Wardialer From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1111 posts, RR: 0 Posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 1627 times:
Who thinks this war on terrorism is a bad idea? Well it is, because we will get the whole world fighting each other like Pakistan and India. It will be a like a domino effect slowly by slowly. Bush made a very terrible mistake!!!!
VirginA340 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 15 posts, RR: 0 Reply 1, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 1548 times:
Hey pal; If we didn't take action than people like Osama would strike again I only hope Saddam and Gadahfi are next. If we didn't take action like Clinton we would get more attack and the people of Afghan would continue to suffer under the Taliban. now the people of Afghan has a lasting peace! After PA 103, Khobar Towers, USS Cole and 2 US Ebassies were blown up we have had enough. I wish the war started sooner. I'd be willing to join should there be a draft!
Got it?
India and Pakistan has been fighting since 1947. There is nothing special about the war. It is the same damn thing over the full control state of Kashmeir which India and Pakistan are still fighing over. Right now both coutries have half each but Pakistan wants the whole thing. India accuses Pakistan of being soft on terrorism. Stop playing doom and watch the news kid!
You still haven't given a good reason. I just struck down your argument.
Flight152 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 3247 posts, RR: 8 Reply 2, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 1538 times:
Wardialer
If it was up to you, we would just let all this terrorism go on and let it go unnoticed without any stop to it...yeah that is a good idea. Why don't we just let them contine and hide while not doing anything.
Dream as if you'll live forever, live as if you'll die today
Alpha 1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 3, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 1532 times:
Get a little clue about Geo-political events before spouting off next time, ok?
The current flare-up between Pakistan and India isn't related to Bush's war on terror, as you like to put it (I'd rather call it Osama's Big Mistake, not Bush's War On Terror). India and Pakistan have been on the edge for years now, and it's only coincidence that this latest brushfire between them happens when the U.S. is at war in the region.
777236ER From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2001, 12959 posts, RR: 55 Reply 4, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1520 times:
No, the flareup is happening now because both sides can use the excuse that "they're fighting terrorists." The US and others can't critise.
Define a terrorist for me?
One county's terrorist is another country's freedom fighter.......
Alpha 1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 5, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1509 times:
Define a terrorist for me?
One county's terrorist is another country's freedom fighter.......
Right. People who blow up buildings, themselves and others are terrorists to anyone with half a brain. That has nothing to do with fighting for one's freedom.
Iainhol From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 6, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1508 times:
What you are missing is the doplomatic efforts that the US and other nations push as hard as they can before the ass kicking takes place. India and Pakistan have been fighting for the last 50 years, it will not change.
Iain
Donder10 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 6659 posts, RR: 26 Reply 7, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1502 times:
''If we didn't take action like Clinton we would get more attack and the people of Afghan would continue to suffer under the Taliban. now the people of Afghan has a lasting peace''-Come on dude,don't try and make out that the US gives a shit about the Afghani people.
777236ER From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2001, 12959 posts, RR: 55 Reply 8, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1502 times:
People who blow up buildings, themselves and others are terrorists to anyone with half a brain.
By your logic, the US, in Afghanistan, is a terrorist.
See? "Terrorist" can't be defined. You'll say "but the US is fighting for justice, peace yada yada yada. We have the right to etc" and i'm not saying that's wrong, BUT bin Laden and Al-Queda can say exactly the same thing.
I'll say it again, one country's terrorist is another country's freedom fighter
Wardialer From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1111 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1494 times:
To define a terrorist. A terrorist IS NOT just a group who hijacks planes or screws around with Weapons of Mass Destruction, a terrorist in my definition means for example like a serial killer, a rapist, a child molestor, a murderer, the Columbine shootings, etc. The meaning of my post is that this war is bringing to much retaliation. Look what happened in the past few days or weeks. Plus Im angry that no other country is helping us out, we are fighting this war alone.
777236ER From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2001, 12959 posts, RR: 55 Reply 10, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1491 times:
Firstly, erm, i live in the UK. Last i heard, we were helping out. In fact, the SAS almost had bin laden, until you told the world that and gave us away :-\
Secondly, you still haven't defined a terrorist. A serial killer? The US has killed dozens of civilians in Afghanistan. They feel they're justified (and I do too), BUT by your definition they're a terrorist. Certainly, al-queda would view them as a terror group.
