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Daimlerchrysler To Divide , Chrysler To Cerebrus  
User currently offlineLHStarAlliance From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 1689 times:

The Investor cerebrus just bought 80,1 % of Chrysler . for 5.5 Billion €



http://de.biz.yahoo.com/14052007/3/c...-uebernimmt-chrysler-mehrheit.html

http://www.forbes.com/topstories/hom...eds/afx/2007/05/14/afx3716242.html

Edit :english Link :

[Edited 2007-05-14 13:56:58]

32 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 1674 times:

Hmmm, maybe Mercedes now can get back its reputation for reliability?

User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 1656 times:

Note to the new owners of Chrysler: R&D in smaller, very fuel-efficient cars; dump the big gas-guzzlers. That's going to be the winning hand in this century.

Same for all the U.S. automakers.


User currently onlineFly-K From Germany, joined May 2000, 3148 posts, RR: 52
Reply 3, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 1656 times:
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Will FRA-DTW still need four daily flights (2 LH, 2 NW)?


Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
User currently offlineLHStarAlliance From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 1648 times:

Quoting Fly-K (Reply 3):
Will FRA-DTW still need four daily flights (2 LH, 2 NW)?

good question ! Maybe just 1 now ...


User currently offlineDtwclipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 1646 times:

Quoting Fly-K (Reply 3):
Will FRA-DTW still need four daily flights (2 LH, 2 NW)?

Yes. The sale of DCX and flights between two strong hubs are unrelated. DCX will most likely end it's own service from PTK to STR, but as the are retaining 18+% of Chrysler there will still be a lot of traffic between the two companies.


User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13010 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1611 times:

Cerebus is mainly buying Chrysler for it's financial divisions, not so much for it's vehicle production divisions. They own a good chunk of GMAC, which they bought from GM last year. Unless they find some way to get around the crippling costs of health care for retirees at Chrysler, then they will continue to be on a slow path to death. I just wish that Chrysler had never been owned by Mercedes-Daimer. The deal was largely a failure for them.

User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7758 posts, RR: 16
Reply 7, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1603 times:

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 1):
Hmmm, maybe Mercedes now can get back its reputation for reliability?

Mercedes-Benz's reputation for reliability was already eroding long before the merger in 1999. M-B could no longer operate under the quality at no cost model that they had used right up through the 80s, not when Toyota/Lexus could build high quality vehicles for less... but that isn't the point of this thread.


I am one among many that think that Daimler-Benz sucked the Chrysler Group dry, now kicking them to the curb when their stockpile of cash was used up and the groups profits dried up. Up until a year or two ago the Chrysler Group was profitable, and was responsible for keeping DCX profitable. A lot of product development was slowed or dumbed down as not to upstage their German masters. Far too much of the product in the Chrysler lineup was simply allowed to wither on the vine. Just look at how long some of the product cycles have been since the merger. The current minivans have been out since 2000, with a few major upgrades like Stow-n-go. And since then the major Asian competitors have easily bested once was the top dog in that segment. The replacement needed to come 2 years ago, not this fall.

If this deal is for real I wish the folks at Cerebus good luck, they'll need it. They need a firm hand with labor and they need to invest in the product. Pre-merger that was Chrysler's biggest weakness, they simply did not spend enough on R&D. Which ended up with generally attractive looking vehicles that were just under engineered. And a decade of crappy 4-speed automatic transmissions, peeling paint, and blown head gaskets create a bad rep.



Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineBAW2198 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 637 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1563 times:

I wonder how things would have looked if Chrysler had bought M-B? Wasn't that how this all began in the first place? Chrysler attempting to purchase M-B?

Quoting DesertJets (Reply 7):
And a decade of crappy 4-speed automatic transmissions, peeling paint, and blown head gaskets create a bad rep.

Chrysler had this problem long before Daimler entered talks. The intrepid engines (3.3 and the 2.7) were among the worst coming into years 1996-1998, among the problems were the headgaskets and valve train gremlins). The LHS's and new yorkers also had their woe's as well with the tranny's going out after only 45K. The neon's, I'm not even going to go there. My grandfather worked for Chrysler starting just before WW2 in the quality control dept, and before his passing in 1998, he would often discuss how cheap their products were getting, great design work and great concept models, but poor choices in materials and engineering.



