ago it was worth $24,000 more than I owed. If I could get exactly what I owe I would leave yesterday. I live in a small house in a working class neighborhood. There are dozens of foreclosures in my neighbor hood, including next door. Neighborhoods like mine are hit really hard because the houses are generally bought by the exact people who generally work in the industries that are downsizing right now.
Checkraiser From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 6, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1343 times:
Over here on my side of "the pond" (Wis.) it's starting to look the same.
The unions and the tax climate in the rust belt states is putting us out of business. Without serious tax and labor reform I'm afraid we'll continue to see jobs leave for Mexico and other tax havens like AZ and TX.
ORFflyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 7, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1337 times:
Quoting Checkraiser (Reply 6): The unions and the tax climate in the rust belt states is putting us out of business.
It ain't just the rust belt. Ford is closing their F150 Assembly plant here in Norfolk. Been here slightly longer than dirt. (a long time, and I don't feel like looking it up) It's largely due to rising labor costs, and the unions are to blame for that.
Falstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 5670 posts, RR: 29 Reply 9, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1330 times:
Quoting ORFflyer (Reply 7): It ain't just the rust belt. Ford is closing their F150 Assembly plant here in Norfolk. Been here slightly longer than dirt. (a long time, and I don't feel like looking it up) It's largely due to rising labor costs, and the unions are to blame for that.
When I did warranty claims analysis for Ford I once saw an internal memo about trucks built in Mexico having fewer warranty claims than those built in the US. I always attributed that to the fact that the Mexicans really fight to get those jobs and they don't want to loose it to the dozens of people waiting for the job. I have known some very lazy UAW workers who don't show for work, sleep on the job, drink on the job, etc. I know most of the people are hard working and honest, but the stereotype came from somewhere. I once got a VIP tour of a Union assembly plant in Flat Rock, MI. the first thing I saw when I walked in was a man sleeping on a forklift with a newspaper over his face. It may have been his break time, but it didn't leave a good taste in this visitors mouth.
2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8950 posts, RR: 62 Reply 10, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1324 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW HEAD DATABASE EDITOR
Pfizer has been laying huge amounts of people off in Ann Arbor and Kalamazoo, as well....
Checkraiser From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 11, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1308 times:
Flastaff,
I agree wholeheartedly that there are many employees who need a swift kick. When things get busy here I occasionally drive truck and make deliveries. I've been to GM in Janesville and seen the utter laziness displayed. Paper is a big industry here; the mills are closing left and right. But, believe it or not, if you show up on their shipping dock it's not uncommon to find guys sleeping behind a few bales (and it's not break time.) That's not the behavior I'd exhibit if I knew the plant could very well announce tomorrow that my job is going to the Phillipines.
Regarding Mexican quality... I'm not convinced. Maybe it's just a bad experience but I've had a Mexican Dodge and VW. The Dub was probably the worst car I owned. The Dodge, not so bad but still didn't seem as "well-built."
Falstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 5670 posts, RR: 29 Reply 12, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1289 times:
Quoting Checkraiser (Reply 11): But, believe it or not, if you show up on their shipping dock it's not uncommon to find guys sleeping behind a few bales (and it's not break time.) That's not the behavior I'd exhibit if I knew the plant could very well announce tomorrow that my job is going to the Phillipines.
A friend of mine owns a pipe company in St. Louis that ships pipe and valves to GM's Wentzville, MO. plant. They often times have him get stuff that the plant/office needs but are out of cash for that particular budget and are able to use a different budget line item. They also do that because when the loading dock people see a box from a pipe company they are less likely to steal it. A lot of companies will not do that kind of thing. My buddy makes plenty of extra money doing that. He will go to Best Buy, buy some printers, faxes, what ever and list it on the invoice as pipe or valves. They also take it out of the original box and re box it. They also just did a load of Craftsman tool boxes for GM's Wentzville Plant like that. If GM buys stuff that way, how many other companies also do that.
Vio From Canada, joined Feb 2004, 1283 posts, RR: 9 Reply 13, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1251 times:
That's exactly the feeling and the atmosphere in Windsor, Ontario, which is right across the river from Detroit. I lived there for 8 years before moving to Alberta (5 years ago). I remember once when the economy wa booming and everyone had jobs. Right now everyone's fighting for the very last bit. My parents are still there, but I don't know for how long. They also have a hard time selling their house, because everyone sells and leaves. Why would anyone come to Windsor anyway? With the downsizing of the big 3, thousands of people are affected, not only the ones who directly were employed by them but also the suppliers, etc etc etc
Life is though out there and it's not getting any better. I hope my parents will find a way out...
Superior decisions reduce the need for superior skills.
QXatFAT From Israel, joined Feb 2006, 2401 posts, RR: 5 Reply 14, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1230 times:
That is really sad. I still have my Comerica account open and I have been back here in Fresno, CA now for a little over a year. I have to use the Fresno branch to do all my work but I am moving back to Michigan in August.
Ford is moving assemblies down to the Georgia, Alabama, Tennisseee rejion arn't they? The "Rust Belt" is just on the decline because of Unions like said earlyer. We spent 3 weeks talking about the "Rust Belt" and the problems with Ford and other companies in my Geography 4B class.
I would want to move out of Detroit as well though because it is such an ugly place (sorry everyonen from DTW). You have a nice looking building surrounded by gang infested, run down housing, everyone on the street places.
Falstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 5670 posts, RR: 29 Reply 15, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1219 times:
No offense here. Detroit is one of the worst places I have ever been. People here have a bad attitude. I used to live in St. Louis and I used to think it was a dump. Now I know better.
AsstChiefMark From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1207 times:
Quoting Checkraiser (Reply 8): Can't wait for the Mexican trucks to start showing up.