Yet again, one country's terrorist is another country's freedom fighter
Alpha 1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 11, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1484 times:
777236ER, as has been pointed out over and over...and over again, there's a difference between the deliberate killing of poeple like happened on 9-11, and when the suicide bombers blow themselves up in Israel, killing civilians, and the non-deliberate killing of civilians when a bomb or missle goes astray. The deliberate act is indeed an act of terror, and has nothing to do with "freedom fighting". The other is, has been, and always will be, a part of warfare. There's a big distinction.
And gee, we've killed "dozens of civilians" in Afghanistan. Dozens, huh? Mercy, that makes us as bad as Osama, doesn't it? Grow up.
And Wardialer, last I checked, Britian, Germany, Austrailia, and even Japan is giving help to this effort to get rid of Al Quaeda and bin Laden. And how come you're angry? You're against the war on terror anyway!
Jessman From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 1506 posts, RR: 10 Reply 12, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1479 times:
A terrorist operates purely to incite fear to a people/country. They will target specifically civilians and non military structures. They don't operate under the conventional rules of warfare. The us is not a terrorrist in Afghanistan because the US formally declared war, and was targeting the Afghan military and its suppliers.
Of course civilian casualities will happen, but as recently as WWII pilots were happy if they hit the right city. In vietnam God knows what the bombs were hitting under the jungle foliage. Now civilians get a stray bomb or two and it makes headlines.
Back to the India/Pakistan thing; hopefully it won't escalate to nuclear confrontation. It probably won't anyway, Israel has the bomb, but they don't nuke the rest of the arab world, they know it is counterproductive. Same with india/pakistan. Anyway it's quarreling neighbors, America just provided an excuse, someone else would have is the US didn't. It's unfair to blame the US for their problems with each other.
VirginA340 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 15 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 1469 times:
Donder10 Don't put words in my mouth. I'm using that as an example. You can say that we hit two birds with one stone. for my guys at my old Ladder company here in NYC. Getting the Taliban is justice. I hope we do the same with Bin Laden. That punk killed nearly 3,000 men women including 6 kids. 10 guys from my ladder comapny are no longer around. I know a fire cheif that lost two tables of people at his wedding and my old professor knew a guy who lost 3 of his 5 sons. When I think of the things the Armed forces will do to Bin Laden (hopefully toture before a slow death) That is justice. I think of the people that tumbled down a 100 stories and were crushed to death by steel and other debries. On the following Saturday there were 21 funerals.
There were so many that Mayor Guliani, Fire commissioner Von Essen and Police Commisioner Kerik couldn't attend all of them as it's physically an metally impossible The deputy mayor and others had to take their places. Even retired fire and police officers were asked to come because it was physically impossible and it took a toll on the current PD and FD as most had visited more than 5 funerals. The average age of those who died we're 30. Many of them left behind families or we're just married. I'm still shocked about the 4 kids and their teachers on the AA 757. I think of the innocent who died including my fallen brothers. Justice will be served once Osama's head as well as whats left of Al Cadia and his damn sympathyers are shallacked and served on a platter.
It really shocks me that there are people who worry about "Osama's rights" or make the bs statements "The war on terrorism is wrong" or any other Hippy Malarky. This is an attack on my country and my people I hope we mop the landscape with the lot of em!
VirginA340 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 15 posts, RR: 0 Reply 14, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 1464 times:
I wonder if the guy who started this topic is a hard left liberal from Berkley U out in California. That place is full of people like him. Hell the town council there actually sent a written plea to stop the bombing and use"good old fashioned police work" Last time I heard liberals were against that too
Wardialer From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1111 posts, RR: 0 Reply 15, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1453 times:
If Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold ( my pals) were alive I would send them to each Middle Eastern country and have them blow and bomb the hell out of Al-Quaeda network and all the Arabic countries, Hitler style. Or I would throw Usama Bin Laden were psychotic criminals are like Jeffrey Dammer, they would take care of him.
Aviatsiya From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1448 times:
Right. People who blow up buildings, themselves and others are terrorists to anyone with half a brain. That has nothing to do with fighting for one's freedom.
