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Another Lost Freedom In Venezuela  
User currently offlineAndesSMF From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1583 times:

Venezuelans protest opposition TV channel closure

"Chavez has vowed not to renew RCTV's broadcast license when it expires on May 27. It will be replaced by a state channel showing programs that promote the values of Chavez's self-styled leftist revolution. He accuses RCTV's saucy soap operas of spreading immorality."

http://www.reuters.com/article/world...23370120070519?feedType=RSS&rpc=22

This is what is called loss of freedom and descent into dictatorship.

14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8705 posts, RR: 43
Reply 1, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1576 times:

Quoting AndesSMF (Thread starter):
Chavez has vowed not to renew RCTV's broadcast license when it expires on May 27.

Did every President of Venezuela have that power, or did el Máximo Líder "accept" it as a token of the trust of his people? I mean, that he uses the power is one bad thing. That he apparently has it in the first place is even worse.



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1560 times:

Unfortunately we can expect anything from Chavez [as we did or still does from Castro].

User currently offlineGalapagapop From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 910 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 1522 times:

I've got a friend who's family is in the US to escape Chavez (they are related to one of the large oil/gas vendors) and I heard about this a few weeks ago, there are more freedoms being taken away soon, many are in jive with Iranian/Islamic culture, just you wait, Chavez ain't done quie yet!

User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 1513 times:

Cue Cedars747 and appropriate Cheerleader Squad to tell us how this is normal, not unusual,and perfectly okay . . . afterall Chevez is such a benevolent and kind leader . . . no one should be concerned . . . he was duly elected by a majority of the people. . . .blah, blah, blah  vomit 

User currently offlineAcheron From Spain, joined Sep 2005, 1640 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 1493 times:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 1):
Did every President of Venezuela have that power

Always, since the 1930's more or less, where a law still in use states that the radioelectic spectrum belongs to the state and its up to the goverment to grant or remove licenses as they see fit, and it even clearly states that its up to the president to renew it or not. It was modified in 1987 to add expiration timeframes to said licenses because there was any. Said timeframe is of 20 years, starting in May 27th for the TV and radio stations existing back then.

Quoting AndesSMF (Thread starter):
This is what is called loss of freedom and descent into dictatorship.

Loving the manipulation of Reuters by saying that " He accuses RCTV's saucy soap operas of spreading immorality" are the only reasons.
It do you some good to read the background of the situation. In that pdf you'll find what articles and paragraphs that have been violated, as well as the history of TV and Radio in the country, among other stuff. Interesting read if you actually bother to be objective about it and get both sides of the story. But I doubt you will, anyway.
TV-Web.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.rnv.gov.ve/noticias/docs/libro_blanco_RCTV-Web.pdf
And this blog details some other things commited by the TV station that shows they are no saints as some people make it to be.
http://lubrio.blogspot.com/2007/05/v...es-laborales-la-libre-expresin.htm
Probably wasting my time with you here, though.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 4):
Cue Cedars747 and appropriate Cheerleader Squad to tell us how this is normal

Happened before, and was a complete shut down(complete locks and chains) more than a decade ago, and where were all this people that feel so opressed now back then?.
Or when in the so-called "democratic period"(as they call the period from 1958 unti Chavez), Romulo Bentancourt(1959-1964) the workshops called El Independiente(the independent) where newspapers called Tribuna Popular and other were printed were raided, and the newspapers Clarin, La Hora and La Critica are suspended along with El Imparcial, El Tiempo y El Dia. El Venezolano, one of the oldes newspapers of the country(several of Bolivar's proclaims were printed by it) was shut down.
All the newspapers had Official Censors.
Where we all these people that are so vehement about freedom of speech.

Raul Leoni(1964-1969) shuts down the newspaper called La Extra and suspends Venezuela Grafica because of an article about the Guerrillas at the time by Teodoro Petkoff(which now iowns a newspaper of his own, where photshoping of Chavez has been made such as replacing a flower in his hand with a handgun yet it still comes out). The headquarters of Ultimas Noticas, La Esfera and El Mundo were raided and the editor, Miguel Angel Capriles was thrown in jail. Due to continous presure, the newspapers La Hora, La Republica and La Verdad were shutdown and El Regional disappeared from the city of Valencia.

