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University Of North Dakota - Ideas?  
User currently offlineDeltaAVL From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1893 posts, RR: 6
Posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2028 times:

Hi guys,

I'm seriously considering attending the University of North Dakota for its aviation program in a couple of years and would like to know a little more about it. I've read basically everything on their website, but that (of course) doesn't tell you everything. From what I can gather, they have one of the best (if not the best) aviation programs in the country. I'd be majoring in Aviation Systems or whatever program they have that best suits somebody becoming a professional pilot.

How is the weather there? And what about social life? I don't drink, so how would that affect me? And is the aviation program all it's cracked up to be?

I live in the mountains of North Carolina currently, and I don't want to break the bank to go somewhere I'd hate. My parents aren't especially fond of the idea of me going to school in North Dakota either. So I need a pretty good argument.

Thanks in advance.

p.s. Maybe Graphic could chime in here, as he (IIRC) goes to UND.


"We break, We bend, With hand in hand, When hope is gone, Just hang on." -Guster
24 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6348 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2016 times:

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
How is the weather there?

Hot in the summer, Cold in the winter...pretty much the extremes. Despite being from Namibia, I am a cold weather person, so I love the winter up in that region, but hate the summer (I hate both in Kansas, where I currently live - too hot and humid in summer, not cold or snowy enough in winter)

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
And what about social life?

Eh...it's a college so it will be decent, but...not the greatest. Better than, say, Embry-Riddle for sure.

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
I don't drink, so how would that affect me?

You will learn to drink  Wink As always, that means you'll be hanging out with a different crowd than those who drink - you rarely see a group of college friends who are mixed drinkers and non-drinkers. Drinkers tend to hang with each other, as do non-drinkers. I am a drinker (too much at times), so I'm not sure about that one.

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
And is the aviation program all it's cracked up to be?

Yes, it is...it's a great program. I went up there for the summer camp some years ago, and I could tell just how seriously they took their aviation.

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
My parents aren't especially fond of the idea of me going to school in North Dakota either

I know the feeling...my parents live in Namibia and they were hesitant when I said I wanted to go all the way to the USA for college instead of Namibia or South Africa (even though they were born and raised in America and all my family is in Illinois and Wisconsin)

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
So I need a pretty good argument.

Use the "don't you want me to get the best education I can get? Don't you want me to be successful and happy?"...no parent can argue  Wink But in all seriousness, it really may be the best aviation program in America, and if they have a serious problem with you going, see if someone at UND can talk to them and make a big pitch to them...I've seen it done before, and they know their own program and school better than anyone.


User currently offlineMattRB From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1624 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2014 times:

Best bet is to actually go to Grand Forks and do the campus tour. Very informative. As well, being from NC, you'll want to take a look at their satellite campus in Lumberton, NC - you'd do the first two years of your program in state and do the last two at UND - probably save yourself a little bit of cash doing that, since you wouldn't have to be shelling out for out of state tuition for two years.

I liked what I saw when I went to GFK. Very up-to-date and in-depth, from what I could tell. I was impressed. Weather was nice (I was there end of August/early September, 2005), though, it will get cold in the winter. Not terribly sure on the social aspects of living in GFK. Obviously, there will be all the campus sporting events to head off to when home games are being played, and the campus life looked lively enough, so there would probably be plenty to do. Plenty to do without having to imbibe.

UND definitely gets the from me - but best to get perspective from some of the folks that actually go there.

PS. AVL - lovely place, my home away from home Big grin

[Edited 2007-03-25 19:19:41]


Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible.
User currently offlineSTLGph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9412 posts, RR: 26
Reply 3, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2005 times:

Quoting SW733 (Reply 1):
Eh...it's a college so it will be decent, but...not the greatest. Better than, say, Embry-Riddle for sure.

!!!!
IT'S NORTH DAKOTA
!!!!

embry-riddle is at least in florida.

there are plenty of other universities out there that offer similar programs that aren't in the middle of nowhere.

"the best" is superlative.



if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
User currently offlineMattRB From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1624 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2002 times:

Quoting STLGph (Reply 3):

!!!!
IT'S NORTH DAKOTA
!!!!

embry-riddle is at least in florida.

Flooding caused by ice jams vs flooding caused by hurricanes - take your pick  Wink



Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible.
User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6348 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2000 times:

Quoting STLGph (Reply 3):
!!!!
IT'S NORTH DAKOTA
!!!!

I meant more of the social life directly related to the university and college life...from what I understand, Embry-Riddle has very little...all the fun stuff, such as the beach, restaurants and bars, is there because it is in Daytona, not because of the college.