Going by what you say here, Madiba is a terrorist. Yet most of the "western" world had sanctions against his country and openly supported him. In 1994 the whole world embraced Madiba with open arms and teary eyes. Madiba was invited to just about every country by foreign governments. He got standing ovations in the United Nations. When he speaks people stop and listen. They don't just listen, but they actually hear what he is saying. He is one of the most sought after people for speaking engagements.
Not bad for a terrorist huh?
BTW, read his autobiography "Long Walk to Freedom". You guys may just learn a thing or two.
EmiratesLover From Malta, joined Dec 2000, 341 posts, RR: 0 Reply 17, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 1439 times:
I respectfully disagree with Wardieler.
I think the United States has an obligation AND a a right to punish terrorists who murder the harm and the innocent, but only with the firm proviso that it does everthing in it's power to protect the innocent in the process.
I fail to see any link between the tragedy in Afghanistan and America with the situation in South Asia.It is just coincidental, and I do not feel ther has been a domino effect.
Scorpio From Belgium, joined Oct 2001, 4934 posts, RR: 51 Reply 18, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1419 times:
Speaking of those dozens of Afghan people killed: Last week I read that an AMERICAN professor had calculated (always using the most modest and lowest claims available) that the US bombing campaign has cost more civilian lives in Afghanistan than those killed in the WTC and Pentagon combined.
The article also stated that this report was simply NOT even reported by any US media. Makes you wonder...
Cfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 19, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1411 times:
Scorpio, the difference is that Afghan civilians (true civilians, that is) were not the intended target, whereas in the New York attacks innocent civilians were the intended target from the beginning. There is a sizable moral distinction. The first is a tragic accident, but inevitable every once and a while, wheras the other is entirely intentional.
Scorpio From Belgium, joined Oct 2001, 4934 posts, RR: 51 Reply 23, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 1390 times:
Alpha 1,
You're not supposed to be reading my posts. As for where he gets the numbers? He took only those incidents which were reported by more than one independent source, and in each of those cases he took the lowest estimate. But then again, why do I even bother telling you this? He's just an anti-American American, isn't he? What would he know, he's just a professor...
Scorpio From Belgium, joined Oct 2001, 4934 posts, RR: 51 Reply 24, posted (10 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 1387 times:
Oh, BTW, 'retaliation' you say? I though it was a war against terrorism, and had nothing to do with revenge? How stupid I was...
25 Lehpron: Pardon me, but I pretty much decided not to read the previous replies 'cuz somthing needs to be addressed. Who thinks this war on terrorism is a bad i
26 EWRvirgin: What a bunch of cynical jerks on this forum! Why don't you share this cynicism and these conspiracy theories with the families of all those who died?
27 JetService: You folks can try to equate suicide terror attacks on innocents with America defending her citizens with force until you're blue in the face. It will
28 Lehpron: Above are various examples of emotion-run-rampant, hence a non-thinkers, most unfortunate IMO. Why don't you share this cynicism and these conspiracy
29 N400QX: >Because the families are obviously way too emotional to hold a conversation with and they aren't interested in truth, they don't know why it happened
30 Cfalk: What are you, Vulcan? What's wrong with a little emotion? The point that Guliani and others on this forum are trying to get across to you is that NO r
31 Alpha 1: Lephron, LOL-stick it where the sun don't shine, fella. Obviously, you think you're better than the rest of us, but I'm thinking just fine about this
32 Alpha 1: Oh, and Lephron, Israel IS indeed one of the known nuclear powers in the world. They first got nuclear weapons in the late 60's/early 70's. In fact, P
33 EWRvirgin: Emotion and Irrationality don't necessarily go hand in hand. As a matter of fact emotion is exactly what differentiates us from the terrorists.
34 VirginA340: N400X; Lephron is the same little anti US punk bastard who wondered why the FDNY/EMS and NYPD were called "heros" and wondered why should they deserve
35 Alpha 1: Oh, yeah, VirginA340, I forgot about that idiocy that Lephron tried to pull on here. He blamed the fireman/NYPD for costing lives after the attacks. Y
36 DELL_dude: "Let those who say that we must understand the reasons for terrorism come with me to the thousands of funerals we're having in New York City -- thousa
37 VirginA340: Alpha; Thats not the only thing. He then wrote a post with a not even close sincere apoligy after one of the users (now on my list) posted the names o
38 B757300: Hey Lehpron, since you hate the United States so much, I'll be more than happy to buy you a first class, one way ticket to any country and on the airl
39 VirginA340: No wonder why Lephy is having problems in his life (especially with girls) he pisses too many people off with the Rev Al Sharpton act Lephy; See a goo
40 VirginA340: Lephy; I meant to say See a good Psychiatrist and take some meds before you really dig yourself a hole that you can't get out of.