"And remember, Keep your stick on the ice"--->Red Green
User currently offlineSJCRRPAX From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1536 times:

Is there anything left of Chysler? Didn't MB pretty much take over all the engineering and Chrysler was left with body styling? Looks to me like another great company has bitten the dust.

User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17286 posts, RR: 46
Reply 10, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1536 times:

Quoting LHStarAlliance (Thread starter):
The Investor cerebrus just bought 80,1 % of Chrysler . for 5.5 Billion €

What a deal!

"DaimlerChrysler’s $7.4 billion “sale” of Chrysler has a great looking headline number. But a parsing of the company’s own press release shows that this is anything but a sale.

In fact, the numbers show it’s an outright giveaway. It’s actually going to cost Daimler about $650 million to unload a business it spent $36 billion on about 9 years ago.
"
http://blogs.wsj.com/deals/



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineConcordeBoy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1496 times:

Quoting LHStarAlliance (Thread starter):
Cerebrus



Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 6):
Cerebus

...shouldn't that be Cerberus-- after the dog?

I noticed Fox, MSN, and several other sources all have different spellings.


User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39670 posts, RR: 75
Reply 12, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1488 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 2):
Note to the new owners of Chrysler: R&D in smaller, very fuel-efficient cars; dump the big gas-guzzlers.

Chrysler doesn't make any gas-guzzlers anymore and haven't done so since the 1978 New Yorker Brougham.
The HEMI powered Chrysler 300C gets just a few mpg less than a Honda Accord which has half the power of the 300C.
How come no one ever complains about the poor milage of the S-class and M-class Mercedes?
They get worse milage than the HEMI.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineN231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1474 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 12):

No offense, but the last time I looked, Chrysler's autos had the Lowest Mileage of the big three (believe it was an EPA report-I don't remember). And I guess when you think about it; the entire Jeep line is SUVs, Dodge has many trucks, a Van, and an SUV (a few cars though), and Chrysler has some SUVs, a Van, but no trucks.

I do hope some like Lee Iacocca come back, or someone like him, and revitalizes Chrystler.


User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39670 posts, RR: 75
Reply 14, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1471 times:

N231YE:
I am talking about cars.
Not SUVs, vans & trucks.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineN231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 2 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1469 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 14):

My bad...but I was still making the distinction that Chrysler produces many SUVs, Vans, and Trucks, but not as many cars. Thus why Chrysler has (had) the lowest overall EPA estimate averages of the Big Three.


User currently offlineCharles79 From Puerto Rico, joined Mar 2007, 1329 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (7 years 2 months 21 hours ago) and read 1424 times:

Funny, I did a presentation for my business class about weeks ago in which I predicted the sale of Chrysler by year's end...and Cerebrus was among the candidates. I echo some comments here, if Chrysler is to survive they need to focus more on small, fuel efficient cars, but keep them fun. The Euro brands have shown as of late that small and fun are not mutually exclusive (witness Mini, Golf/GTI, Megane, Clio, etc). I'm not a huge fan of American cars, but I've been pleasantly surprised with a couple of Chevy Cobalts I've rented recently that drove really well. If only we could do something about the retirement pensions and the health care costs...

Good news for Mercedes, not sure about the fate of the Chrysler workers. Hope they don't get canned soon.

Cheers

Charles


User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 31
Reply 17, posted (7 years 2 months 17 hours ago) and read 1396 times:

It's Cerberus, US Financial Investor!


I know it's only VfB but I like it!
User currently offlineLHStarAlliance From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (7 years 2 months 17 hours ago) and read 1391 times:

I just hope for the Chrysler Employees ! Not a good time for them ! I just heard on News how happy the Daimler employees are now , but they don´t even think/worry about their American colleagues , where is solidarity !?

Konstantin


User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 31
Reply 19, posted (7 years 2 months 16 hours ago) and read 1384 times:

Quoting LHStarAlliance (Reply 18):
but they don´t even think/worry about their American colleagues , where is solidarity !?

And what about the fact, that Chrysler was gobbling up billions of dollars, that management had to fork in at other places...like for example by firing people in Germany.