User currently offlineSTLGph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9412 posts, RR: 26
Reply 6, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1994 times:

Quoting SW733 (Reply 5):
Embry-Riddle has very little

it's a bunch of aviation geeks. what do you expect?

Quoting SW733 (Reply 5):
all the fun stuff, such as the beach, restaurants and bars, is there because it is in Daytona

that's all you need!!!

Quoting MattRB (Reply 4):
Flooding caused by ice jams vs flooding caused by hurricanes - take your pick

hurricanes.



if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
User currently offlineZANL188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3546 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 1974 times:
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I'm a UND Alumnus from the late 70s...

As for the Weather... Well it is North Dakota. It's hot & dusty in the summer & cold/windy in the winter. The 152/172s I flew there LOVED the cold climate and would climb like the proverbial bat out of hell (relatively speaking of course). And of course you could always offer to help a "friend" warm up...  Smile

The featureless geography has advantages too.... No mountains to obstruct your flight path.... Lots of cornfields & straight stretches of interstate to deadstick into (I saw it happen more than once).

If you absolutely need an occasional fix of urban life MSP (where I'm from) is only 6 hours away by car, less by air. That 6 hours BTW is just about ideal for keeping your parents at bay, any less and I 'd be expected home every weekend - any more and I wouldn't have been able to go home at xmas and spring break.

I really can't speak to the program though, it's been too long. While I was there Odegard was just a dean...

I enjoyed it & all my friends and I ended up with the careers we wanted....



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User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29802 posts, RR: 58
Reply 8, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 1971 times:

IT's flat.

The tallest thing is the bridge over the railyard by the school gym.

Frankly the geography was one of the reasons I became dissatisfied with the training there, it just wasn't realistic to where I would be operating if I had continued on that career path.



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineAirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 1968 times:

Quoting STLGph (Reply 3):
IT'S NORTH DAKOTA

Point well taken..although they do have a good college hockey team,.  angel 

Quoting STLGph (Reply 3):
there are plenty of other universities out there that offer similar programs that aren't in the middle of nowhere.

Just look around you find some good programs near where you live and won't break the bank in tuition . Some states also offer tuition breaks to residents in neighboring states. For instance out west here we have the Western Undergraduate Exchange which allows students lets say from Arizona to pay nearly the same as in-state tuition at the participating universities in the 13 state region.


User currently offlineZANL188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3546 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 1964 times:
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Quoting L-188 (Reply 8):
The tallest thing is the bridge over the railyard by the school gym.

There was a bridge in town that didn't cross a river? Must have been after my time... The tallest thing around while I was there was that 2000ft TV tower between GFK & FAR...

Speaking of which - One of the neat things about flying there at night in the clear air was the visibility, it was outstanding. You could do a 360 in the manuever area at night and pick out that TV Tower, Fargo, Devils Lake, & Crookston with no problem. Some of my peers said they could see Bemidji & Winnipeg - but I never saw that far. No need for GPS or VOR on a clear night....



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User currently offlineGraphic From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 1950 times:

Ok where do I start?

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
I'd be majoring in Aviation Systems or whatever program they have that best suits somebody becoming a professional pilot.

Commercial Aviation is the one you want to major in, as I currently am. However it's best to pick a second major, which I'm currently debating what I want to do mine in.

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
How is the weather there?

Hot in summer, cold in winter, with the transitional seasons seeming to have the most no-fly days (I just had about 3 weeks of flights weathered out due to the early spring fronts moving through).

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
And what about social life? I don't drink, so how would that affect me?

Pretty much in winter all there is is Hockey and Booze. We have an outdoor rink close to campus (though it's melted by now) that I pretty much learned to skate on back in January. It may be -20 outside, but when you've got 20 people on the ice playing pond hockey you get warm quick. Learn to play, it makes the winter go by much quicker (and much more fun).

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
And is the aviation program all it's cracked up to be?

Yes.

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
My parents aren't especially fond of the idea of me going to school in North Dakota either. So I need a pretty good argument.

My dad, when everything was unloaded in my dorm last fall, said these exact words: "I don't know what the hell you're thinking, we're going back to Colorado, cya at graduation!"  bigthumbsup 

Quoting MattRB (Reply 2):
Obviously, there will be all the campus sporting events to head off to when home games are being played, and the campus life looked lively enough, so there would probably be plenty to do. Plenty to do without having to imbibe.

We have the Ralph Engelstad Arena, a 100 million dollar hockey arena that Gretsky has called "One of the best places in the world to watch a hockey game." The hockey games are intense, I can't speak for the football games though because last fall my flightlab occured during gametime.

Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 7):
The featureless geography has advantages too.... No mountains to obstruct your flight path.... Lots of cornfields & straight stretches of interstate to deadstick into (I saw it happen more than once).

North Dakota is officially one giant landing strip.

Quoting L-188 (Reply 8):
The tallest thing is the bridge over the railyard by the school gym.

Actually the new ten story Canada Inn attached to Alerus Center is...and before that Alerus Center was.

Quoting AirCop (Reply 9):
Western Undergraduate Exchange which allows students lets say from Arizona to pay nearly the same as in-state tuition at the participating universities in the 13 state region.

We do have that, I'm currently on the program as I'm from Colorado, I doubt NC would be in it though.

Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 10):
Speaking of which - One of the neat things about flying there at night in the clear air was the visibility, it was outstanding. You could do a 360 in the manuever area at night and pick out that TV Tower, Fargo, Devils Lake, & Crookston with no problem.

Night flying is amazing. A few nights ago I did a night cross country to Fargo, came in behind Airborne Express and a Northwest A319. Pretty cool flying somewhere that actually gets traffic, even if FAR controllers hate us.

UND even though the last two letters stand for North Dakota is probably going to be your best bet, the social life is fun, I'm 21 but I don't drink much, stayed sober last night and even though most of the people in the group I was in were at some point of wasted the entire time, we still managed to find things to do to keep us up till 5:30 in the morning.


User currently offlineDeltaAVL From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1893 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 1919 times:

Thank you all so much. It really helps to have the "inside look" at things.

Quoting MattRB (Reply 2):
As well, being from NC, you'll want to take a look at their satellite campus in Lumberton, NC - you'd do the first two years of your program in state and do the last two at UND - probably save yourself a little bit of cash doing that, since you wouldn't have to be shelling out for out of state tuition for two years.

Hmm, but does that offer the same quality as does the GFK branch? I'm a little skeptical.

Quoting Graphic (Reply 11):
Commercial Aviation is the one you want to major in, as I currently am. However it's best to pick a second major, which I'm currently debating what I want to do mine in.

Do you mean double majoring? I'd definitely double major in music if I was to do that. But how much harder is it in terms of work and time available?

Quoting Graphic (Reply 11):
We do have that, I'm currently on the program as I'm from Colorado, I doubt NC would be in it though.

Nope, good ol' NC doesn't have any kind of program like that. I wish...

It sounds great. Now it's time to convince my parents to let me go! One more question though - I'm 1/8th Native American. Would that help me get some kind of scholarship?



"We break, We bend, With hand in hand, When hope is gone, Just hang on." -Guster
User currently offlineSTLGph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9412 posts, RR: 26
Reply 13, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 1915 times:

does Grand Forks have any good gay bars?

i mean ... come on now ...



if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6348 posts, RR: 9
Reply 14, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 1915 times:

Quoting DeltaAVL (Reply 12):
One more question though - I'm 1/8th Native American. Would that help me get some kind of scholarship?

Probably...there is a joke out there amongst a lot of college students I know that the worst thing about being white is not having scholarships (don't flame me, I'm just the messenger). However, I DID get a scholarship for being from Africa, so that was cool. You may not actually get a scholarship from UND for being 1/8 N.A., but you could probably get it from some private organization.


User currently offlineGraphic From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 1900 times:

Quoting DeltaAVL (Reply 12):
It sounds great. Now it's time to convince my parents to let me go! One more question though - I'm 1/8th Native American. Would that help me get some kind of scholarship?

Actually at UND that's free tuition.


User currently offlineSW733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6348 posts, RR: 9
Reply 16, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 1894 times:

Quoting Graphic (Reply 15):

Actually at UND that's free tuition.

Wow...that's awesome.


User currently offlineZANL188 From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 3546 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 1890 times:
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Quoting Graphic (Reply 15):
Actually at UND that's free tuition.

Free tuition is great, however isn't tuition pretty much inconsequential when compared with lab fees? It was for me.



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User currently offlineGraphic From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 7 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 1882 times:

Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 17):
Free tuition is great, however isn't tuition pretty much inconsequential when compared with lab fees? It was for me.

Haha...yeah.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21681 posts, RR: 55
Reply 19, posted (7 years 7 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1854 times:

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
From what I can gather, they have one of the best (if not the best) aviation programs in the country.

They do indeed.

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
I'd be majoring in Aviation Systems or whatever program they have that best suits somebody becoming a professional pilot.

There's Commerical Aviation, and then there's also Aviation Management, which is an excellent backup option that still gets you your flight ratings. However, I'd avoid it if, like me, you find the prospect of being in management to be unenticing. There are plenty of other options for a double major.

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
How is the weather there?