41 Scorpio: I see the same thing happening that we see every time someone criticizes the US in any way: That person's being called every dirty name in the book, w
42 Philly phlyer: Sorry Scorpio, but all is not emotion. The United States was attacked. It was not an act of terrorism. It was an act of war. It does not matter if it
43 Alpha 1: What amazes me about you Scorpio, is that for some reason, ANY American opinion doesn't count for anything. Last time I checked, human beings have emo
44 Scorpio: Alpha 1, You simply do not get, do you? I mean, I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall here! I have said over and over and over and OVER again that I
45 EWRvirgin: Scorpio, What do you mean the 'way' its being conducted? Should we go over there with a picnic basket and have a nice sit-down to talk things over? C'
46 Go Canada!: Right number one point-Scorpio , man you need to address that anti american feeling and look inside yourself and wonder what your purpose is..take the
47 Scorpio: EWRvirgin, No, I'm not saying you should go in there with a picnic basket and sing happy songs I'm just wondering if attacking an entire country full
48 VirginA340: Scorpio; What the hell have you done for your country? Why don't you get off your ass and make yourself useful because you are not serving a purpose.
49 Scorpio: VirginA340, That was yet another nice proof of what it was I was talking about. Let me break it to you ONCE MORE, in simple words: There is nothing wr
50 PanAm747: >>and that you want to see someone pay.
51 VirginA340: Hey pal; I'm voicing MY opinions as a New Yorker, an ex firefighter and an American. I can't understand your BS "make love not war" ranting at all I d
52 Scorpio: Yes, real men, we needed that one BTW, we have beer in Belgium, not that lame excuse for beer you call BUD Anyway, I'm going to stop arguing with you,
53 VirginA340: And I'm not talking to you because YOU don't deserve to hear from me and I don't drink BUD. Where did I say I drink that motor oil? I drink Becks. You
54 Wardialer: OK, How come were not NUKING them like we did to Hiroshima? I dont really get it. Does someone have an answer for me please? The US is really weak on
56 Alpha 1: Scorpio, why has it been necessary to go after the whole country? How about this: 1. Al Quaeda has camps all over Afghanistan. 2. The Taliban, rulers
57 Alpha 1: Wardialer, are you REALLY that dense, or is it a winter thing? 1. There's nothing there to nuke, really. It's mostly barren land and caves. Not someth
58 JetService: Wardialer, you mean you really don't know? We haven't shot a nuke at anyone for over 56 years. Why would we start now?
59 EWRvirgin: Call it what you want, Scorpio. Fact is the Taliban is no longer, OBL and Mullah Omar are on the run and we are pursuing them. Once this goal is accom
60 Alpha 1: You wanna know why some Americans don't care about world opinion? Because we're damned if we do and damned if we don't. We're either too isolationist
61 EWRvirgin: Wardialer, Please make me understand: You call the war on terror a mistake but it seems that you advocate the use of a nuclear weapon? On a sandlot th
62 B757300: Alright, once again I will remind people on this forum why we have gone to war.
63 Wardialer: Those photos to me are equal to a nuclear disaster!!! And the United States hesitates to use nukes????? People dont get it. 9-11 was almost equally eq
64 Ual747: Listen Wardialer........you must be a complete idiot. We are targeting the terrorist networks, and the Taliban, not the Afghan people. If we sent over
65 Ual747: And BTW, the world is not your stage for your own personal game of DOOM. There are real lives out there, people with children, families, people they l
66 B757300: @ this time, the use of nuclear weapons isn't justified. However, if even a dirty nuclear device is detonated in this country then we better respond w
67 Ual747: Unfortunately B757300, I highly doubt terrorism would be destroyed by following your plan. In fact, it would probably spur more terrorism. There is a
68 VirginA340: UAL747; I couldn't agree with you more on the issue.
69 VirginA340: For those that still need to be reminded on why this war must be fought go to http://attacked911.tripod.com/ or http://www.calpilot.com/worldtrade.swf
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