Rafael Caldera(1969-1974) seized an edition of the newspaper El Mundo and the magazine Punto Negro is consfiscated. The workshops of Critica and La Religion are raided. The Military Court issues an order of arrest against Miguel Angel Capriles(yes, a military court issue order on a civilian) who shelter's himself in Nicaragua's embassy and the departs for Panama and then Puerto Rico. Congress revokes his Parlamentary Inmunity. He returns and is put in jail for severals day but its released after dismissal of the trial. El Reventon is seized because of an article about the Military service and the life in the barracks. The editors of said newspaper, Carlos Ramirez, William Izarra, Enrique Rondon and Pablo Antillano were sent to trials but only William Izarra got an order of arrest but was freed a while after.

Should I go on?. That's just three presidents from the "democratic period" so there's plenty more.

So, where were al this people that are so worried about freedom of speech back then?. The Inter-american Press Association?. The US Goverment?. Some of you?.


Anyway, they will still be able to broadcast through cable and satellite TV if they want.


User currently offlineAndesSMF From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 1485 times:

Quoting Acheron (Reply 5):
So, where were al this people that are so worried about freedom of speech back then?.

Back then is back then, this is now. Just because you hear no opinion from some of us that weren't even born then, doesn't mean that we wouldn't oppose it then.

And before I and the rest here waste our time with you, why don't you come out and state your support for Chavez, instead of coming up with crap that happened decades ago to justify the current situation. Because regardless of what you say that they can still broadcast thru cable, can most Venezuelans' afford cable?


User currently offlineAcheron From Spain, joined Sep 2005, 1640 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 1466 times:

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 6):
Back then is back then, this is now. Just because you hear no opinion from some of us that weren't even born then, doesn't mean that we wouldn't oppose it then.



Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 6):
instead of coming up with crap that happened decades ago to justify the current situation.

It perfectly applies here. If those were democratic goverments according to people, then why Chavez is considered a dictator when his only move "against" freedom of speech if not renewing a license?.
And most of the people that were part of said goverments and periods are now leading the opposition and call themselves "democratic". Isn't that a bit hypocritical, specially when some of them are now defending the tv station they closed years ago?.

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 6):
And before I and the rest here waste our time with you, why don't you come out and state your support for Chavez, instead of coming up with crap that happened decades

Unwad your knickers, please, I made the "waste of time" comment with sarcasm, maybe I should have put an smilie next to it. As for it being crap, most of the people back then are the same that leads the opposition now.
Why don't you come out and state you hate Chavez just because you are a right winger?. Things aren't so simple, are they?.
And please, read the links.

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 6):
Because regardless of what you say that they can still broadcast thru cable, can most Venezuelans' afford cable?

Those that care about RCTV, yes, all of them can afford cable. Those that couldn't be bothered about all this, don't watch it, with or without license.


User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 8, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 1453 times:

I read today in the newspaper that the Venezuelan Supreme Court has rejected a request by RCTV for a court order to let them keep their licence, as it expires in 2021 and not in 2007.

Full Article: http://www.nacion.com/ln_ee/2007/mayo/19/mundo1101931.html (Spanish Only)

It wouldn't surprise me if the Supreme Court has judges who are either under the payroll of that vicious and homicidal bastard Chávez, or who are being threatened with their lives either by that vicious and homicidal bastard Chávez, or by his henchmen.

RCTV, don't stop the fight for your rights!


User currently offlineAcheron From Spain, joined Sep 2005, 1640 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 1439 times:

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 8):
I read today in the newspaper that the Venezuelan Supreme Court has rejected a request by RCTV for a court order to let them keep their licence

Because as stated, its not among their atributions to rule on telecomunications.

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 8):
as it expires in 2021 and not in 2007.

Claims by the directive board of the TV station, which they haven't been able to back up with any kind of evidence.

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 8):
It wouldn't surprise me if the Supreme Court has judges who are either under the payroll of that vicious and homicidal bastard Chávez, or who are being threatened with their lives either by that vicious and homicidal bastard Chávez, or by his henchmen.

Of course, that must be why the Court ruled that the Coup of 2002 wasn't really a coup but "vacio de poder"(whatever that means) and set free all the people involved.  cheeky 

Anyhow, goodnight thread.


User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 10, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 1426 times:

Quoting Acheron (Reply 9):
Because as stated, its not among their atributions to rule on telecomunications.

Maybe, but is the Supreme Court's obligation to rule anything that violates against the citizen's right for Freedom of Speech unconstitutional, which is part of their duties as guardians of the constitution. Hence, it WAS their obligation to rule on this case because it's about the constitutionality of a government mandate to prevent that a private TV station gets a renewal of its public broadcasting licence. And last I heard, I haven't heard of Chávez officially revoking the constitutional right of Freedom of Speech, thus making your beloved president and his henchmen guilty of acting unconstitutionally in this case. But since that hasn't happened, say officially farewell to Checks and Balances in Venezuelan politics, because Hugo has an illegal and absolutist rule over that country.