Bad. There's hot, there's cold, there's mosquitos. And by cold, I mean really f*cking cold.

Quoting DeltaAVL (Thread starter):
And what about social life? I don't drink, so how would that affect me?

I never really fit in with the social scene (which is why I no longer go there). Very little to do that interested me (though that's probably something particular to me). I found that to be more objectionable than the cold.

The place wasn't right for me, but that doesn't mean it won't be right for you. Definitely take a visit.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7554 posts, RR: 8
Reply 20, posted (7 years 7 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 1831 times:

Quoting DeltaAVL (Reply 12):
I'm 1/8th Native American. Would that help me get some kind of scholarship?

A kid i know is like 1/16th Cherokee, if you can prove it that your 1/8th native american, tuition will be free for you. Flight labs cost extra, but considering your now not paying tuition... thats a bargain. If your wondering about flying home, NW is the only carrier in GFK, a few months ago, NW made a deal with GFK, that if you book early enough in advance and open seats are roughly the same that GFK will cost the same as flying out of FAR. In fact, just a few months ago, to fly to Germany for spring break, NW RT was just $525. Typically I find air fares (when not searching last minute or too early like most students here then they bitch about it costing too much) I fly from GFK-DEN on NW for $285, and to ATL for about $310. Not bad at all. I would say the average airfare is roughly around $375 (depeding on destination). If i were you, try and get your parents to come up here with you for a school visit (both campus and aerospace visit) its worth it, and come during a hockey weekend and get tickets to the games (friday and saturday nights).



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineDeltaAVL From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1893 posts, RR: 6
Reply 21, posted (7 years 7 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 1821 times:

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 20):
A kid i know is like 1/16th Cherokee

Upon further questioning of my parents, it turns out that I'm actually 1/16th Native American. Don't know what tribe though. I'm sure I could find out. Did that kid get the free tuition? My parents would be delighted if all they had to pay were flight lab costs.

Thanks again for the input guys!



"We break, We bend, With hand in hand, When hope is gone, Just hang on." -Guster
User currently offlineAlias1024 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 2778 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (7 years 7 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1802 times:

Although I did not attend UND, I did attend an aviation program at another university so let me give you some of the stuff I learned (Sorry for going a little off topic). First, have you been up in a small airplane before? If not, it would be in your interest to do so before enrolling at one of these schools. Many people actually show up thinking they want to fly, but having never been in a small airplane before. They soon discover that they don't really like flying that much, and drop out or switch degree programs.

The real value of going to a university with an aviation program falls into three areas: networking, internships, and academics. Networking is invaluable. Today at most major airlines it is almost impossible to get an interview for a pilot position without having a current pilot for the company walk your resume in. The more friends you have in aviation, the better. Internships are a huge plus to the aviation universities. These often allow you to become friends with the people that actually do the hiring at an airline, and if you impress them they will want to hire you once you get the minimum hours, which are sometimes reduced by successfully completing an internship. The academics I found most helpful to me were the advanced aircraft systems classes because they made groundschool at a regional much easier, and they sometimes allow reduced minimums at airlines. ASA is a good example of this.

You will see a lot of bitter people posting on the internet about how they went to ERAU, UND, WMU, Daniel Webster etc... and got nothing out of it. They are pissed because they didn't walk out of school right into the right seat at an airline. They expect to be rewarded with an airline job just because they got a degree in aviation. This isn't how it works. You will still have to work hard and build hours like everyone else who has made it to the airlines. There is no free pass, but the networking and internship opportunities available at universities are a great way to get a leg up over the competition.

Sorry I went on for so long, but I want to make sure you are aware that going to UND isn't a guaranteed airline job. That said, it's a very good (and cold) school which can help your career if you take advantage of the opportunities. Unfortunately too many students don't.



It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
User currently offlineTom in NO From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 7194 posts, RR: 33
Reply 23, posted (7 years 7 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1798 times:

Quoting SW733 (Reply 5):
Embry-Riddle has very little...all the fun stuff, such as the beach, restaurants and bars, is there because it is in Daytona, not because of the college.

Beaches, restaurants, bars, races, Orlando less than an hour away.....doesn't matter whose responsible for that stuff being there, the important thing is that it's there.

Tom at MSY
(Embry-Riddle class of 1982)



"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
User currently offlineKjet12 From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 976 posts, RR: 8
Reply 24, posted (7 years 7 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1784 times:

There are other options out there besides UND and Embry-Riddle. I still have very bitter feelings towards UND from my experience there. I have since transfered and am much happier not attending UND anymore. They may have the reputation, but I think they are far from the best.


AA - Doing what we do best.
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