What about those little shareholders with a few shares that they bought as an investment for old age? Shares that went down, down, down....just because the Management made one mistake after the other?

Sorry...but you need to get the facts straight before babbling about solidarity! Everybody knows that it's going to be hard on the Chrysler employees....but they were quite buys dragging down others as well!



I know it's only VfB but I like it!
User currently offlineLHStarAlliance From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (7 years 2 months 16 hours ago) and read 1380 times:

Quoting Andreas (Reply 19):

Maybe try to search a investor which accepts to not fire employees , and so maybe paying some millions less ...

I know Daimler had to sell Chrysler , but every company has a charge of all their employees .

Konstantin


User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 31
Reply 21, posted (7 years 2 months 15 hours ago) and read 1369 times:

Quoting LHStarAlliance (Reply 20):

And who exactly would be crazy enough to buy Chrysler without a clue what to do with it.....see, Chrysler ist not exactly highly profitable, to put it mildly...and there are reasons why this is the case!!

You HAVE to cut costs if you don't sell enough cars to pay your employees (or sell at a reasonable price...not highly discounted).

Cerberus believe they can make it profitable again..ok, they have Wolfgang Bernhard who'll probably be CEO or chairman of the Board, and he knows a few things about cars...so let's wait and see.



I know it's only VfB but I like it!
User currently offlineLHStarAlliance From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (7 years 2 months 15 hours ago) and read 1367 times:

Quoting Andreas (Reply 21):

7% of costs of Daimler Chrysler were payments to Employees , I think some better cars , or look at the market would bring much more money to Chrysler .


User currently offlinePelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2531 posts, RR: 8
Reply 23, posted (7 years 2 months 15 hours ago) and read 1363 times:

Quoting DesertJets (Reply 7):

I am one among many that think that Daimler-Benz sucked the Chrysler Group dry, now kicking them to the curb when their stockpile of cash was used up and the groups profits dried up. Up until a year or two ago the Chrysler Group was profitable, and was responsible for keeping DCX profitable.

Well the figures don't support your claim. Until 2004 the Mercedes Car Group posted a constant operating profit around 3 billion Euros while Chrysler was already in 2001 in deep troubles but managed a turn around in 2004 while Mercedes profits started to decline in 2004. DCX had to focus on the Chrysler Group and neglected the Mercedes Car Group. Mercedes did not suck Chrysler dry. When Chrysler figures turned into a deep loss again in 2006 DCX had not the endurance anymore for a new restructuring of the Chrysler Group. Cerberus may have it.
in 1999 MCG 2,7 CG 5,2
in 2000 MCG ??? CG 0,5
in 2001 MCG 2,96 CG -2,18
in 2002 MCG 3,0 CG 1,32
in 2003 MCG 3,1 CG -0,56
in 2004 MCG 1,7 CG 1,4
in 2005 MCG -0,5 CG 1,5
in 2006 MCG 2,4 CG -1,18
in billion € operating profits excluding one time effects.

pelican


User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 31
Reply 24, posted (7 years 2 months 15 hours ago) and read 1357 times:

Quoting LHStarAlliance (Reply 22):
I think some better cars

Exactly!!



I know it's only VfB but I like it!
25 BAW2198 : So what was the downfall with dcx and chrysler other then the money issue. What caused sales to drop?
26 TSS : Your grandfather was exactly right; Chrysler was well down the great design/crappy execution road long before being bought by Daimler-Benz. The pre-b
27 SJCRRPAX : In the US, Toyota and Honda.
28 Superfly : I am puzzled why Chrysler is facing difficult times. They are selling like hotcakes! The 300C, Magnum, Chargers and even there small cars I see all ov
29 DesertJets : Agree on all counts, but that certainly wasn't something unique to Chrysler. You can easily argue that the LH and JA cars when they came out in the m
30 Post contains images Superfly : You have to be kidding?!?! Those cab-forward designs were awful looking! I liked the K-car variants much better (in terms if looks). I love the 300C,
31 Pelican : Well, they have too much capacity. They could produce much more than they actually sell. The Chrysler group has many, many cars in their inventory. T
32 Baw2198 : My folks had a 1994 LHS for about 3 years (gold key plus gimik) and I must say, that was a striking car back then and still is today when compared to
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