Instead of that annoying rattle being a Coke bottle disgarded in the door by a pissed off American worker, it'll simply change to a tequila bottle. No biggy.
DeltaGator From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 6341 posts, RR: 16 Reply 17, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1197 times:
Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 14): Ford is moving assemblies down to the Georgia,
Not sure about that one since Ford just closed the Taurus plant by Hartsfield that had been there for ages. GM closed their Doraville plant on the northeast side of town.
[Edited 2007-03-06 22:30:23]
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8950 posts, RR: 62 Reply 18, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1189 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW HEAD DATABASE EDITOR
So why is it that US-owned auto manufacturers can't build cars profitably in the US, but Japanese-owned companies can?
Is it that US worker unions demand more and more money every year, ultimately pricing themselves out of a job, while the relatively new Japanese-run workforce agrees to far less money from the beginning?
Dtwclipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 20, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1171 times:
Quoting Piercey (Reply 19): How long do the naming rights last on Comerica Park?
20 years!
Babb said Comerica still has 20 years to run on its naming-rights agreement at Comerica Park and expects no change in that. “We’re very proud to be the home of the Detroit Tigers,” he said.
Checkraiser From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 22, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1156 times:
Quoting 2H4 (Reply 18): So why is it that US-owned auto manufacturers can't build cars profitably in the US, but Japanese-owned companies can?
A lot of it boils down to "legacy costs." The big three pay out enormous sums in pensions. I heard on the radio a few months ago that about $1700 of the cost of every GM vehicle sold is just to cover pensions.
Falstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 5670 posts, RR: 29 Reply 23, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1139 times:
Quoting Piercey (Reply 19): How long do the naming rights last on Comerica Park? That could be their "significant presence," a baseball stadium!
They still have a branch on every corner it seems. I never liked them. I do all my banking at a credit union. I have dealt with them for work and they don't seem to care much about regular customers, just business. They do advertise themselves as a business bank.
Quoting Checkraiser (Reply 22): A lot of it boils down to "legacy costs." The big three pay out enormous sums in pensions. I heard on the radio a few months ago that about $1700 of the cost of every GM vehicle sold is just to cover pensions.
The Japanese don't have that problem... yet.
The Detroit car makers have more retirees than employees. The other side doesn't have that problem yet. It takes less people to build cars today than years ago. As those jobs left the people retired and still get a pension, which they should. On the other hand the Japanese plants were built recently and had the latest manufacturing processes built in. People around here are still mad about technology taking their jobs. People at the newest plants, including US plants, have not felt that yet. If those plants stay open for 40 or 50 years the same problems will probably develop.
Many of the non union auto workers have similar take home wages to the UAW people.
Quoting Dtwclipper (Reply 20): I don't have a bad attitude, I'm just mad at the world!
See what I mean. Everyone around here is mad, even me!
ScarletHarlot From Canada, joined Jul 2003, 4673 posts, RR: 60 Reply 24, posted (6 years 2 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1090 times:
Quoting Checkraiser (Reply 22): The Japanese don't have that problem... yet.
They probably won't, because I'll bet anything that they've learned from the problems of the US legacy automakers and haven't instituted a defined benefit plan. I'll bet that the Japanese automakers have defined contribution 401(k) plans instead - giving the investment risk and funding problem to the employee instead.
But that was when I ruled the world
25 ORFflyer: I think that the exact reason - along with:
26 Dougloid: Friend of mine has been working for Upjohn-oops! Pfizer in the flight department at K'zoo since 1985 and he's on pins and needles. I lived in K'zoo w
27 2H4: A few years ago, custom T-shirts were all the rage in Kzoo. The most popular featured a blue diamond on the front with "Pfired" printed on it in Pfiz
28 Dougloid: I was attending KVCC and I had a Rabbit GTI at the time. There was one road south of the college that had one of those nice S curves and it went righ
29 Luv2fly: I do not think that what is happening in Michigan is any different then what any Midwest State is experiencing right now. Michigan just put to much fa
30 2H4: Yep, I know the road. It wasn't very usable for motorcycling when I was there, as the road commission had just laid down a bunch of chip-and-seal. Th
31 AirCop: Traditionally , Arizona has high corporate property and income taxes, therefore most of the new jobs are low paying back office type jobs. Over the p
32 AsstChiefMark: So that's why Tomar strobe lights are so damned overpriced. TOMAR Electronics 2100 W. Obispo Avenue Gilbert, Arizona 85233 USA
33 AndesSMF: I only visited Michigan once, and during our stay there, I only saw one Toyota. I wonder if they vandalized the rest...
34 Aloges: Unions and pensioners... as usual, it's only the (former) employees who are blamed for the downfall of the companies. Did it ever occur to any of you
35 AndesSMF: Did you read how many of us referenced legacy costs for these automakers? Toyota makes a wide range of cars, not just economy cars, but plenty of SUV
36 MaverickM11: I think the trend toward "more economic" cars was proportional to the gas price. When the gas price fell, so did back orders for the latest hybrid la
37 AndesSMF: We purchased our first brand new car in 2000. Then the Saturn was cheaper than equivalent cars, and we bought it. In 2005, we purchased another new S
38 Falstaff: Detroit is too focused on the past. Retro cars bring cheers from automotive nerds, like me, who love old cars. For Example the proposed new Camero is
39 Dougloid: Nope....the biggest problem you have in Arizona is not enough water that you don't have to pay people a lot for like the native americans.
40 Dougloid: Well, that's exactly what Toyota intends to do with their Godzilla pickup truck....it is effin' enormous. It's as big as the biggest. So they're sell
41 Dougloid: 1987 Mitsubishi pickup and 1993 Mazda MPV van. I do all my own work. Now-to important things. After I overhauled the engine in Maxwell the pickup, th
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