Quoting Acheron (Reply 9):
Of course, that must be why the Court ruled that the Coup of 2002 wasn't really a coup but "vacio de poder"(whatever that means) and set free all the people involved.

Whatever, say whatever the hell you want to say, but deep down, you know that Chávez is destroying your country and meddleling with internal and foreign affairs of other countries (basically violating the sovereignty of other countries with his meddling). Bottom line: if today's Supreme Court wasn't being coerced or bought by him, I'm sure they'd agree with me regarding the unconstitutionality of Chávez's act regarding RCTV.


User currently offlineAndesSMF From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 1412 times:

Quoting Acheron (Reply 7):
Unwad your knickers, please

Why should I?

Let me tell you how this bothers me and affects me now. My mom, who stil lives in Ecuador, has rented rooms to basically foreigners who come to Ecuador for business. These people come for a set period of time. She has been able to live well off this income.

The Chavez Jr. (Correa) gets elected in Ecuador, and this was scary enough for others to dry up foreign investment in Ecuador. So what happens? For the first time in 20 years, my mother cannot rent out all her 20 rooms. Fortunately, she has us to make up any difference.

And here you have Chavez, who's only claim to fame is being a country with sufficient oil reserves, and a oil price high enough to buy off enough votes with plenty of social programs.

Sure he has made life for the poorest of the poor more bearable. But he has not provided then nor the country with any real increase in production ability. If the price of oil were to go down significantly, Venezuela would be completely screwed, as they have little else to offer the rest of the wolrd now.


User currently offlineMia From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 872 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 1395 times:

It is good to know that in the US we are ALSO feeling the encroaching hand of censorship, yet nobody says a word. I disagree with the soap operas and I blame them for the dormancy of the people; but inactuality I support novelas because the more they are played the more I can take advantage of 'the pueblos' while they worry about the novela.

A Venzuela without novelas is a Venezuela that is more productive and more capable, and leads to the Venezuelan people being more aware and self conscious of themselves and their own reality.



"Like all great travelers, I have seen more than I remember, and remember more than I have seen."
User currently offlineLuisde8cd From Pitcairn Islands, joined Aug 2004, 2571 posts, RR: 31
Reply 13, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1337 times:

Quoting Acheron (Reply 5):
Should I go on?. That's just three presidents from the "democratic period" so there's plenty more.

Hmm let me see if I get it... you are trying to justify what Chavez is doing to RCTV with what the corrupt government from the 4th republic did? Way to go, I thought this new "5th republic" was free of all problems that surrounded the 4th....  sarcastic 

Quoting Acheron (Reply 7):
hen why Chavez is considered a dictator when his only move "against" freedom of speech if not renewing a license?.

Oh come on... Chavez has earned the "dictator" adjective for many many things. Media now has being undergoing an auto-censoring since the approval of the RESORTE law. Attacks to TV Reporters done by Pro-Chavez militias/supporters (also know as Circulos Bolivarianos). Muliti-million fines to newspapers for printing anti-Chavez cartoons, etc...

And that's only regarding freedom of speech? Shall I remind you of the Venezuelan-Apartheid where the citizens who signed the Referendum-Petition back in 2004 are treated as 2nd class citizens are discriminated upon?

Quoting Acheron (Reply 9):
Of course, that must be why the Court ruled that the Coup of 2002 wasn't really a coup but "vacio de poder"(whatever that means) and set free all the people involved.

And may I remind you that the new Supreme Court which is 100% pro-Chavez recently ruled that the 2002 decision was void? The Constitutional Court ruled that the "Sala Plena" ruling of 2002 was "inconstitutional". It's amazing to see that a sub-court inside the Supreme Court can overrule a previous decision by the highest court in the country. Democracy here in VEnezuela is a Joke....


You can now go back and watch VTV and "La Hojilla"....

Saludos desde Caracas,
Luis


User currently offlineBNE From Australia, joined Mar 2000, 3183 posts, RR: 12
Reply 14, posted (7 years 3 months 1 week 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 1216 times:

I am going to lock this thread so discussion can continue on a new thread.

Chavez To End Freedom Of Speach Starting Monday... (by KLM685 May 23 2007 in Non Aviation)



Why fly non stop when you can connect
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